Springfield arms rifles
- Thread starter aduchesne
- Start date
- Location
- Southern ontario
Tuned m305 is the most economical
- Location
- Southern ontario
Tinkering? You fix the loose oprod guide and have the barrel reindexed and your golden
- Location
- Aaaaaadmontin AB
The Norc is a head scratcher for me. Bought one a few years ago with the idea of pimping it into a match gun. Quality issues seemed to be rampant - guys were getting fabulous shooters and bargains with some minor tweaks, and some were spending small fortunes in smithing and mods and ending up with mediocre rifles. There was hype and horror stories and I just didn't have the experience to tell which was what. My Norc was a piece of junk and would have needed lots of work.
I sold it and went down to see the boys at Prophet River in Lloyd. They gave me an M1A Loaded for a bit over $2000.00. I took it to the range, fired 9 shots to sight it in (could have done it with three, but I like the formality of 3 shot groups for sight in procedures). That gun has been firing 2~4" groups like clockwork ever since.
I LOVE the Springfield. It is worth every cent I paid for it.
I sold it and went down to see the boys at Prophet River in Lloyd. They gave me an M1A Loaded for a bit over $2000.00. I took it to the range, fired 9 shots to sight it in (could have done it with three, but I like the formality of 3 shot groups for sight in procedures). That gun has been firing 2~4" groups like clockwork ever since.
I LOVE the Springfield. It is worth every cent I paid for it.
I had a M305 by the time l got it to shoot to where I wanted it was more expensive than a M1A. I had to change op rod, trigger group, bolt, rear sight. I sold the rifle and the experience I gained was to wait and get the rifle for the purpose you want. If you just want to blast caps with fair accuracy the M305 is ok but if you want a rifle for accuracy with minimal work for tweaking the M1A will save you money and fustration in the long run, from my experience with both rifles.
I owned a Norinco m305 18.5" that was tweaked by "Mr Clinic". Everything worked correctly and safe on the rifle. The fit and finish wasn't the best but it would have made a great $500 rifle for dragging thru the bush. Scratches and dings….who cares.
It's sold now and I'm waiting for my SA SOCOM 16 to arrive…should be in my hands in the next few days
It's sold now and I'm waiting for my SA SOCOM 16 to arrive…should be in my hands in the next few days
BattleRife
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- of No Fixed Address
Unless your safety is nigh impossible to operate (like mine was).
Or your rear sight falls apart the first time you twist the elevation knob (like mine did).
Or you have to replace your flash supressor because it's developing a split (like I had to do).
I second the motion that anybody buying a M305 must be prepared to tinker.
Hi. What's your budget? An M1 Rifle is going to run you over a grand for just the rifle(clips might come with it), in decent condition. If you can find one in decent condition. A new Standard M1A runs about 2 grand. Epp's is listing a used one with a walnut stock, one 10 round mag and 3 20's, all pinned to 5, at $1995. BNIB they want $2298.
TacticalTeacher
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Georgian Bay, ON
Folks it's all about the journey. I started with REAL M14 rifles from Israel for $400 each and started my tweaking journey. They have been great to work on and make them shoot better. The problem with the Norc fun is their inconsistent quality. They need to be tweaked. They are a diamond in the rough just like the previous crop of USGI of M14 rifles. Except the previous crop of M14 rifles that are now prohibited all arrived with milspec parts.
It's been thirty years since my first M1A and a wonderful journey and I own an M1A. Many of you started about ten plus years ago and some of you have moved on with the Smith or LRB or SAI or JRA fun as the years went by. It's all a journey and here we have more newbies jumping into the journey.
I've been on this journey with many of you since I am up to fifty clinics across the country and all I can say is that all of you have learned so very much. What's not to like. Now we have more and more newbies seeking our wisdom. That's a great thing for our community of M14 tweakers. That's just great. Now many of us have bought higher end M14 type rifles. It's all good.
Jump into the learning journey!!! Does that sound like Mrs Frizzell in the Magic School bus?
It's the journey folks, not the destination!
Cheers, Barney.
It's been thirty years since my first M1A and a wonderful journey and I own an M1A. Many of you started about ten plus years ago and some of you have moved on with the Smith or LRB or SAI or JRA fun as the years went by. It's all a journey and here we have more newbies jumping into the journey.
I've been on this journey with many of you since I am up to fifty clinics across the country and all I can say is that all of you have learned so very much. What's not to like. Now we have more and more newbies seeking our wisdom. That's a great thing for our community of M14 tweakers. That's just great. Now many of us have bought higher end M14 type rifles. It's all good.
Jump into the learning journey!!! Does that sound like Mrs Frizzell in the Magic School bus?
It's the journey folks, not the destination!
Cheers, Barney.
if you're lucky.
if not, you're replacing pistons, cylinders, the bolt, metal liner in the stock, aftermarket mags may not fit, large tab mag release may not fit, aftermarket bolt release may not work or may not work with aftermarket mags, sights may need replacing, etc. etc...and you still may not get a great shooter.
I've bought 3 M305's now. I've enjoyed each one of them, but the last one was the one that required the least amount of tinkering (I think someone has already done it for me), and I may still need a new stock or stock liner. Don't get me wrong: aside from a few "argh!" moments, I really enjoy all three rifles. Barney has helped alot, as well as a couple visits to Casey at TacOrd in Newmarket, Ontario.
