Springfield M1a stnd vs loaded vs norc rcvr build

CJackson

CJackson

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I've read that the norinco reciever is better than the springfield reciever,with the Norinco being forged as opposed to cast for the springfield.
Is the M1a loaded worth the money or would it be best to build from the ground up on a Norc reciever? Looking for no more than 2 Moa. Im reading Springfield can be hit or miss (ah a pun!) Out of the box at up to 5moa! Thats unacceptable for a 2500$+ m1a

From my research thus far the Natioal Match doesn't handle a wide range of ammo very well. Is it too much to ask for 2moa out of a non National Match Springfield or Norinco build. Excuse my ignorance and any help is much appriciated, thanks
 
Either option will get you to your 2 moa. You can tune up a nork or buy a factory rifle. Tuning up the nork will require gathering parts and tinkering on your part.

If you are going to spend $2500 I'd go with an LRB arms made rifle hands down. Also look at JRA Rockolla M14 rifles. Either can be imported into Canada from the US
 
I agree with J996 and I'd add that while a great receiver will add to the long term value of the rifle, it won't be a deciding factor in terms of accuracy at 2 MOA (assuming that we discount a drastically out-of-spec receiver which can happen with higher frequency with Norcs).

2 MOA is fairly easily achieved with some tuning on a standard weight barrel. A National Match rifle (which comes with a medium barrel) or medium weight barrel on any receiver should allow somewhat better than 2 MOA, sometimes a lot better (+/- MOA). It seems to me that it's the precise fitment of all of the parts that matters the most in terms of consistent accuracy, especially at the highest levels. A great receiver makes this precise fitting of gas system, op. rod and stock much easier and more likely.

My $0.02...
 
There is a growing number of WELL put together Norcs getting around the inch mark with good loads.
As Pr589 says, it just has to be assembled precisely.
Given the number of pple doing the assembly on the kitchen table, it is not major faults, just lots of little ones that are easily remedied.
And of course, finding THE load for your gun.
For a Norc based build try and get hold of a pre 07 receiver, seemingly they are the cream of the cream.

If I just had to get rid of 2500 dollars, I would go for an LRB.
 
If you love tinkering and tweaking and building things yourself, tuning a Norc will bring you many hours of blissful cursing and can yield really good results. If you've got the budget for a Springfield NM and you want something that will be near to perfection right out of the box, get an LRB and be confident that you've got the best of the best.
 
I have been down both roads. Bought M1A Loaded and built up a quality USGI on Norc. Downside to the build is that it will always be valued as a Norc whereas a M1A will hold value. I've owed lots and lots of Norcs as well as two SAI's - Loaded and National Match (IMO SAI are really good rifles - you hear about the occasional bad one but they make and sell 300,000 per year so they do something right ) but as of today after spending many thousands on this type of rile, I have two M14-type rifles: a Norc dressed up a bit and in a nice USGI stock and a LRB M25 Medium Match.

Given the above it wont come as a surprise to read that my advice now is to first off get a Norc - play with it to see if you REALLY like the platform and then, if you can afford it, buy the VERY best M14 you can, one that uses a forged receiver and one that will hold its value: get yourself a LRB - expensive but undeniable quality. Import through IRG and never look back.
 
Old forged Poly Tech and Norinco receivers have worked best for me, and they not only held their value, they appreciated in value here in the states. Your Norc rifles are a much better value, and the receivers are closer to USGI spec than any Springer M1A. USGI, ChiCom & SEI parts fit Chinese receivers and function as they should. 2 MOA is rather easy, all of mine have SEI barrels & TRW bolts... 1 MOA or better. If you decide to go with something new & shiny, the bar-stock receiver from Smith Enterprise is said to be awesome, and LRB also makes a great receiver.

In recent years, I have sold off 3 of the 5 custom M14s SEI has built for me. All 3 sold for more than $3K each, and the two built on Norinco receivers each had fired about 2000 problem free rounds prior to my selling them. I am keeping the two pictured below, both of them are built on old heel stamped Poly Tech receivers... they also run like sewing machines.

Long-n-Short.JPG
 
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H20 Man nailed it
2 MOA requirement?? Easily accomplished by tuning up a norinco with the majority of it's stock parts. My advice is buy one,learn and understand it's behaviors and mechanics to see if you "really" like the platform before dumping big cash into LRB's, JRA's ect.
 
Thanks for the replies! Does anybody in Canada carry JRA Rockola or LRB rifles, or would i have to import it myself?
 
CJackson said:
Thanks for the replies! Does anybody in Canada carry JRA Rockola or LRB rifles, or would i have to import it myself?
Click to expand...

