Sunshine On My Prohibs Makes Me Happy..... Updt Pics Post 56 - ###y Submachine Guns!

rugbydave said:
Mark, your collection is truly awe-inspiring! I've noticed that most of your rifles/PCCs have an optic of some sort on them, including some I would've thought went prohib before those optics would've been available (thinking the C1 and Uzi). Are those optics just for show or could you still get ATTs for those firearms and you actually got to shoot them with the optics on? I'm not well-versed on when they stopped issuing ATTs for prhibs since I'm pretty sure I'm too young to ever have been able to own any. Would be pretty cool to shoot an Uzi or Mac-11 with a red dot!
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They stopped issuing Special Authority to Possess (SAP) permits for the transport of prohib 12(x) long-guns in the Spring of 2005, just as I was posted from Gagetown NB, to Edmonton, AB. We had one last big shoot in NS IIRC, with the "Maritime CGN Crew" as it existed back at the dawn of time circa 2005, and then that was it. None of the guns (with the exception of my restricted PCCs) get to the range any more, which is a ridiculous waste of potential enjoyment at ZERO RISK to the public. But I digress...

A buddy and I won the PCC Bowling Pin Converted-Auto Knock-Down Challenge back in 1996 at the Wolverine Supplies/Fprt La Bosse Gun Club competition weekend. I used the C1 SMG with an earlier iteration of the forward-mounted Red Dot (30mm tube unit) and he used my MP-5 with the Armson Occluded Eye Gunsight (OEG) which uses the Bindon Aiming Concept (Google is your friend). We managed to clear the bowling pins off of the top of a rimmed 40-gallon drum in the shortest amount of time possible in order to win that portion of the overall match, provimg that even back in the prehistoric days of red-dots on CQB firearms, they provided a clear winning advantage. I have personally never looked back, being an early adopter of red-dot optics on PCCs and handguns (1996), LPVOs on combat rifles (2008), and so forth.

So to answer your question, the optics on the Prohibs are definitely not just for show. That said, they are also not my most up to date examples given that they currently occupy safe-queens. Those guns werem't always safe-queens though, and red dots did exist back when we were still permitted to discharge those "overly dangerous" firearms. They just weren't so small back then.

As a side-note, none of the optics mounts on my firearms are permanent, including the Weaver Rail on the C1 SMG. That rail is retained by screw-nuts on the underside of the ventilated shroud. The system is rock-solid, but also easily removable in order to restore the firearms to its original, "as issued" configuration.
 
nintendohunter said:
Amazing collection. I'm shopping red dots and magnifiers now and notice you have quite the variety. Not sure how much shooting you do but any recommendations?
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I own and/or have tried just about every red-dot style of optic in the market, ranging from the older 30mm tube-style dot-scopes to the latests enclosed-emitter pistol sights. Without getting into specific models, you can never go wrong with just about anything made by Aimpoint if you can afford the price of admission. Failing that, my recommendation for electro-optics defaults to Holosun. They are by far the most cutting-edge, innovative aiming instrument company curreintly in existence, giving mega-companies like SIG a run for their money in terms of ground-breaking new products at attaiable "everyman" prices. I am a particular fan of the Holosun 509T enclosed-emitter dot sight for pistols, and the new AEMS optic for PCCs and/or carbines, which is another enclosed-emitter sight with circle-dot reticle suitable for pairing with a magnifier.

As is always the case, YMMV. But generally speaking? Yeah - Aimpoint if you have deep pockets, otherwise Holosun electro-optics paired with Vortex magnifiers have always worked well for me.

When it came to actual combat in 2008, I relied upon my Trijicon Accupoint 1-4X fibre-optic LPVO in a Larue SPR Mount. No batteries, no fuss, no muss.
 
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CobraGT said:
Real-deal UMP45, or a USC conversion? Gorgeous either way.
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It is a full-on Tom Bostic USC to UMP conversion with the UMP Receiver end-piece grafted onto a USC Receiver using an embedded steel reinforcing spine and plastic welding techniquees. You cannot tell from the exterior of the firearm, but the irregular surface of the interior of the Receiver is a giveaway that conversion work was done. The firearm is registered as a UMP-45 in the Canadian registry. The Bostic covernsion is impeccable and sturdy/reliable. I was initially worried about shooting in sub-zero temperatures due to the potential for receiver cracking where the plastic welding took place, but those fears were misplaced. My UMP-45 handles the cold just fine, thank-you very much!
 
