Well, mine isn't. Manufacturing in North America would have to cease completely for that to happen, so I'll continue to buy what I want and pay more for stuff made here.
Sterling Arms R18 MK3
- Thread starter Horilka
- Start date
Never say never but it's good that at least some people continue to do well in this country these days. The only locally made rifle that's worth its price is ATRS but they are out of semi-auto business for obvious reasons.
They'd really need to outlaw manufacturing, and at that point, I'd probably do it even harder.
I mean everyone still uses their ATMS and the county hasnt burned down yet, Im starting to think the OIC may be useless guys....And its still taking yotes out on the acreage
In ideal world, I would only use and eat local products that would cycle the money to other people and make synergy to boost local economy. But that's impossible since I don't want to live like a caveman- I am living in the age of globalism. My phone is made with Chinese parts, I'm wearing shirts made in Sri Lanka, eating fruits grown in South Africa, shooting guns made in Germany, France, Ontario, Turkiye, so on.
You will consume and pay some money to foreign country unless you're only using U.S. berry compliant products(if you want to consider U.S. your own). Even Leupold is no longer 100% U.S. made, binoculars are outsourced from Japan or China, some of Leupold scopes have Japanese lens. That's what Invisible Hand does. That's capitalism. It's not perfect, but that's what got cheaper stuffs good, good stuffs cheap.
Good example is comparing Girsan MC312 and Weatherby Element. If you have a chance to compare those two side-by-side, give it a look. Both made in Turkiye. Same action, same barrel, same controls(different shaped safety button though!), but ~$499 vs ~$999. My sub $300 Turknelli has shot about 300 buckshot/slugs so far and zero malfunction even when I'm doing rapid fire back to back. That being said, I do want a Beretta A300 because it's nicer but last time I checked it was $1600 for what I want... Meanwhile my Turknelli shoots when I want it to shoot, and don't when I don't want to.
Will buying Girsan, Norinco, and (heaven forbid) new R18 Mk.3 benefit the enemy? Probably. But if I'm shooting the enemy with them, I'd say I'm not benefitting the enemy and I get to save $600 so I can buy more ammo for stockpiling and training. Ally today might stab me in the back tomorrow, enemy today may be friend tomorrow. In this day and age, there's nothing pure, sadly. You know what's good thing with R18 Mk.3 though? There's still Canadian parts made by Canadians, QC'd by Canadians, and sold by Canadians.
You will consume and pay some money to foreign country unless you're only using U.S. berry compliant products(if you want to consider U.S. your own). Even Leupold is no longer 100% U.S. made, binoculars are outsourced from Japan or China, some of Leupold scopes have Japanese lens. That's what Invisible Hand does. That's capitalism. It's not perfect, but that's what got cheaper stuffs good, good stuffs cheap.
Good example is comparing Girsan MC312 and Weatherby Element. If you have a chance to compare those two side-by-side, give it a look. Both made in Turkiye. Same action, same barrel, same controls(different shaped safety button though!), but ~$499 vs ~$999. My sub $300 Turknelli has shot about 300 buckshot/slugs so far and zero malfunction even when I'm doing rapid fire back to back. That being said, I do want a Beretta A300 because it's nicer but last time I checked it was $1600 for what I want... Meanwhile my Turknelli shoots when I want it to shoot, and don't when I don't want to.
Will buying Girsan, Norinco, and (heaven forbid) new R18 Mk.3 benefit the enemy? Probably. But if I'm shooting the enemy with them, I'd say I'm not benefitting the enemy and I get to save $600 so I can buy more ammo for stockpiling and training. Ally today might stab me in the back tomorrow, enemy today may be friend tomorrow. In this day and age, there's nothing pure, sadly. You know what's good thing with R18 Mk.3 though? There's still Canadian parts made by Canadians, QC'd by Canadians, and sold by Canadians.
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Sir, did you inspect a MK2? I’m very proud of that rifle and it has performed very well in the wild.
However, it was a very expensive rifle to produce and to continue production was going to cost even more. While I think it’s a nice rifle, it’s not $3200 nice.
We get about 80% of this rifle from overseas manufacturing and the rest from Canadian… this number is subjective because it’s a judgement call.
Once we get all of the parts, and QC them separately, we can then assemble, test and package.
Our goal was to get a solid “black rifle” platform in Canadian hands for under $2k and we’ve done that.
The concern that we got and shipped faulty rifles from Turkey is not fair or accurate.
We identified that the bolt was out of spec immediately and quarantined them. We are waiting for new ones and once we get them and are happy, we will commence with our testing.
I can’t wait to give you all an update as things progress.
In other words, there is no solution - at least not one palatable to the average Canadian voter....
84wh1
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Ive examined a Mk2 before yes. And I dont place it in the same category as the other 1500$ 180 variants. As we all know, the MK2 is expensive however. And like a lot of people, there is always hesitation with spending CZ, HK, IWI kind of money on something that doesnt have the tried and true backing that those companies do.
