I thought I would put up an e-mail trail from the CFC when I was receiving my antique letter for an antique firearm from them. When I was first on the phone with them they were treating an antique firearm as if it was a restricted firearm. I deal with another branch of the Federal government for work who I do not mind correcting when they make an error in the regulations. I thought I would question what I was being told when I know it was incorrect. In the end the person from the CFC agreed that they were not correct.
________________________________________
Hi Chandra,
Thank you for your help in determining the correct regulations to follow for the Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals for Antique Firearms. Now that I know the correct regulation, I will ensure my Antique Firearms are maintained following section 14 of the regulation for Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals.
Regards,
Keith
________________________________________
From: Chandra Philippe [mailto:Chandra.Philippe@rcmp-grc.gc.ca]
Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 4:01 PM
To: Keith
Subject: RE: Antique Letter
Good day Keith,
Further to my previous correspondence, the firearm regulations for Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals, section 14 "Antique Firearms" is correct and up to date, and should be followed as such.
I apologize for my late response. I had to review the regulations with a senior analyst before replying to your message.
Regards,
Chandra
>>> "Keith" 2011-04-14 15:59 >>>
Hi Chandra,
Thank you for your help so far so I can understand the correct way for the storage and transportation of antique firearms. I do still require further clarification as I seem to receive different answers on the storage and transportation of antique firearms from your website and different personnel. When I open the link you sent below I do not see where in the regulation it requires an antique handgun to be treated as a restricted firearm. The regulations are broken down on the link as I have copied below and can be used to go the web pages.
1. Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals Regulations
2. 1 - INTERPRETATION
3. 2 - APPLICATION
4. 5 - STORAGE OF NON-RESTRICTED FIREARMS
5. 6 - STORAGE OF RESTRICTED FIREARMS
6. 7 - STORAGE OF PROHIBITED FIREARMS
7. 8 - DISPLAY OF NON-RESTRICTED FIREARMS
8. 9 - DISPLAY OF RESTRICTED FIREARMS AND PROHIBITED FIREARMS
9. 10 - TRANSPORTATION OF NON-RESTRICTED FIREARMS
10. 11 - TRANSPORTATION OF RESTRICTED FIREARMS
11. 12 - TRANSPORTATION OF PROHIBITED FIREARMS
12. 13 - TRANSPORTATION OF REPLICA FIREARMS
13. 14 - ANTIQUE FIREARMS
14. 15 - HANDLING OF FIREARMS
15. 16 - SHIPPING BY POST
16. 17 - OFFENCE
17. 18 - COMING INTO FORCE
Section 2 part 5 states “Sections 5 to 13 do not apply to antique firearms.” Sections 6 and 11 describe the regulations for the storage and transportation of restricted firearms. According to section 2 part 5, these regulations do not apply to antique firearms. Section 14 of the regulation is the only section that I see which describes the regulations for the storage and transportation of antique firearms. Section 14 is similar to what is written on the fact sheet on the RCMP website (http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/fs-fd/antique-historique-eng.htm) concerning antique firearms.
I have copied the Safety Regulations from the website and section 14 from the regulation below. Could you please clarify if the Safety Regulations from the RCMP website and section 14 from the regulation are correct or am I looking at documents that might be outdated or incorrect? When I read them they require that antique firearms must be stored, displayed and transported unloaded, correct? Also antique handguns must be locked in a heavy-duty, non-see-through container that cannot be easily broken open during transportation but not rendered inoperable by means of a secure locking device, correct?
Safety Regulations
Under the Firearms Act, antique firearms must be stored, displayed and transported unloaded.
If you are transporting your antique firearms and need to leave them unattended*, leave them in your vehicle’s locked trunk or similar compartment. If your vehicle does not have a trunk or compartment, lock the vehicle and leave the antique firearms inside and out of sight.
Antique handguns must be locked in a heavy-duty, non-see-through container that cannot be easily broken open during transportation.
ANTIQUE FIREARMS
14. (1) An individual may store, display or transport an antique firearm only if it is unloaded.
(2) An individual may transport an antique firearm in an unattended vehicle only if
(a) when the vehicle is equipped with a trunk or similar compartment that can be securely locked, the antique firearm is in that trunk or compartment and the trunk or compartment is securely locked; and
(b) when the vehicle is not equipped with a trunk or similar compartment that can be securely locked, the antique firearm is not visible from outside the vehicle and the vehicle, or the part that contains the antique firearm, is securely locked.
(3) An individual may transport an antique firearm that is a handgun only if it is in a locked container that is made of an opaque material and is of such strength, construction and nature that it cannot readily be broken open or into or accidentally opened during transportation.