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Bartok5 said:
They stopped issuing Special Authority to Possess (SAP) permits for the transport of prohib 12(x) long-guns in the Spring of 2005, just as I was posted from Gagetown NB, to Edmonton, AB. We had one last big shoot in NS IIRC, with the "Maritime CGN Crew" as it existed back at the dawn of time circa 2005, and then that was it. None of the guns (with the exception of my restricted PCCs) get to the range any more, which is a ridiculous waste of potential enjoyment at ZERO RISK to the public. But I digress...

A buddy and I won the PCC Bowling Pin Converted-Auto Knock-Down Challenge back in 1996 at the Wolverine Supplies/Fprt La Bosse Gun Club competition weekend. I used the C1 SMG with an earlier iteration of the forward-mounted Red Dot (30mm tube unit) and he used my MP-5 with the Armson Occluded Eye Gunsight (OEG) which uses the Bindon Aiming Concept (Google is your friend). We managed to clear the bowling pins off of the top of a rimmed 40-gallon drum in the shortest amount of time possible in order to win that portion of the overall match, provimg that even back in the prehistoric days of red-dots on CQB firearms, they provided a clear winning advantage. I have personally never looked back, being an early adopter of red-dot optics on PCCs and handguns (1996), LPVOs on combat rifles (2008), and so forth.

So to answer your question, the optics on the Prohibs are definitely not just for show. That said, they are also not my most up to date examples given that they currently occupy safe-queens. Those guns werem't always safe-queens though, and red dots did exist back when we were still permitted to discharge those "overly dangerous" firearms. They just weren't so small back then.

As a side-note, none of the optics mounts on my firearms are permanent, including the Weaver Rail on the C1 SMG. That rail is retained by screw-nuts on the underside of the ventilated shroud. The system is rock-solid, but also easily removable in order to restore the firearms to its original, "as issued" configuration.
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Thanks for the reply! I'm happy to hear that they all used to get a proper workout. I'm familiar with the Bindon Aiming Concept from Acogs. That Armson OEG is kinda like the original red dot, isn't it? I think I saw somewhere that it was in use by the Son Tay raiders? Again, truly awesome collection. Hopefully the world takes a turn for the better and you get to one day enjoy their use again!
 
tonykimatpl said:
Reading through this thread and seeing all these beauties makes me wish I was born about 20 years earlier in time to buy all this. This collection is just beautiful to even look at through a screen.
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The saddest part is that their historical value willl effectively be destroyed when I pass. My estate has instructions to deactivate and then sell all of the firearms within my collection,, with proceeds accruing to the estate. It is either that, or off to the smelter they go, with zero value to the estate. Screw that! If I can't get my money back out of them by selling them off "alive and well", I will have my estate sell them in deactivated form. It is the next best thing to maintaining them in secured firiing condition indefinitely....
 
Would love to see that 180 get built on a restricted lower and get out to the range, wasn't there some options for Sten guns to change classes also?
 
Bartok5 said:
The saddest part is that their historical value willl effectively be destroyed when I pass. My estate has instructions to deactivate and then sell all of the firearms within my collection,, with proceeds accruing to the estate. It is either that, or off to the smelter they go, with zero value to the estate. Screw that! If I can't get my money back out of them by selling them off "alive and well", I will have my estate sell them in deactivated form. It is the next best thing to maintaining them in secured firiing condition indefinitely....
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Next time in Alberta...I'll look north towards Edmonton and just bask in the knowledge that these (functioning) guns aren't too far away. :)

Wow...I don't have words. As silly as this sounds, the Sterling SMG is what gets the juices flowing from this end...
 
Dammit Bartok5 you make me nostalgic for a time long before I was born, think we can get another political party on the go just to get these things back on the market for us youngins
 
Bartok5 said:
Never say "Never". Being Alberta, all things relating to personal freedom are possible. With the re-lumping of the 12(X) prohib long-guns together with the OIC 2022 prohibs under pending legislation (C21 amendments), that suddenlty puts all prohib long-guns back in what amounts to the same prohib category. Does that mean if we win the privilege of using our 2020 prohibs again, we get to use our 12(X) as well? Possibiiities....
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The provincial CFO could issue transport permits if they so desired to.

