I am trying to remove a rail and one of the screws/bolts holding it down is not budging. It is an annoying flat head and I have a really well sized screw driver for it but I can't get it to budge. I am worried I will sheer the head off and I will be stuck with a need to get it retapped. Any advice on getting it out?
Stubborn screw
- Thread starter BTWinnipeg
- Start date
- Location
- Western Manitoba
Your concern about shearing it off is real, and they are a pain to re-drill and re-tap, but if installer used red loctite or something like that, you may have to go down that road... Sometimes heat applied can help - I removed one by repeatedly applying a red hot screw driver tip to get the screw very hot, then let it cool. You risk loosing any temper the screw had, but the heat /cool cycle might break whatever bond is holding it. If it is a "through hole", can you see the underside - maybe a soak with penetrating oil from that end?
I use the pointy tip for my electric , pencil type solder iron/wood burning device.
Get that heated up and touch the tip to the screw head for a minute. It will not heat up enough to change any temper of the metals.
Watch closely and have your screw driver ready. The second you see a wisp of smoke or smell anything different in the air (Loctite heating up) , remove the heat and try and turn the screw. If it moves but is still very tight..... give it a squirt of penetrating oil like sea foam deep creep and wait an hour.
Sometimes with steel screws into aluminum or thru aluminum into steel , which are common things with firearms, you get a corrosion that forms due to dissimilar metals. This is common with aluminum and steel when bonded together with fasteners. That coupled with Loctite can be a real pain the @ss.
I get in a habit now of using the soldering iron trick whenever I go to remove screws on firearm components. Busted of screws are no fun
Get that heated up and touch the tip to the screw head for a minute. It will not heat up enough to change any temper of the metals.
Watch closely and have your screw driver ready. The second you see a wisp of smoke or smell anything different in the air (Loctite heating up) , remove the heat and try and turn the screw. If it moves but is still very tight..... give it a squirt of penetrating oil like sea foam deep creep and wait an hour.
Sometimes with steel screws into aluminum or thru aluminum into steel , which are common things with firearms, you get a corrosion that forms due to dissimilar metals. This is common with aluminum and steel when bonded together with fasteners. That coupled with Loctite can be a real pain the @ss.
I get in a habit now of using the soldering iron trick whenever I go to remove screws on firearm components. Busted of screws are no fun
Above suggestions excellent. Is it a screw into steel? If it does in fact sheer off, I would try tig welding a nut over what hopefully protrudes. The heat from the welding process often loosens a bolt or screw. I've done this on both aluminum and steel and it often works.
Travis Bickle
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Upper Lower Middle Alberta
Heat the steel around the threads of the screw.
Penetrating oil.
Let it sit a bit.
Then get a spring loaded impact driver (most awesome tool no one owns lol) and give it one good tap...one of two things will happen, it will break loose or you will sheer the head off.
If it sheers, then there are some tricks. I have had great success center punching and drilling a hole for a counter spun extractor bit.
This will only work if the shaft diameter of the screw is thick enough to get the extractor bit in there good and solid.
If it's a smaller diameter then you can try welding a rod and nut onto it. If it's small you better make sure you have some steady precision skills or you'll end up welding the broken screw to the steel around it lol
Or just bore it out and rethread your new hole.
If it absolutely has to come off, get the impact driver, do the prep work and give her.
Those will be the outcomes
Penetrating oil.
Let it sit a bit.
Then get a spring loaded impact driver (most awesome tool no one owns lol) and give it one good tap...one of two things will happen, it will break loose or you will sheer the head off.
If it sheers, then there are some tricks. I have had great success center punching and drilling a hole for a counter spun extractor bit.
This will only work if the shaft diameter of the screw is thick enough to get the extractor bit in there good and solid.
If it's a smaller diameter then you can try welding a rod and nut onto it. If it's small you better make sure you have some steady precision skills or you'll end up welding the broken screw to the steel around it lol
Or just bore it out and rethread your new hole.