Regards,
Keith
________________________________________
From: Chandra Philippe [mailto:Chandra.Philippe@rcmp-grc.gc.ca]
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2011 8:31 AM
To: Keith
Subject: RE: Antique Letter
Good morning Keith,
According to our letter, an antique firearm must apply the same regulations for Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals/or Businesses as a registered firearm. Please refer to the regulations at the following website:
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-98-209/index.html
Since your antique firearm is a handgun, you will need to select storage, display, and transportation of restricted firearms. As you will see, your firearm has to be unloaded and locked.
As for your question regarding the requirement for a locked container, please make your decision based on the following statement:
An individual may transport an antique firearm that is a handgun only if it is in a locked container that is made of an opaque material and is of such strength, construction and nature that it cannot readily be broken open or into or accidentally opened during transportation.
I will send you a helpful pamphlet by mail regarding these regulations.
Also, you're right in saying that an antique firearms does not require registration or an antique firearm letter. However, it is recommended that you request this letter from us as confirmation of your firearm status.
Regards,
Chandra
>>> "Keith" 2011-04-06 08:56 >>>
Hi Chandra,
I was reviewing the Antique Firearm letter which you sent to me and I had a couple of questions. The letter stated:
Please be advised that the following regulations do apply to antique firearms in order to deter loss, theft and accidents:
• Regulations for Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals
• Regulations for Storage, Display and Transportation of Firearms and Other Weapons by Businesses
I reviewed the Regulations for Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals Regulations. It would appear that for an antique firearm all that needs to be done for storage, display or transportation is that it is unloaded and it can be unlocked. If the antique firearm is a handgun it must be transported in a locked container (it can be unlocked) that cannot be readily open, a handgun can still be displayed or stored unloaded and it can be unlocked. Is this correct and would a plastic lockable tool box meet the requirement for a locked container?
Also reviewing other regulations it would appear that antique firearms do not require registration or an Antique Firearm letter. Would this be correct and if not could you point me to the regulations?
Regards,
Keith
________________________________________
From: Chandra Philippe [mailto:Chandra.Philippe@rcmp-grc.gc.ca]
Sent: Friday, March 25, 2011 12:00 PM
To: Keith
Subject: Antique Letter
Good day Keith,
Enclosed please find attached the antique letter that you requested for the Colt.
Regards,
Chandra
Chandra Philippe
Support Analyst/Analyste en soutien
Royal Canadian Mounted Police / Gendarmerie royale du Canada
Canadian Firearms Program/Programme canadien des armes à feu
Headquarters/Direction générale
RCMP
73 Leikin Drive
Building M1, Suite 803-82, Mailstop 6
Ottawa ON, K1A 0R2
Fax: 613-825-0297/1-877-699-4928
Phone: 613-843-6334
Email: chandra.philippe@rcmp-grc.gc.ca
________________________________________
Hi Chandra,
Thank you for your help in determining the correct regulations to follow for the Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals for Antique Firearms. Now that I know the correct regulation, I will ensure my Antique Firearms are maintained following section 14 of the regulation for Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals.
Regards,
Keith
________________________________________
From: Chandra Philippe [mailto:Chandra.Philippe@rcmp-grc.gc.ca]
Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 4:01 PM
To: Keith
Subject: RE: Antique Letter
Good day Keith,
Further to my previous correspondence, the firearm regulations for Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals, section 14 "Antique Firearms" is correct and up to date, and should be followed as such.
I apologize for my late response. I had to review the regulations with a senior analyst before replying to your message.
Regards,
Chandra
>>> "Keith" 2011-04-14 15:59 >>>
Hi Chandra,
Thank you for your help so far so I can understand the correct way for the storage and transportation of antique firearms. I do still require further clarification as I seem to receive different answers on the storage and transportation of antique firearms from your website and different personnel. When I open the link you sent below I do not see where in the regulation it requires an antique handgun to be treated as a restricted firearm. The regulations are broken down on the link as I have copied below and can be used to go the web pages.
1. Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals Regulations
2. 1 - INTERPRETATION
3. 2 - APPLICATION
4. 5 - STORAGE OF NON-RESTRICTED FIREARMS
5. 6 - STORAGE OF RESTRICTED FIREARMS
6. 7 - STORAGE OF PROHIBITED FIREARMS
7. 8 - DISPLAY OF NON-RESTRICTED FIREARMS
8. 9 - DISPLAY OF RESTRICTED FIREARMS AND PROHIBITED FIREARMS
9. 10 - TRANSPORTATION OF NON-RESTRICTED FIREARMS
10. 11 - TRANSPORTATION OF RESTRICTED FIREARMS
11. 12 - TRANSPORTATION OF PROHIBITED FIREARMS
12. 13 - TRANSPORTATION OF REPLICA FIREARMS
13. 14 - ANTIQUE FIREARMS
14. 15 - HANDLING OF FIREARMS
15. 16 - SHIPPING BY POST
16. 17 - OFFENCE
17. 18 - COMING INTO FORCE
Section 2 part 5 states “Sections 5 to 13 do not apply to antique firearms.” Sections 6 and 11 describe the regulations for the storage and transportation of restricted firearms. According to section 2 part 5, these regulations do not apply to antique firearms. Section 14 of the regulation is the only section that I see which describes the regulations for the storage and transportation of antique firearms. Section 14 is similar to what is written on the fact sheet on the RCMP website (http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/fs-fd/antique-historique-eng.htm) concerning antique firearms.
