STA and STW
- Thread starter lackeyse
- Start date
From Layne Simpson:
My first store-bought deer rifle was a Marlin 336 in .35 Remington, and I liked the caliber so much that I eventually got around to hunting with rifles in .358 Winchester, .35 Whelen and .358 Norma Magnum. After using a rifle chambered for the latter cartridge on a moose hunt in Sweden, I decided to neck up the 8mm Remington case to .358 caliber and call it the .358 Shooting Times Alaskan. Kenny Jarrett built the first rifle in that chambering for Bob Nosler and I got the second one, a switch-barrel Model 700 with its other barrel in 7mm STW. A few months later I headed to Alaska, where I bumped off a brown bear with the 250-grain Nosler Partition loaded to 3,000 fps.
I introduced the .358 STA to the world in 1992. Unlike the .257 STW and 6.5 STW, which are nothing more than the 7mm STW case necked down with the original body taper and shoulder angle retained, the .358 STA is the 8mm Remington Magnum case necked up and fire-formed to minimum body taper and a 35-degree shoulder angle. Cases can also be formed by necking down and fire-forming the .416 Remington Magnum case. When both are loaded to maximum chamber pressure with 250-grain bullets, the .358 STA is about 200 fps faster than the .358 Norma Magnum. It pretty much duplicates the performance of the 1920s-vintage .350 Griffin & Howe Magnum and the .350 Super Magnum, which was introduced by Art Mashburn during the 1940s. All are on the full-length Holland & Holland belted case.
At that point I had no intention of adding additional members to this particular wildcat family, but letters from readers who requested cartridges of other calibers eventually caused me to introduce the .257 STW in 1998. Lex Webernick built the rifle, and I first used it and a handload with the Nosler 100-grain Ballistic Tip at 3,700 fps to take a nice Coues deer down in Old Mexico.
About a year later I came up with the 6.5 STW, not because it had received a great number of votes from readers but because I was quite interested in that particular bullet diameter. The first rifle in that chambering was built by the Canadian firm Prairie Gun Works, and the first game I took with it was a black bear on Vancouver Island. The handload I used pushed along the Nosler 140-grain Partition at close to 3,200 fps.
When both are loaded to the same chamber pressures and fired in barrels of the same length, I find the .257 STW to be about 200 fps faster with all bullet weights than the .257 Weatherby Magnum. I also find the 6.5 STW to be about 200 fps faster than the .264 Winchester Magnum. Whether that much gain in bullet speed is worth the effort is for the fellow who will be spending his own money for a new rifle to decide.
There's a good pic here of the cartridges:
http://www.rifleshootermag.com/ammunition/7mmstw_071207/index.html
My first store-bought deer rifle was a Marlin 336 in .35 Remington, and I liked the caliber so much that I eventually got around to hunting with rifles in .358 Winchester, .35 Whelen and .358 Norma Magnum. After using a rifle chambered for the latter cartridge on a moose hunt in Sweden, I decided to neck up the 8mm Remington case to .358 caliber and call it the .358 Shooting Times Alaskan. Kenny Jarrett built the first rifle in that chambering for Bob Nosler and I got the second one, a switch-barrel Model 700 with its other barrel in 7mm STW. A few months later I headed to Alaska, where I bumped off a brown bear with the 250-grain Nosler Partition loaded to 3,000 fps.
I introduced the .358 STA to the world in 1992. Unlike the .257 STW and 6.5 STW, which are nothing more than the 7mm STW case necked down with the original body taper and shoulder angle retained, the .358 STA is the 8mm Remington Magnum case necked up and fire-formed to minimum body taper and a 35-degree shoulder angle. Cases can also be formed by necking down and fire-forming the .416 Remington Magnum case. When both are loaded to maximum chamber pressure with 250-grain bullets, the .358 STA is about 200 fps faster than the .358 Norma Magnum. It pretty much duplicates the performance of the 1920s-vintage .350 Griffin & Howe Magnum and the .350 Super Magnum, which was introduced by Art Mashburn during the 1940s. All are on the full-length Holland & Holland belted case.