If it absolutely has to come off, get the impact driver, do the prep work and give her.
Those will be the outcomes
Travis Bickle
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Upper Lower Middle Alberta
That's pretty smart actually.
The circle in the center with the rest of the washer overlapping all around would give you forgiveness if you slipped and blobbed a weld chunk between the screw and the steel around it.
gstprecision
Regular
- Location
- Frankford, On
Loctited in place for sure. Heat up with a torch a bit until the loctite starts boiling. Don’t overdo it.
GST
GST
You will burn out several Bic lighters or burn your thumb long before any of that heat will affect Loctite. A propane torch and about 30 seconds or more until some smoke occurs... then a good fitting screwdriver being twisted and at the same time being lightly hammered on...
I have used a stick welder with a bolt in the jaws and just enough juice to slightly heat uo the existing bolt and welding the bolt in the holder to it for more leverage to move the original bolt. With combination of the heating of old bolt to break loose the locktite and the welded bolt for leverage It has always work for me.
WARNING DO NOT OVERHEAT THE BARREL!
WARNING DO NOT OVERHEAT THE BARREL!
lots of good suggestions here, though I have one to try before cutting, welding or burning anything down ...
Ever seen a bolt or nut work it's way free and fall off a tool, machine/car etc?
Use the barrel's harmonics to break the bond with vibration.
Bolt something to the rail, chuck it up tight in a vise and tap on the barrel (with a hardwood dowel or something) so you can hear it vibrating like a tuning fork.. and keep tapping ... combine that with tapping straight down on the screw occasionally with something non-shock absorbing (like a brass/steel punch) and back to tapping. It takes a long time (like a good half hour), but won't damage anything. It may work, it may not it may work just enough to loosen the bond so you can finish the job with a screwdriver - in any case it's a nice (if time consuming) !!non-destructive!! method to try before you break out the torch.
If the rail is on the receiver - this may be less successful, the barrel threads will have a dampening effect between the barrel and receiver.
If you think you are going to have to re-drill/re-tap, ~I~ would do that before the head gets damaged or sheared off. (at that point I would try to insert the drill, heat that red hot to see if there is any red thread locker to break & also try an easy out - though I would think the screw would be pretty small .. if you could find an easy out small enough)
as suggested an impact driver may work, but if it is thread locked, may also shear the head off.
Someone mentioned corrosion between dissimilar metals? Yes, true. but that could also be something known as "Galling" aluminum and apparenty stainless steel are very prone to this. (I actually had a steel cap screw in an aluminum mount throw a spark and puff of smoke trying to loosen it!!)
If you think the part is actually galled - skip everything and go straight to the drill it will not come out with any method mentioned
Got a drill press?
If so, rig a vise to hold your workpiece. Clamp it in place or bolt it down. A mill works even better, as you can adjust the table position under the spindle.
Grab a couple cheap slot screwdriver power driver bits and a 1/4 wrench out of the tool box. And a torch.
Once you have suitably ground the two bits to properly fit the screw, chuck one in the drill chuck, align the work and slip the wrench over the bit. Use the leverage of the drill to hold the driver bit in the screw, to keep it from camming out, and gently try to turn it with the wrench. Try tightening just a squeak first, it often helps break all the mung loose.
If you are pretty sure there is loctite on the thread, heat the bit with a torch while holding it in good contact. Pretty much going to wreck the driver bit, makes it worth while to buy some cheap ones as sacrificial tools.
Change out the bit and have another go.
Not having a drill press, use a ratchet driver and hold the work solidly in position as you can. care must be taken not to lean on the tool too hard else bad things happen if the tip breaks. The idea is to maintain solid contact, prevent cam-out of the bit, and apply as much force as needed to turning the screw, rather than forcing the bit in to the screw.
I have spent way lots of my working life, removing aircraft screws. Best tool ever! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXkl9gPuGgw If you are half handy, you can steal the best part of the idea and make something that will work, but a drill press does about 90 percent of what this lever does, but is not quite as handy for working under aircraft!
