Suggestions for shooting prone ...

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Tikka223

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I was out shooting today and had some mixed results, all with a bipod which is a Rock Mount and nothing fancy;

Shooting with my Savage MkII .22LR at 50 meters and CCI ammo I was getting 5 shot groups from .5"-1" with the bipod resting on the ground which is gravel.

Next I was shooting my Tikka T3 Lite .233 at 100 meters. Normally I shoot from a bench with either a bag or bipod and groups hover around 1" with Federal FMG 55g rounds. Today the bipod was resting on a wooden deck and I found that with the recoil it tended to skip along the wood. I also found that shooting prone I was having a lot more trouble than normal eliminating the black from my scope picture. The 5 shot groups were at around 3".

What I'm wondering is if the scope issue (paralax?) is what's causing my group to open up or if it's the bipod that's ruining everything on the recoil / follow-through.

Please advise and thanks!
 
It is a little bit of everything. Shooting off a bipod is not as easy as it looks, there is a bit of a learning curve involved. You do need to pre-load it a little by leaning into it to stop it from bouncing around. Also when shooting prone your head is much closer to the scope than when shooting of a bench.
 
Shooting a bipod well IS A SKILL. Using a Harris or anything more wobbly can be tough get good results.

I took a 1/4 min rifle and turned it into a 1.5 min rifle when I first start shooting off a Harris. I am much better now but it took a while to learn how to preload consistently and follow through.

If you know the rifle and combo WILL shoot a certain level of accuracy, then it will help you be more consistent in diagnosing your follow through.

It can be learnt.....practise, practise, practise.

Jerry
 
Some things come to mind. If you are using a rear bag you will likely want to use a lower bag than you would use for bench shooting.

Also, you will find that the cheek rest height is different for prone than it is for bench shooting. The eye relief to the scope will often be different too.

Align your body straight behind the rifle and adjust the rear bag to line up to the target. Don't try to force the rear bag into position with your off hand, just move everything till you naturally point at the target.

Do a lot of dry firing; watch to see if you are pulling the shot to one side or the other and adjust your trigger pull accordingly.
 
c3pppo said:
Some things come to mind. If you are using a rear bag you will likely want to use a lower bag than you would use for bench shooting.

Also, you will find that the cheek rest height is different for prone than it is for bench shooting. The eye relief to the scope will often be different too.

Align your body straight behind the rifle and adjust the rear bag to line up to the target. Don't try to force the rear bag into position with your off hand, just move everything till you naturally point at the target.

Do a lot of dry firing; watch to see if you are pulling the shot to one side or the other and adjust your trigger pull accordingly.
Click to expand...

X2 on what c3pppo said. It also help to not lie next to a guy you says "you need a more manly rifle" or " missed that one old fella" [ just kiddin c3pppo :) ]
 
Quick question on the dry-firing. I have dry-fired a lot in the past with handguns and it's amazing practice for trigger control and watching what happens to that front post. I've been told by a few people now that dry-firing can damage a rifle. Any truth to this?
 
IMHO.....No problem with centerfire...my savage 93FV 22 wmr supposedly can be dry fired as well.... and I believe it is just a rimfire issue
 
you will find that your body alligns with your scope and rifle differently than sitting on a seat and shooting off a bench. If you are going to shoot prone most of the time it wouldn't hurt to reset your scope in your rings. Have someone help you. Get in the prone position behind your rifle just like you were about to pull the trigger (obviously unloaded and following safety) and have your helper move your scope forward or backward until you get a good scope picture. Then rotate your scope so your crosshairs are exactly vertical/horizontal and tighten it down.

I had to do this when I started shooting my .22 from prone as it changed my cheek weld and position on the rifle. Also, preloading your bipod will help. Generally not a problem with a .22 but anything centerfire will tend to skitter a little if you are not solidly behind your rifle.
 
Youtube 'Sniper's Hide' online training vids...or better yet become a member. There's some arrogant people on there but the lessons are top notch and helped me out considerably with the exact same issues you are now having. Rifles Only has some extremely knowledgeable instructors.
 