Like Barney says, "it's the journey" that's enjoyable with these. They are a lot of fun to tinker with...but you have to go into it with a tinker's mentality. If you just want a quality rifle that shoots well with little fuss, go straight for the Springfield, SEI, JRA or LRB M1A/M14's instead and save yourself the frustration. But you will pay more, that's for sure.
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- Location
- Aaaaaadmontin AB
Well another flip side to that is customer service.
With the Springfield you get that and more: IOM manuals, product bulletins, and even a signed cert from the factory armourer with the headspacing dimension.
I have heard that the guys making the Norcs didn't even know what headspacing was at one point and had shipped some truly dangerous guns out to customers. I will concede that was ages ago and by all accounts it hasn't been a problem recently...but as some have pointed out, the rear sights on the Norcs can be absolute junk. Mine wouldn't even hold a zero. Quality like that makes me nervous, especially if there is a .308 going off a few inches from my face.
I would really like to see one of our Alberta suppliers step up to the plate on this product and stand behind it. No offense to our M14 Clinic guys and their patrons...but wouldn't it be nice to be able to buy a properly set up Norc right off the dealer's shelf? Something that has been gone over by a reputable expert and PROPERLY set up?
With the Springfield you get that and more: IOM manuals, product bulletins, and even a signed cert from the factory armourer with the headspacing dimension.
I have heard that the guys making the Norcs didn't even know what headspacing was at one point and had shipped some truly dangerous guns out to customers. I will concede that was ages ago and by all accounts it hasn't been a problem recently...but as some have pointed out, the rear sights on the Norcs can be absolute junk. Mine wouldn't even hold a zero. Quality like that makes me nervous, especially if there is a .308 going off a few inches from my face.
I would really like to see one of our Alberta suppliers step up to the plate on this product and stand behind it. No offense to our M14 Clinic guys and their patrons...but wouldn't it be nice to be able to buy a properly set up Norc right off the dealer's shelf? Something that has been gone over by a reputable expert and PROPERLY set up?
$500 to $2000 is quite a spread! I have a 2007 M14S, I am one of the lucky ones I will admit, changed Op rod guide and spring, shimmed the gas cylinder and replaced the ugly mystery wood stock. I put on a M14.CA scope mount as I can't see crap anymore with regular sights! (the Norinco sight was .... cluncky and not even a properly drilled aperture. It shoots anywhere from under an inch very seldom to 2.5 inches quite often (scoped) depending on the ammo and the alignment of the stars that day. Over 2000 rounds with out a malfunction though. I do like this rifle!
I also have an M1A loaded that I bought expecting a much better rifle than the Norinco. I was right when it comes to accuracy, the medium weight barrel leaves the Norinco in the dust, .5, .9, 1.4 inch groups are very common but so are 2 inch groups a times..... I'm a lousy shot some days!
The M1A has about 1000 rounds through it and I have had some trigger issues and have recently noticed that the Op rod is hitting the reciever where it curves around the front of the reciever (out side of the stock, not on the face of the receiver where it is supposed to hit) at it's most rearward travel which will likely compromise the longevity of the Op rod as it hits on the curved area which will likely cause it to break there eventually. I emailed SA last week to see about warranty issues in Canada and will see how this goes. My point is.... Norinco if you get a good one great deal, SA if you get a good one great deal. I will wait to see how SA deals with Canadian warranty issues before I decide!
Almost forgot, both the Norinco and the SA needed to have the gas cylinder shimmed, replace stock, and replace the Op rod spring guide so no clear winner on the " tweaking" requirements.
Edit!! forgot to clarify.... I am indeed one of the lucky ones. I understand some of the Norincos have significant issues, if I had one of those this post would read quite differently and would likely be talking about how the reciever was being used for a new build! Of course I am thinking about a new barrel to improve accuracy and Tree line M14 has all the other parts I don't need but want to upgrade...crap, likely will end up costing as much as my SA anyway.
Rodney
I also have an M1A loaded that I bought expecting a much better rifle than the Norinco. I was right when it comes to accuracy, the medium weight barrel leaves the Norinco in the dust, .5, .9, 1.4 inch groups are very common but so are 2 inch groups a times..... I'm a lousy shot some days!
The M1A has about 1000 rounds through it and I have had some trigger issues and have recently noticed that the Op rod is hitting the reciever where it curves around the front of the reciever (out side of the stock, not on the face of the receiver where it is supposed to hit) at it's most rearward travel which will likely compromise the longevity of the Op rod as it hits on the curved area which will likely cause it to break there eventually. I emailed SA last week to see about warranty issues in Canada and will see how this goes. My point is.... Norinco if you get a good one great deal, SA if you get a good one great deal. I will wait to see how SA deals with Canadian warranty issues before I decide!
Almost forgot, both the Norinco and the SA needed to have the gas cylinder shimmed, replace stock, and replace the Op rod spring guide so no clear winner on the " tweaking" requirements.
Edit!! forgot to clarify.... I am indeed one of the lucky ones. I understand some of the Norincos have significant issues, if I had one of those this post would read quite differently and would likely be talking about how the reciever was being used for a new build! Of course I am thinking about a new barrel to improve accuracy and Tree line M14 has all the other parts I don't need but want to upgrade...crap, likely will end up costing as much as my SA anyway.
Rodney
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