We used to get annual MG shoots in AB, before someone decided that years of absolutely nobody ever being hurt was too dangerous of a track record and it all stopped ... you know for public safety :(
 
Bartok5 said:
UK STEN Mk II (1943)

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British Sterling Mk 9 Suppressed PCC (No Suppressor Internals)

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USA MAC 11/9 PCC

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JESUS Man, you have a hell of a collection. :)

Love my Sten MK2. The history of that gun and how it was designed and built is super interesting. The fact they continue to work as well as they do, some 85 years later is a testament to the ingenuity of the designer and builders.

Many years ago I had the opportunity to shoot a live, un-neutered Sterling MK9. They are very quiet and loads of fun to shoot. I remember seeing the ones like yours for sale at local gun shows. They have a long straight through barrel.

I have shot a number of different MAC's in different calibers. It is NEVER not fun to shoot a FA MAC. :D The cyclic rate alone is totally giggle inducing. The 45ACP models are something else to rip bursts with. The gun is like a live animal trying to escape your hands.
 
I Dont Care About You said:
The provincial CFO could issue transport permits if they so desired to.

We used to get annual MG shoots in AB, before someone decided that years of absolutely nobody ever being hurt was too dangerous of a track record and it all stopped ... you know for public safety :(
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Yup, two per year, one in the northern half of the province, one in the south. Loaded up a lot of ammo for those shoots back in the day. Would be a real pleasure to see them return. - dan
 
dan belisle said:
Yup, two per year, one in the northern half of the province, one in the south. Loaded up a lot of ammo for those shoots back in the day. Would be a real pleasure to see them return. - dan
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We went to both. We were close w Peter Kearns and his motley crew. :) Those shoots were good fun and I got to shoot a lot of really interesting stuff. Still have the pics on my gunroom wall. :). The Sat eve campfire was interesting to say the least.
 
John Hipwell used to run shoots all the time via his "Fort La Bosse Gun Club" which used the superb range facilities of Wolverine Supplies. These shoots occurred all throughout the 1990s and featured Converted-Auto stages for those particluar breeds of "formerly dangerous" select-fire go-fast guns. Those shoots were a hoot! I used to drive West to attend from Winnipeg, where I was stationed with 2 PPCLI. Those were truly the days...

And then there were the annual Full-Auto Shoots, the last being "Machinegun '98"! I was range staff for that one, having the requisite experience with most of the machineguns on hand to coach the public on their first taste of full-auto fun. Those Machinegun shoots were incredible fun and an amazing historical learning opportunity for the publlc. The way John ran the weekend was perfect - we assembled at the Hipwell Ranch/Shop/Museum/Residence on the Friday evening, the owners and range staff shot exclusively on the Saturday, taking turns on one anothers' machineguns to the extent that all full-auto related desires were fulfilled by the day's end, and then on the Sunday we hosted the public. The Sunday was the "jewel in the crown" of the weekend, with approximately 400 "civilians" in attendance. John kicked off the event with a very entertaining historical walk and chat down a firing line of historicial machineguns the likes of which most folks had never seen outside of those who attend the famous big US Machinegun Shoots at Knobb Creek, etc. Following John's walk-through the history of machineguns, assault rifles and submachineguns, the line opened up to the public. Range staff closely supervised each civilian as they stepped up to the firing line on their full-auto firearm of choice. Wolverine Supplies sold ammunition at cost to support the event, and an awful lot of rounds went downrange that weekend! There was an amazing array of pre-1978 select-fire and full-auto machineguns on display at "Machinegun 98" - it was literally every enthusiasts dream come to rip-roaring life, and I have never seen so many ####e-eating grins on the faces of the machinegun-shooting public! All done safely, with nary a gang-banger in sight, and zero injuries. Go figure....

- And now factory semi-autos are suddenly "too dangerous" for the Canadian public to posess. Who says? And who the fvck are they to tell us what we can and cannot legally own and use?!? Screw that, and screw them!! Non-compliance = warranted civil disobedience.
 
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Bartok5 said:
All done safely, with nary a gang-banger in sight, and zero injuries. Go figure....

- And now factory semi-autos are suddenly "too dangerous" for the Canadian public to posess. Who says? And who the fvck are they to tell us what we can and cannot legally own and use?!? Screw that, and screw them!! Non-compliance = warranted civil disobedience.
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Yep, you got that right. Those of us old enough to remember will never submit to this BS.
 
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