At that point I had no intention of adding additional members to this particular wildcat family, but letters from readers who requested cartridges of other calibers eventually caused me to introduce the .257 STW in 1998. Lex Webernick built the rifle, and I first used it and a handload with the Nosler 100-grain Ballistic Tip at 3,700 fps to take a nice Coues deer down in Old Mexico.
About a year later I came up with the 6.5 STW, not because it had received a great number of votes from readers but because I was quite interested in that particular bullet diameter. The first rifle in that chambering was built by the Canadian firm Prairie Gun Works, and the first game I took with it was a black bear on Vancouver Island. The handload I used pushed along the Nosler 140-grain Partition at close to 3,200 fps.
When both are loaded to the same chamber pressures and fired in barrels of the same length, I find the .257 STW to be about 200 fps faster with all bullet weights than the .257 Weatherby Magnum. I also find the 6.5 STW to be about 200 fps faster than the .264 Winchester Magnum. Whether that much gain in bullet speed is worth the effort is for the fellow who will be spending his own money for a new rifle to decide.
There's a good pic here of the cartridges:
http://www.rifleshootermag.com/ammunition/7mmstw_071207/index.html
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First off tHe STAs as mentioned are built on a H&H case as the 350 super Mashburn and teh G&H
The 350 STA is, pretty! a pretty good prescription for about anything you want to shoot with it.
A chum of mine runs one on a pre-64 70 action, and he almost matches my velocity with my 350 SMM.
We share almost identical load data, I would say they are as close to be called equal...
Both pushed the 225 Nosler into the 3200 Fps range with a snappy recoil and drew some attention to the tables with the magnaport barrels that cracked on each shot.
I like the STA a lot I like the ballistics I like the fact the 35 cals are making a comeback due to great bullet construction. The 375 H&H is a classic and not to take anything away from it, I would not doubt the STA can do any thing the big H&H can.
I think it was designed for the perfect application with the big brown things in mind.
The 350 STA is, pretty! a pretty good prescription for about anything you want to shoot with it.
A chum of mine runs one on a pre-64 70 action, and he almost matches my velocity with my 350 SMM.
We share almost identical load data, I would say they are as close to be called equal...
Both pushed the 225 Nosler into the 3200 Fps range with a snappy recoil and drew some attention to the tables with the magnaport barrels that cracked on each shot.
I like the STA a lot I like the ballistics I like the fact the 35 cals are making a comeback due to great bullet construction. The 375 H&H is a classic and not to take anything away from it, I would not doubt the STA can do any thing the big H&H can.
I think it was designed for the perfect application with the big brown things in mind.
nope, maybe next year
leveractionjunkie
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TB you wouldn't be firing factory rounds would you?!?!
Actually, I think the STW was called Shooting Times Westerner, rather than Western.
Ted
Dang, right you are....I stand corrected!
Well, if that's the only thing you ever need to be corrected on, you're a much better man than most of us.
Ted
Well, if that's the only thing you ever need to be corrected on, you're a much better man than most of us.
Ted
Oh, I'm sure there's more....seems a few on here have trouble admitting they learned something though......I always think it's a great day when I learn something....today was a great day!
Oh, I'm sure there's more....seems a few on here have trouble admitting they learned something though......I always think it's a great day when I learn something....today was a great day!
Yeah there's more. It wasn't the magazine that was responsible for the development of the cartridge. It was Layne Simpson himself, who named it after the magazine because they published the first article on his work...
You'd think by owning one, you'd know the origin of it...
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Yeah there's more. It wasn't the magazine that was responsible for the development of the cartridge. It was Layne Simpson himself, who named it after the magazine because they published the first article on his work...
You'd think by owning one, you'd know the origin of it...
How about I give you half marks on that one......Simpson was actually an editor with Shooting Times at the time the cartridge was named.
Don't forget Layne's other brainchild the STE (Shootin Times Easterner). I believe there was a 7mm and a 358. Don't quote me on the calibers.
I have always wanted a 358 STA for an elk rifle, but I don't really want to pack a 9lb rifle elk hunting....
Nothing says sit down and die like a 250gr Partition at 2950fps...
I have always wanted a 358 STA for an elk rifle, but I don't really want to pack a 9lb rifle elk hunting....
Nothing says sit down and die like a 250gr Partition at 2950fps...