I have copied the Safety Regulations from the website and section 14 from the regulation below. Could you please clarify if the Safety Regulations from the RCMP website and section 14 from the regulation are correct or am I looking at documents that might be outdated or incorrect? When I read them they require that antique firearms must be stored, displayed and transported unloaded, correct? Also antique handguns must be locked in a heavy-duty, non-see-through container that cannot be easily broken open during transportation but not rendered inoperable by means of a secure locking device, correct?
Safety Regulations
Under the Firearms Act, antique firearms must be stored, displayed and transported unloaded.
If you are transporting your antique firearms and need to leave them unattended*, leave them in your vehicle’s locked trunk or similar compartment. If your vehicle does not have a trunk or compartment, lock the vehicle and leave the antique firearms inside and out of sight.
Antique handguns must be locked in a heavy-duty, non-see-through container that cannot be easily broken open during transportation.
ANTIQUE FIREARMS
14. (1) An individual may store, display or transport an antique firearm only if it is unloaded.
(2) An individual may transport an antique firearm in an unattended vehicle only if
(a) when the vehicle is equipped with a trunk or similar compartment that can be securely locked, the antique firearm is in that trunk or compartment and the trunk or compartment is securely locked; and
(b) when the vehicle is not equipped with a trunk or similar compartment that can be securely locked, the antique firearm is not visible from outside the vehicle and the vehicle, or the part that contains the antique firearm, is securely locked.
(3) An individual may transport an antique firearm that is a handgun only if it is in a locked container that is made of an opaque material and is of such strength, construction and nature that it cannot readily be broken open or into or accidentally opened during transportation.
Regards,
Keith
________________________________________
From: Chandra Philippe [mailto:Chandra.Philippe@rcmp-grc.gc.ca]
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2011 8:31 AM
To: Keith
Subject: RE: Antique Letter
Good morning Keith,
According to our letter, an antique firearm must apply the same regulations for Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals/or Businesses as a registered firearm. Please refer to the regulations at the following website:
http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-98-209/index.html
Since your antique firearm is a handgun, you will need to select storage, display, and transportation of restricted firearms. As you will see, your firearm has to be unloaded and locked.
As for your question regarding the requirement for a locked container, please make your decision based on the following statement:
An individual may transport an antique firearm that is a handgun only if it is in a locked container that is made of an opaque material and is of such strength, construction and nature that it cannot readily be broken open or into or accidentally opened during transportation.
I will send you a helpful pamphlet by mail regarding these regulations.
Also, you're right in saying that an antique firearms does not require registration or an antique firearm letter. However, it is recommended that you request this letter from us as confirmation of your firearm status.
Regards,
Chandra
>>> "Keith" 2011-04-06 08:56 >>>
Hi Chandra,
I was reviewing the Antique Firearm letter which you sent to me and I had a couple of questions. The letter stated:
Please be advised that the following regulations do apply to antique firearms in order to deter loss, theft and accidents:
• Regulations for Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals
• Regulations for Storage, Display and Transportation of Firearms and Other Weapons by Businesses
I reviewed the Regulations for Storage, Display, Transportation and Handling of Firearms by Individuals Regulations. It would appear that for an antique firearm all that needs to be done for storage, display or transportation is that it is unloaded and it can be unlocked. If the antique firearm is a handgun it must be transported in a locked container (it can be unlocked) that cannot be readily open, a handgun can still be displayed or stored unloaded and it can be unlocked. Is this correct and would a plastic lockable tool box meet the requirement for a locked container?
Also reviewing other regulations it would appear that antique firearms do not require registration or an Antique Firearm letter. Would this be correct and if not could you point me to the regulations?
Regards,
Keith
________________________________________
From: Chandra Philippe [mailto:Chandra.Philippe@rcmp-grc.gc.ca]
Sent: Friday, March 25, 2011 12:00 PM
To: Keith
Subject: Antique Letter
Good day Keith,
Enclosed please find attached the antique letter that you requested for the Colt.
Regards,
Chandra
Chandra Philippe
Support Analyst/Analyste en soutien
Royal Canadian Mounted Police / Gendarmerie royale du Canada
Canadian Firearms Program/Programme canadien des armes à feu
Headquarters/Direction générale
RCMP
73 Leikin Drive
Building M1, Suite 803-82, Mailstop 6
Ottawa ON, K1A 0R2
Fax: 613-825-0297/1-877-699-4928
Phone: 613-843-6334
Email: chandra.philippe@rcmp-grc.gc.ca