I would not dryfire anything without specifics from the manufacturer. IE-An owner's manual.
I've seen this time and time again, one fella broke the firing pin on his Ruger M77 rifle during dryfire practice. And a good friend of mine broke the firing pin of his Winchester M94 BB in 375 after dry firing while checking the mechanism after reassembly.
It makes perfect sense if you think about it, that firing pin is meant to strike a primer within a brass case, and not smacking into the bolt face, steel on steel, all that transmitted energy right back into the relatively thin firing pin.
Dryfire at your own exspense. Especially now, with parts harder to get across our southern border.
A snap-cap is super cheap insurance.
 
I place a soft barrier between the feet of the bipod and the ground. This prevents the feet from digging into sandy or loose ground through repeated firings and prevents the rifle from shooting wide if the feet are placed on a hard surface, like a rock or frozen ground; similar to what happens if you shoot with the forearm rested on a hard surface. A pair of gloves under the feet works as well as anything. Looks like everything else has been covered.
 
I went shooting today with the same bipod. I used the bipod on three different guns and found a big improvement when I placed a blanket under the bipod feet and used a rear bag under the butt of the rifle. I found that I was better able to keep the butt against my shoulder and manage the recoil. Another thing I did which really helped was move my scope forward on the rifle. One thing that I wasn't really able to wrap my head around was how to "load" the bipod.
 
Loading means putting pressure on it, or pushing forward on it.

If you're using the position shown in the video above (vs. the leg cocked up position disciplines that require supporting the forend of the rifle use), there are two ways of loading the bipod. If your feet are close together, like in the video, you can push yourself forward with your toes until the bipod is sufficiently loaded. I prefer opening my legs wider, and applying pressure by basically squeezing them together like I'm *attempting* to close them until I get it to where I want and then just relaxing my weight back on the ground.

It takes practice, and you need to figure out what is more comfortable for you and what works for you. Loading the bipod is not always a good thing, particularly if the terrain doesn't allow you to align yourself directly behind the rifle, which will happen sometimes if you're shooting in places that aren't a nice, flat range.
 
There are some guns that should not be dry-fired because they can be damaged (e.g. some double barrelled shotguns have quite brittle firing pins). But for the rifles we are talking about (modern design bolt action rifles) my opinion is to dry-fire away to your heart's content. The very worst thing that might happen is that your firing pin might break earlier than it otherwise would. For example my first target rifle (a modified Winchester Model 70) had its firing pin break after about 12,000 rounds through the rifle; this included dryfiring it as often as I liked (hard to say but probably 5,000-15,000 dry-fired shots through it in addition to the 12,000 live rounds). Replacing the firing pin cost me $40. By my math that is so cheap as to be free; if the thousands of shots of dry firing improved my shooting as much as a single 50-round box of ammo might have, then I am already ahead of the game.

I find firing prone with a Harris bipod to be awkward (e.g. having to redo my setup after each shot), but I have never found any reduction in accuracy with a bipod vs. other means of support (e.g. a pedestal rest). Then again there are a number of good shooters who say that there is a learned technique and that until you learn it it can hurt your shooting, so there could be an element of truth to that.

You shooting your .22 shows that you are able to break shots within 1-2MOA; this capability ought to directly carry over to you firing your .223 at 100m.

3" 5-shot groups at 100 sounds unpleasant, but not necessarily out of the question either for factory ammo; have you gotten substantially better results than that in the past when you shot off of a bench? I wouldn't sweat large groups like that until you figure out what it takes to get you, your rifle, your scope and your ammo shooting good groups.
 
To play it safe I've picked up some A-Zoom Snap Caps ... dummy rounds basically. You're exactly right about the bipod ... I find you do need to set yourself up again after every shot and I worry about consistency as a result of this.

Next time I'm out I'm going to use a front and rear bag and I'll compare bipod vs non-bipod targets to see if there is a significant difference. I will also give the loading technique another try.

Thanks for the tips!
 
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