Starting in trap

1899 said:
I also found an interesting write up suggesting the Beretta 686 stock design is designed for "heads up" shooting style, hence the fairly vertical grip and sloping stock. Apparently many people find this uncomfortable. The same write up said the 425 is stronger than the 686, but that the 682 may be even better.
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How old was the article? I could see a claim the 682 would be stronger 20 years ago when it was built on a wider frame but today the 686 and the 682 frame and locking mechanisms are the same. Between the Beretta and Browning I don't think one is stronger than the other and I've owned both.

Personally I prefer the Beretta because they tend to fit me better and I like their handling dynamics more but there are many people who like the Brownings.

It seems that you can get a fairly basic Citori for about $500 less than a 686 Silver Pigeon. Unfortunately I have only been able to find 12g Citoris in town so I don't know how much trimmer a 20 would be. She is 5' 6" and the distance from the inside of her bent arm to the middle of her trigger finger is 13"
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The 20 gauge is slimmer but not that much shorter because the Browning's locking mechanism is located under the barrels. It seems to me the Berettas in 20 gauge are more compact than the comparable Brownings.

How physically strong is your wife? Having introduced several women into the shooting sports I've found gun weight is more of an issue than pure recoil. She might be better off with a 20 if she can't manage the heavier weight of the 12.

Browning and Beretta both make good guns but until she tries them you won't know for sure. Don't over think the decision but be prepared to change guns if it doesn't work out for her. There is always a good marked for used B guns.
 
As already mentioned, short of handling both brands, the decision making process may be difficult. Personally, I found the Beretta 686 has a slimmer profile compared to the Citori (based on personal inspection, only the 725 and the Cynergy models come quite close). All my range guns, 12 to 28ga, are 686 SP sporting models since Berettas fit me very well and the slim profile suits my grip due to somewhat smaller build (5' 9" South East Asian). The only Browning that I own is an older 20ga Citori Upland Special that fits me equally well because it has the almost same dimensions of a 20 Beretta.

The 686 stock design doesn't lend to "head up" shooting stance (at least for me) and the semi pistol grip isn't truly vertical and deep curved (an example of such specimen will actually be the new Ithaca M37).

The 686 SP 20ga is a favourite shotgun of mine and I own both in sporting and field models. I strongly recommend that you look for an opportunity for your wife to handle one .... the grip/fore end dimensions may suit her better. If memory serves, few days back, a member here was offering a BNIB 20ga 686 White Onyx with 26in bbls for $1700 I think ..... same shotgun, different cosmetics. I had owned the 686 WO field models in both 12 and 20 and those are no different from the SP other than the receiver/wood finish (WO wood is usually gloss).

Provided the gun fits, a 20ga field model will serve well for both upland and clay. Lastly, a SxS for Trap won't really be beneficial. I use a Beretta 626 Onyx (predecessor to the Silver Hawk) with mobile chokes. It works fine for Skeet and 5-Stand but suck obviously at Trap. :)
 
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Hi- another opinion here. IMHO I would get something small, semi-auto and cheap and leave the "heirloom" purchase for later. The main reasons are that it takes quite a few rounds for someone to start understanding what they like and what they want in a shotgun. It is possible that you can get a first gun perfect- but ask at the cub how many are shooting their first shogun they ever purchased... Get her fitted once she has a few thousand targets under her belt and she'll know better what she wants. A 20ga would be my choice for a smaller person. 7/8oz loads at moderate speeds are also the ticket.

It is true that some designs are stronger than others- but every action made and sold in recent history is more than strong enough to handle everything you will throw at it. There may be a difference for a 10K target a year shooter, but your wife won't be there- and if she does get that far into it, you'll be spending so much on targets and shells that a few grand on a nice shotgun is really noise in the equation.
 
cartwheel said:
Hi- another opinion here. IMHO I would get something small, semi-auto and cheap and leave the "heirloom" purchase for later. The main reasons are that it takes quite a few rounds for someone to start understanding what they like and what they want in a shotgun. It is possible that you can get a first gun perfect- but ask at the cub how many are shooting their first shogun they ever purchased... Get her fitted once she has a few thousand targets under her belt and she'll know better what she wants. A 20ga would be my choice for a smaller person. 7/8oz loads at moderate speeds are also the ticket.