Wanstalls had some JRA but are out now. The very best bet is to import through Irunguns. You order direct from LRB who are awesome to deal with. LRB sends to IRG's US FFL who send it to IRG in Canada who send it to you.

I've never trashed a dealer before but I CANNOT recommend dealing with ARMTAC in Vancouver.
 
I really like the idea of a forged reciever and for 500$ even if just to keep the Norc reciever is a deal, I'm a tinker so thats all fun Stuff to me. How do the Springfield Armoury recievers stand up in the long run as compared to the forged Norc reciever? Also I see people recommending usgi parts, where are people getting these from, I also understand that people seem to replace alot of springfield standard parts withh usgi is there a big difference in quality? Thanks
 
I've been down a similar path as the OP. Now I have a m1a standard which won't lose value, and is a bit of a hunting rig. - I love it. Now I am looking I to an LRB m25 build. M14 platform is super sweet.
 
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Honestly there is waaaay too much made about the difference between cast and forged receivers. US military receivers were forged because that was cheaper back then. I've never heard of a cast receiver breaking and I've read a lot about this stuff. Let's say for arguments sake they are weaker and will fail at 500,000 rounds - that would still be a LOT of shooting.

In the US where USGI parts are more available extractors and such tend to be top of the list for replacement but I never did on my M1A's

While there is a lot of info on this forum the real M14 expertise is to be found on a specialised site: http://m14forum.com/
 
I have built a few M14 type rifles off of Norc receivers using USGI parts.............They were all great shooters, but going this route can get very pricey............As H2OMan has stated, the Norc receivers are closer to USGI spec then the S.A. receivers...........last comparison I saw had a Norc Receiver compared to a TRW receiver and the Norc was right on spec with the TRW......and those who know, know TRW parts are the holy grail of M14 parts....... ;)

But either way you go (Norc or S.A. M1A) they both require tweeking/tuning to realize their full potenial.......

My advice.......Look for a used Norc M305 on the EE forum and shoot it for a while to see if this is the platform for you........I see many shooters buy these rifles on a whim and sell them off when they realize they need to tune/work on them to get peak accuracy.......
 
Also, when you get into M14's, understand the rifle and it's limitatins. Getting them to be accurate, and even shoot sub moa, take a LOT of money.

From what I've read, the difference between a cast and forged receiver 400,000 and 450,000 rounds. Having a cast receiver is nice because it's closer to the original USGI M14. However in practice, if you can wear out a receiver, you can afford to buy another one.
 
Also consider the ammo. .308 is pricey unless its cheap Chinese/Russian bargain ammo...and you won't wanna put that cheap questionable stuff through a match grade barrel, for many reasons. You'll either be buying premium off the shelf, or rolling your own on a reloading press. Keep bullet weights beneath 170grains, or it'll do excess stress to the receiver.
 
Gobc said:
Also, when you get into M14's, understand the rifle and it's limitatins. Getting them to be accurate, and even shoot sub moa, take a LOT of money.

From what I've read, the difference between a cast and forged receiver 400,000 and 450,000 rounds. Having a cast receiver is nice because it's closer to the original USGI M14. However in practice, if you can wear out a receiver, you can afford to buy another one.
Click to expand...

Ya..... No offense my friend but I'd have to disagree with your entire post. :D
 
CJackson said:
How do the Springfield Armoury recievers stand up in the long run as compared to the forged Norc reciever?
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The best parts of my Springfield M1A where the receiver, and the barrel.
IMO, the barrel and receiver on a bone stock Norc are better than the M1A.
USGI parts that are in good condition are great, new SEI parts are awesome,
and I have also had excellent results with Chinese trigger groups upgraded with
SEI's MAX-PACK, and Chinese forged 1-piece op rods are normally excellent.

I've done the whole TRW part$ thing, and they are great, but I currently run a mix of
USGI, SEI, and Chinese parts... the rifles function the same - I can't tell a difference.

Quality parts assembled with care by an experienced M14 armorer that takes the time to
test fire the rifle for function & accuracy has made all the difference in the world for me.

Other forums/boards that are great sources of information are TEAM M14,
and EBR SOPMODS. Lee Emerson (Different) runs EBR SOPMODS now...
 
One of the things missing in Canada is that we have no equivalent to an Art Luppino or Ted Brown - there are lots of guys who have home-grown knowledge but none that I am aware of who are real M14 armourers/gunsmiths. So, with that in mind you have to be careful who you ask to build your rifle from your carefully-collected and expensive parts.
 
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