So your telling me a win 94 that sold for 80 bucks back in the 50's is worth less than 80 bucks? Lots of firearms sell for much more than original retail whether because of demand or rarity. Look at the price thay people are paying for colt pythons... something is telling the original msrp was no where even close to the 2500 sellng prices these day's.
Sporterizing; NO return on investment
- Thread starter Lebel
- Start date
So your telling me a win 94 that sold for 80 bucks back in the 50's is worth less than 80 bucks? Lots of firearms sell for much more than original retail whether because of demand or rarity. Look at the price thay people are paying for colt pythons... something is telling the original msrp was no where even close to the 2500 sellng prices these day's.
I'm of two minds on the issue. I'll admit to being as disappointed as anybody on finding an old commercial Mauser, or English sporting gun thats been altered in some way. On the other hand, there's no point in crying over spilled milk about things that were done to a firearm possibly before any of us were even born. With the prices of all original Enfields or Mausers today, I don't think there are too many people out there that will buy one just cut it down into a sporter. But finding an already altered Mauser or Winchester gives you a guilt free of getting an action for a custom job.
I don't go on the milsurp forum much anymore because of the general holier-than-thou attitude towards altered rifles. Unless you're prepared to buy and "save" every one, you don't have the right to tell someone else what they can and can't do. It's their property. And where do you draw the line? Do you condemn Jack O'Connor for taking a brand new, all original Winchester M70 Featherweight and turning it over to that Bubba Al Beisen for a new stock and some metal work? Or do you condemn Holland & Holland for taking hundreds, and maybe thousands of military Mausers and converting them to .375's and Super .30's?
As far as preserving a piece of history, nothing lasts forever... not our lovely planet or even the universe itself will be here forever, so if altering a given firearm gives you more enjoyment while using it, then go ahead and have fun.
I don't go on the milsurp forum much anymore because of the general holier-than-thou attitude towards altered rifles. Unless you're prepared to buy and "save" every one, you don't have the right to tell someone else what they can and can't do. It's their property. And where do you draw the line? Do you condemn Jack O'Connor for taking a brand new, all original Winchester M70 Featherweight and turning it over to that Bubba Al Beisen for a new stock and some metal work? Or do you condemn Holland & Holland for taking hundreds, and maybe thousands of military Mausers and converting them to .375's and Super .30's?
As far as preserving a piece of history, nothing lasts forever... not our lovely planet or even the universe itself will be here forever, so if altering a given firearm gives you more enjoyment while using it, then go ahead and have fun.
There are a few exceptions, and none of the above cases you mention are them. Fools and collectors pay stupid prices for "rare" firearms. They're tools, and old tools aren't worth much.
Tdc
People are free to ask whatever they wish. If people stopped paying stupid prices for used gear they would stop asking stupid prices.
Tdc
Donny Fenn1
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- East Kootenays
Me too . I use my P-H every year ,as a matter of fact . I've taken my last four deer with mine . I'm a gun whore and will trade , buy , sell anything I own ........... except that one, it's getting buried with me .
Don't forget inflation! Most guns will take an initial hit on depreciation when new and hold their inflation-adjusted value. Supposing that used Model 94 was worth about 80% of its new retail price in 1958, that $64.00 would be the equivalent of $532.77 today, using the Bank of Canada inflation calculator: probably not too far out of line for a run-of-the-mill example.
Some guns have definitely appreciated in value beyond the rate of inflation. Hype has driven the prices of the Colt Pythons you mention to astronomical levels.
A good rule of thumb when it comes to quality used guns is that you can buy one and enjoy it and it will at least hold its value if you decide to sell one day.
To some extent, my inner gun snob is glad that the prices of milsurp guns have gone up, thus saving them for those who can appreciate them as they are and sparing them from those that would molest them into a crude hunting rifle. Unless your name is something like Griffin & Howe, just buy a hunting rifle if you want a hunting rifle.
While one is free to do as they please with their property, everyone else is just as free to critique it.
blasted_saber
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- A blue part of Ontario
Owner can do whatever he wants with his possession. I really dont care. Its not like stock Lee Enfields are exactly rare, and I doubt anyone is really bubba'ing them these days anywayss.
I'm newer in the realm of purchasing multiple guns and I don't understand why this topic of "don't touch it" is prevalent on this forum or the gun community. It's just a tool and it's meant to be used and enjoyed to the owner's will and liking. I think it's worse when I hear about people that have safe queens that they've never even fired. But the same old topic comes up on a pipe forum I'm on and also car forums. Personally, I prefer a 32 Ford highboy than the original body style. And when I look at some of my guns, I see different ways I's like them to look and function - so then it gets modified. Except my Parker Hale - that one stays just the way she is and always will. 
burnt_servo
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- right in the middle of b.c.
exactly
Long time ago, I wanted a hunting rifle and I found a Stock Jungle Carbine in excellent condition for quite cheap (as all SMLE's were back then) . I wanted a scope so I had it drilled and tapped. I also have had several sporter SMLE's over the years, and probably have one right now, too.
There is no real reason to sporterize the old military bolt actions anymore. There are plenty of inexpensive, easily scoped bolt action hunting rifles on the market right now. The Savage AXis, Ruger American etc fill the same role as the Sporter SMLE and Mauser rifles did back in the day.
There is no real reason to sporterize the old military bolt actions anymore. There are plenty of inexpensive, easily scoped bolt action hunting rifles on the market right now. The Savage AXis, Ruger American etc fill the same role as the Sporter SMLE and Mauser rifles did back in the day.
fingers284
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Alberta Cowboy Ranges
That's hitting the nail on the head. Back when I bought my first rifle, a 99 Savage in .284 Win, b/n for $125 (try buying that gun for that much today...LOL), I could of just went into the local hardware and picked a Lee Enfield out of the barrel full that was always just inside the door for about a dollar a pound, $19.00 with two "clips" and a box of shells. All were mismatched bolts/actions that usually had atrocious head space that needed to be addressed before shooting any once fired brass (head separation was inevitable with any re-loads) so most were re-barreled/re-chambered to a more modern wiz-bang cartridge instead of just re-headspacing. Custom gunsmithing became a thriving/viable business because of the returning millsurps.
Grock-co brings up a very good (and valid) point, way back when , when kids 14 and less could have access to guns, go hunting with the old man, does it really surprise anybody they were customizing , cutting down and "bubba-ing" Enfields that could be had for $5 each? How much thought did YOU give to the future when you were 12 or 14? Were you thinking of future generations, resale values, historical interest? Of course not!
Sadly, kids of this day and age can't be out bubba'ing their I-phones and X-boxes. . Not that I'd want them cutting up historical artifacts, but they really don't have the chance. It's the older guys that should know better today that are still cutting up old stuff that should be taken out behind the shed and given a whuppin' ....
