SSZZA4 and Gew/98k

Remembering

Remembering

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Alberta
These two rifles are both very good representations of their kind, but neither are completely original. I took a chance on both of them and bought without seeing great pictures, but sometimes you win, sometimes you loose. Both of them are very well done and could deceive most collectors so I wanted to post them publicly before I sell them so that at least there is an online history of them and it's harder for someone in the future to misrepresent them.

1: SSZZA4
These were built at SS Zentral Zeugamt depot #4. Most were built on bnz42 or 43 receivers, but a handful were built on others including some on blank armorer receivers. These are the most uncommon of the ss variations other than the SSZZA2 snipers. Most of the serials on these were acid etched, but these ones are electro penciled in a similar fashion except the floorplate which I'm certain is acid etched and original. SSZZA4 proof is double struck but absolutely original. Barrel is a neat Geco 0,2 armorer spare. Not sure when the receiver serial was applied, possibly a US import requirement?

















2: Gew/98K conversion
This one is dangerously well done. It had me fooled until an expert noted that JP Sauer didn't make spare 98k length barrels and the barrel code is bogus. I'm not sure what else may be bad, but the stock was shortened a long time ago.















 
It's a shame neither one of those turned out for you. Neat rifles even with the issues though.

The fake barrel code is something else. It's amazing how far these humpers will go. I never would have thought someone would fake a barrel code of all things.
 
I have my own thoughts, but can you highlight a little more what the issues are with the rifles? These are not versions normally seen and have non typical features to begin with.
 
Claven2 said:
I have my own thoughts, but can you highlight a little more what the issues are with the rifles? These are not versions normally seen and have non typical features to begin with.
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The issues with the sszza4 are broad. It looks like it was almost a full hump/restoration. I believe nothing is original to the barreled action other than the floorplate. It's a very accurate reproduction in the way that they electropencilled numbers to mimic how the ss depots used an acid etch. "C" stock is incorrect, but it and the bands have been renumbered to match. It looks very, very close to an original though.

The "Gew/98k" conversion is tricky. These do exist although quite rare (more rare than a ss Gew conversion) so it's hard to compare to good, known examples. The barrel was pointed out as bad and the bands are probably bad as well. "Other concerns" we're noted by an expert that I trust, but he didn't specify.

And yes JB, I wouldn't have ever thought a humper would go this far on a bc that isn't even exposed! I wish we had more opportunities up here to handle 98k's before we bought. Online can be brutal.
 
Well I have to admit, I've never seen a proper depot built SSZZA4 K98k in the flesh before. I had no ideal the numbers would have been an acid etch vs. electropencil. Even today, EP machines are rare - most people use rotary engraving tools to simulate SP marking, which is more of an electrical arc marking process. I wonder how old this hump is? It doesn't have a fresh look about it, but that can be faked too. The "7" stamp looks very convincing on the faked numbers. Most fakers have no access to a 1940's style serif 7 stamp.

On the Gew, the thing that jumped out to be was the "b" stamp under the serial on the barrel. The barrel serial also looks to have been over-struck over a different number (?). The 4 on the bolt root looks to have serif marks added after the fact with a separate tool, like a chisel.

It is a well done hump - I'll say that much. The faker had skills.

I like Gew98 conversion rifles - I wish more legit ones were obtainable.
 
Neat learning examples. Haha.

Acid etching is odd and very hard to guage. Like you said, we never see these things to get a good handle on them.

These are pitfalls that all SS gear.
 
Interestingly, over 1,000,000 people served in the waffen SS at any given point near the height of the war. In theory, about 1 in 10 k98k rifles should have been used by an SS man.

Where did they all go? Why are they so rare? It's odd.
 
Hitzy said:
What does the circle Z (or N) mean on the trigger housing? I see that on several of my '98 parts.
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It means the part was originally made by BRNO, probably for a VZ24. In a depot build, the source parts could come from almost anywhere - though this one appears to be a fake. But not because it has a BRNO trigger guard.
 
Claven2 said:
Most fakers have no access to a 1940's style serif 7 stamp.
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Just musing outloud, but it almost looks to me like a regular 7 with the downturn then added. It is not 'organic' looking at all, but rather looks like a small punch used to accent the 7 maybe. Then again, lots of stamps on Ebay from time to time.
 
Claven2 said:
Interestingly, over 1,000,000 people served in the waffen SS at any given point near the height of the war. In theory, about 1 in 10 k98k rifles should have been used by an SS man.

Where did they all go? Why are they so rare? It's odd.
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9/10 SS men were issued a standard rifle. These are all oddball guns. Made from G98, or in an SS depot to correct a shortage. Most of the time they just got regular k98k.
 
CanadianAR said:
9/10 SS men were issued a standard rifle. These are all oddball guns. Made from G98, or in an SS depot to correct a shortage. Most of the time they just got regular k98k.
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Bingo! This is evidenced by known legit examples of regular Wehrmacht marked rifles that have been through ss repair depots and are appropriately marked with a ss2 totenkopf on the barrel and stock wrist. These could've had major or minor repairs. These are mostly pre 1940 and their existence in the ss system is some proof of their use.
 
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