I am very much looking forward to the MK3 being released and dont care whatsoever that its manufactured "off shore" to save money. In fact I think thats a brilliant decision. So long as the rifle runs well and the warranty support (should one need it) is responsive, ill be in!
Learned helplessness.
Interesting conversation.
I worked public service for almost a decade, and in a semi-manufacturing role for about 3 years, then the trades / utility services for awhile... so my life experience is kind of weird I guess. But I always wondered how much "administrative bloat" (which includes the increasingly large pay gap between the actual workers of an organization and the admin / executives / owners) caused a rise in prices versus actually paying the "working man" a "living wage".
I saw this image many years ago, but it always stuck with me:
I would argue that I've lived through this (though we probably all have if we've ever worked in a growing/changing organization for more than a few years, regardless if we noticed it or not), and it can apply to basically any organization you can think of - your job, your government, your favourite gun manufacturer, your local gun retailer, your local church group, etc.
It can also be interesting to think about the concept of how multiple organizations working through this cycle interact with each other and how that affects your life / your ability to purchase firearms (e.g. your new favourite gun manufacturer might be in the "Launch" phase, while your local gun/ammo retailer is at a "Maturity" phase, and your employer is going through a "Bloat" phase; all while your Liberal-led government has skipped over "Budget Cuts" in favour of the "Failure/Implosion" phase... lol).
Cheers,
-Variable
I had issues with my Mk2 but if nothing else the warranty was quick. Mike (I think that was his name) was always Johnny on the spot getting everything set up and out the door in normally under a week.
Having a great warranty service is awesome but it's a shame I had to use it so much.
I don't honestly think that you are going to experience the same teething pains with the Mk3 as you did with its predecessor. There are 2 primary reasons for this - Proven Design and Pre-Production Testing.
The Mk2 which was a re-imagined derivative of the AR180B, fitted with an adjustable gas system which many newer owners did not understand. This directly led to many reliability issues. There were other problems from trying thing for the first time. The initially weak epoxy securing the Charging Handle magnet was just one case in point. The Mk3 on the other hand, is simplicity itself. The self-regulating Gas System is the proven HK 416 and G36 design. It requires no user adjustment, just routine cleaning. The Bolt Carrier Assembly is taken almost directly from the well-proven SIG MCX and removes from the rifle as a captive single assembly.
SAI will depart from the typical Canadian rifle development path and conduct extensive pre-production testing of the Mk3. Not just 5K rounds, but 10K through multiple examples of the rifle in order to identify any early wear/failure issues and their remedies. I have been promised at least 1K rounds for Part 2 of my own Review and have already enlisted young(er), local CGNer "Iceman106" to assist with the shooting, which can become a chore, 5 rounds at a time!
Given the above, I thoroughly believe that most, if not all, of the bugs will have been addressed with the Mk3 before the first sale is ever rung up. You should have a much more satisfying ownership experience without having to get to know the Warranty Manager on a first-name basis!
I honestly do hope it does work out, I like to ####post and poke fun at the end of the day it would be nice to see reliable beater rifles back on the market here.
I wont be a beta tester and will wait to see some high round count reviews this time around but its on my watch list for sure.
PinaKaleada
CGN Regular
- Location
- South of most
Be sure to let us know if the firing pin, extractors, can pins are proprietary or AR15 compatible!
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The R18 Mk3 Bolt is proprietary, as is the Firing Pin (due to the Firing Pin Safety), and I believe the Cam Pin (longer and stainless). The Extractor appears to be standard AR15, albeit hardened Stainless. The Ejector and Spring are standard based on appearance. JR Cox will have to confirm those details.
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PinaKaleada
CGN Regular
- Location
- South of most
If I can influence the design at all I’d gladly pay premium for:
1.) Delete the side charging and just use AR15 charging handle. Also reinforce the charging handle latch with steel roll pin like the MCX
2.) Reinforce the cam pin/receiver interface with steel insert on the left side like the MCX
3.) Have the barrel nut spec/height of the flat top be same as HK416. Who wouldn’t want a Geissele HK416 for handguard?
Hopefully a mk3.5 change
And just for fun, how about a name change: MC416X
For the 308 version if they can make it like the Sig Spear, plus 1-1.5Moa, there’s nothing stopping it from being the best black rifle on the Canadian market.
1.) Delete the side charging and just use AR15 charging handle. Also reinforce the charging handle latch with steel roll pin like the MCX
2.) Reinforce the cam pin/receiver interface with steel insert on the left side like the MCX
3.) Have the barrel nut spec/height of the flat top be same as HK416. Who wouldn’t want a Geissele HK416 for handguard?
Hopefully a mk3.5 change
And just for fun, how about a name change: MC416X
For the 308 version if they can make it like the Sig Spear, plus 1-1.5Moa, there’s nothing stopping it from being the best black rifle on the Canadian market.
Attachments
PinaKaleada
CGN Regular
- Location
- South of most
Interesting. The mentioned changes above are all within the upper though, building ontop of the current design.
