Starting to dislike my Hornady 8th edition

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g-manz35

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Helped buddy load up his first loads in a 7mm RM. 162 Hornady BTSP over H4831. The Hornady manual shows a max load of 59.7 gr. We just shot his max load of 59grs and it chronoed at 2650 :( The hodgdon site on the other hand lists the starting load at 60gr and maxing out at 64gr. I have noticed quite a few loads in the Hornady manual using Hodgdon powders are very poorly developed or showing significantly lower performance than other powder manufacturers. I have 5 different powders and only one isn't Hodgdons.

I think part of the problem is that they list loads for all the bullets in one weight catagory. GMX and SSTs should develop different pressures yet they are listed together. So what you get is a load catered to the lowest common denominator.

I'm starting to use the Hodgdon website more and more.

My Speers manual also seems fine.

Anyone else find this? George
 
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Not so much with 30 cal stuff, but with the big bores they stop the data at the bullets max working velocity, not the limit of how fast you can drive them.
I understand why they list data the way they do, but sometimes it is a bit frustrating.
Still, it is a pretty good guide, but sometimes there is a good bit of leeway.
You aren't likely to blow up your gun using their data, and I think they like it that way.
 
I think I could generalize and say most load manuals are conservative and some others ever more so. Hodgdon is a great resource, book load data has got me thinking about purchasing QuickLoad to do some theorectical powder load combination that are not in the book. For example Barnes manual 168tsx no h4350 powder listed for the 300wsm. However everywhere you search on the web most people recommend the H4350 as the most accurate for this bullet go figure.
 
Hornady is definitely more conservative in their manual than some others but I also find them more realistic with their velocities than most.

SST and GMX can be loaded identical with virtually identical results......I doubt there is a significant if any pressure difference. The GMX was designed to be interchangeable with the SST.
 
I've noticed that some of Hornady's loads are a bit milder than Hodgdon's, sometimes the other way around.... The specific bullet used can make a difference, often by a variation in the bearing length. A bullet with a blunter ogive will have a longer bearing length (presumiing the boat-tail profile is the same).

Also Hornady's method of publishing data (similar to the format in Sierra's manuals by the looks l=of things) appears to be different than Hodgdon's (and Lyman's). Hornady runs a bunch of tests, determines powder charge / muzzle velocity combinations, and presents teh data by muzzle velocity. Like they mentioned somewhere early on in the manual, some cartridge / powder combinations don't go all teh way to the right because the powder charge to get to the next column in the chart would be over maximum....

Lyman and Hodgdon appear to publish starting and maximum load powder charge / muzzle velocity combinations instead.... I have noticed a couple of instances where a load I've put together is over Hornady's maximum charge, but not hodgdon's / Lyman's maximum. BTW, it also worked quite well in my rifle.

A variation in other components (brass, primers, powder lot) as well as a different test gun will generate varying results. The bottom line, is you determine what is safe and suitable in your gun for your needs.
Stan
 
I'm still using Volume 2 (1973 edition) and it's no slouch. . Some seem a bit light when compared to Speer (1980) but then the same for Speer . . So I use all four of my manuals, Hornady, Speer, Nosler and Lyman. . . Between the four I usually can figure it out.
 
Rod said:
I'm still using Volume 2 (1973 edition) and it's no slouch. . Some seem a bit light when compared to Speer (1980) but then the same for Speer . . So I use all four of my manuals, Hornady, Speer, Nosler and Lyman. . . Between the four I usually can figure it out.
Click to expand...

I have a Speer manual from 1965, most max loads in this book in most calibers would be considered dangerous by 2013 standards. FS
 
Rod said:
I'm still using Volume 2 (1973 edition) and it's no slouch. . Some seem a bit light when compared to Speer (1980) but then the same for Speer . . So I use all four of my manuals, Hornady, Speer, Nosler and Lyman. . . Between the four I usually can figure it out.
Click to expand...

This is the ticket. Use several manuals, inluding an older one if you can find one. When considering a new load I'll look at my Hornady book, Sierra book as well as Nosler and Hodgdon online info. Between the four you should have a pretty good estimate.

My biggest beef with hodgdon info is they don't state the barrel length their loads were worked up in.
 
Speer # 14 has starting weight at 55g and max at 59g while Hodgon has starting weight 60g and max at 60 g when using Varget to load 130 g bullets for 300 wsm. That is huge. Can the difference in primers make up for the difference in loads? Speer's is large rifle primers and Hodgon is magnum large rifle.
 
g-manz35 said:
Helped buddy load up his first loads in a 7mm RM. 162 Hornady BTSP over H4831. The Hornady manual shows a max load of 59.7 gr. We just shot his max load of 59grs and it chronoed at 2650 :( The hodgdon site on the other hand lists the starting load at 60gr and maxing out at 64gr. I have noticed quite a few loads in the Hornady manual using Hodgdon powders are very poorly developed or showing significantly lower performance than other powder manufacturers. I have 5 different powders and only one isn't Hodgdons.

I think part of the problem is that they list loads for all the bullets in one weight catagory. GMX and SSTs should develop different pressures yet they are listed together. So what you get is a load catered to the lowest common denominator.

I'm starting to use the Hodgdon website more and more.

My Speers manual also seems fine.

Anyone else find this? George
Click to expand...

Hornady is the most lawyerized manual I own by far.

Their maximum loads are often shamefully low.

Their .375 RUM, 300 grain loads, for example, max out at a full 15 grains less powder than other manuals!

They also seem to group performances of cartridges together and now show no real world differenced between them. What I mean to say is, they will have 2-3 cartridges performing exactly the same, despite a significant case capacity difference, and the fact that experienced reloaders have known for years that there is a real-world difference between some of these cartridges. But for some reason, Hornady just lumps them all together in terms of max performance.

I bought it as I was hoping to get load info for VMAX's and SST's, but I found the manual to be very much just a "starting point" for real loads.
 
I rely a lot on Hodgdon, but also own Speer, Sierra & Nosler Manuals.
Also consult a lot with a buddies old (c. 1966/67 ) Speer Manual when
looking at loads that use H4831 (the "H" wasn't even necesssary back then ! )
Wish they still made H570, H870, and 5010 !
 
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