Squib load, brownish yellow powder?

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Caleb314

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So I was trying out my first reload( just got into it and not exactly sure of what I'm doing) and I shot 2 off but the third was a squib load and I noticed that most of the powder changed color. What could be causing this?
It's 7.62x54r loaded with 46gr surplus powder with hornady 123gr v-max if that helps.
 
What's the distance from your loaded OAL until that bullet engages the rifling? The reason I'm asking is that I've seen this in the 303 Brit with the same bullet and WC-735. Its cause was the combination of a short bullet and a long leade resulted in the bullet being "in limbo", neither in the cartridge neck, nor engaged in the rifling and this resulted in a rapid loss of pressure leading to hang-fires and squibs. The use of a heavier (longer) bullet corrected the problem.

Others will suggest bad powder, bad primers or too light a load.
 
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Andy said:
What's the distance from your loaded OAL until that bullet engages the rifling? The reason I'm asking is that I've seen this in the 303 Brit with the same bullet and WC-735. Its cause was the combination of a short bullet and a long leade resulted in the bullet being "in limbo", neither in the cartridge neck, nor engaged in the rifling and this resulted in a rapid loss of pressure leading to hang-fires and squibs. The use of a heavier (longer) bullet corrected the problem.

Others will suggest bad powder, bad primers or too light a load.
Click to expand...
My OAL is 2.78" but I'm unsure how far the rifling is. How would one check that?
 
i've had this happen with my 357mag and h110, and my 500 mag using h110. but unfortunately i'm not sure why it happened.
 
Had this happen with H4831 in 3006... Always happened in the VERY cold with a non-magnum primer (cci 200 iirc). I changed to magnum primers and never had the problem again.
Cheers.
 
A "squib load" consists of a bullet seated in a case with a primer seated but no powder in the case. When this round is fired, the primer generates just enough pressure to drive the bullet out of the case and into the lands of the rifling a short distance ( how far depends on the size of case, type of bullet and size/type of primer). If the case did in fact contain powder AND from the description of the powder used, I would be "suspect" of the powder..
 
Caleb314 said:
My OAL is 2.78" but I'm unsure how far the rifling is. How would one check that?
Click to expand...

Make up a dummy round (sized, unprimed cartridge with no powder) and seat one of these bullets so that it's just gripped by the neck - in this case the OAL will likely be around 3.100". Chamber the dummy round and close the bolt. If it closes with no resistance and the OAL did not change, your situation is as I described and could be the cause of your squib round.
 
I had this happen with a 7.62x54r the last time i was at the range. The culprit was lube inside the case.
 
phishroy said:
did the primer go off?
what is your reloading procedure? could be contamination of the powder from the sizing lube.
Click to expand...

The primer went off and barely lodge the bullet in the rifling. I may have slightly over lubed as I had a stuck case or two. I guess next time il throw the cases in the tumbler to clean it out after I size them.
Thanks for the help.
 
Std Primers arent hot enough to ignite the powder at that temperature. Consider the example of trying to get a fire going in the winter vs the summer. Even though the wood is dry, it takes much more paper and kindling to get the fire going in the winter because you need to add enough energy to get the wood to the ignition point (which doesnt change winter vs summer)

Switch to magnum primers if you are shooting larger cases in that cold of weather.
 
What appears to have, somewhat alluded to by various responders to your post, is that the powder was scorched but never fully ignited. The cause, in your case, appears to be a combination of a light bullet and a low end powder charge (coupled with the cold weather), that meant that the pressure never built up enough for proper ignition of the powder. You didn't say what the surplus powder was.
If you want to use that light bullet you probably need to increase your powder charge, or use a different powder. As suggested, a magnum primer might help, but if the powder weight and its normal burn rate is marginal, even the magnum primer is not a guarantee for reliable ignition.
 
1. It was very cold outside and you were not using magnum primers.
2. You were using a light weight bullet.
3. You did not state "WHAT" surplus powder.
4. Some 7.62x54r ammunition is loaded with bullets in the 190 to 200 weight class and would use slow burning powders.
5. You need to match the powder burning rate to your bullet weight.

Meaning you didn't use a magnum primer with possibly too slow of a burning powder with a light weight bullet.

Now for a little education, Remington ran our American Lake City Army Ammunition Plant from 1941 till 1985. Much of the ammunition loaded for the 7.62 and 5.56 at Lake City was loaded with Winchester ball powders and Remington primers. Remington primers are sometimes called "mini-flame throwers". The Remington primer below is "hotter" than "ANY" magnum type primer made.

Below the CCI Bench rest 2 primer

CCI_BR2_C16H_cropped_zpse5916a7f.jpg


Below, the Remington 9 1/2 standard primer ("mini-flame thrower")

Remington_9_5_348_Cropped_zpse259f3e8.jpg


So remember the military always uses a hotter spark plug to get things moving.

tf_zps65c6809c.jpg
 
Caleb314 said:
So I was trying out my first reload( just got into it and not exactly sure of what I'm doing) and I shot 2 off but the third was a squib load and I noticed that most of the powder changed color. What could be causing this?
It's 7.62x54r loaded with 46gr surplus powder with hornady 123gr v-max if that helps.
Click to expand...

THAT powder has all the classic signs of degradation. It very well MAY be dangerous to use. I would highly recommend trying new powder!
 
Caleb314 said:
The primer went off and barely lodge the bullet in the rifling. I may have slightly over lubed as I had a stuck case or two. I guess next time il throw the cases in the tumbler to clean it out after I size them.
Thanks for the help.
Click to expand...

I would recommend not to use your tumbler to remove lube from your brass.Two reasons, first,you can have a clump of lube and media mixed in your case and not know it.It can be a dud or a ticking time bomb(over pressure cause of lack of space)...Second.that lube has to go somewhere.....as you clean more and more cases with lube, your media will have more lube on it,the cases will start to be coated with lube where you do not want it(inside the case) so if you want to store ammo for a peroid of time you have a coating of oil in your cases that we all know is not very good for powder...

I wash in cloths soap and boiling water,stir and rinse....let air dry for a day or two.....then polish in clean media....TA..DA....ready to go!!!!


Just my ten cents worth!!
 
I have seen several different powders that did not "burn" correctly and the powder came out looking just like the picture. All were less than full case loads that were stored bullet down, this left an air gap between the charge and the primer. The result was the primer igniting, which moved the bullet into the rifling and there was insufficient pressure for the powder to "burn" completely. Just my .02...

Cheers
 
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