It is true that some designs are stronger than others- but every action made and sold in recent history is more than strong enough to handle everything you will throw at it. There may be a difference for a 10K target a year shooter, but your wife won't be there- and if she does get that far into it, you'll be spending so much on targets and shells that a few grand on a nice shotgun is really noise in the equation.
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This route actually makes good sense. There are a variety of soft shooting semis at different price points available to choose from ....
 
wasrupzuk said:
I bought a Remington 1100 Competition Synthetic. After taxes it was well within your budget.
It has complete adjustability (well not the trigger), a recoil reducing butt stock and a bunch of chokes.
I've played with budget O/U's and somewhat aged quality O/U's and the same issues kept cropping up- they didn't fit.
Unless you know someone who does this it is an expensive PITA to get it done.
To buy a new Over Under with adjustability your talking some serious money- even a BT-99 Golden Clays is about 4 grand all in...
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I'm sorry I don't mean to be rude but why would you buy a $4000 bt 99 golden clay for a beginner when the micro Midas bt 99 could be had for just over a grand.
 
1899 said:
Yes, this is why I mentioned an "all-rounder". I just emailed Will Bilozir about an Ugartechea Model 40 he had listed at a very good price, but it was sold. I see that P&D have a Citori Micro Midas for only a little more than my upper price limit. And this is how the upwards creep starts. :)
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Considering the longevity of the gift, I say one or five hundred over your original cap is fine. Look how easy I spent your money.
 
The OP's opening statement kind of dictates the gauge choice right off the hop. He said his wife wants to start into trap and trap is not a 20ga. game. It may be alright for 16 yards or just an occasional hobby but as long as he is planning on laying out a decent amount of cash he might as well go for a gun hat can be used for all disciplines in trap and will be up to the task should she decide to take the game more seriously if she really enjoys it and decides down the road she'd like to participate in registered shoots. I can honestly say I have never witnessed any shooters, women, kids or men shooting sub gauge guns in trap except for the odd person trying a few shots from a new gun. Sub gauge shooters generally shoot skeet or sporting clays. Trap shooters generally shoot long barreled heavy 12 gauges. I have seen many women participating at trap events, leagues etc that were much shorter than 5'6" shooting big heavy 34" unsingles and combos. My personal feelings are that the average female shooter is best served with an auto cut down to her L.O.P with an adjustable comb installed and a 30" barrel with screw chokes. O/U's are nice but two barrels are double the effort to swing and point due to double the weight forward of the forend. Most shooters can point a single barrel with much less effort and ease and an auto is going to absorb alot more recoil.
 
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If its a dedicated Trap gun you're after and she is looking to try it but isn't 100% sure its for her, and still wants a gun meant for the game, I would try and get an SXP trap compact in her hands to see if she liked it. Not too costly, has a lot of popular features for trap and a wood stock so customizing it to fit her better will be simple. I am considering getting one and adding trap to the clay games I shoot this summer.
As far as 12 vs 20 with the light loads used for clays and grouse recoil is really minimal and if she has shooting experience the 12 gauge should be easy to manage. A properly fitted 12 gauge will be a slight advantage for clays and if the two of you ever felt the desire to chase waterfowl a 12 gauge is also a boon. The 20 gauge doesn't give up much though particularly if break clays and taking upland game is the goal but as has been said you don't see many shooters using them at a formal trap shoot.
If you're just after an all around gun that will work for trap then your options are vast and your budget seems ample. What are her requirements for the gun?

Heck with the SXP trap you'd have almost $1000 left over to make picking up a 20 gauge an option for chasing bunnies and grouse.
As far as the difference between a 20 and 12 Citori the examples I have held the 12 gauges felt a touch over weight for a dedicated upland gun but the 20's seemed nimble enough and well suited to the task. This is the Citori lightning, I can't speak to the various other models.
 
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I would suggest a well maintained 1100. I have 2 1100's i purchased in march and I've shot a variety of ammunition adding up to over 2000 rounds with no issues. I recently started shooting trap again with one and can consistently get 24s and 25s in singles, wobble and handicap. you don't need a fancy break action to shoot well. the semi-autos are also a way better option for a recoil sensitive shooter. my girlfriend loves shooting the 1100 and shoots over a hundred rounds in a few hours without any issues. also well within your price range. 1100's are reliable field guns as long as there maintained properly.
 
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