Sustained Lead vs Sweeping Through the Bird in Skeet

Well, I must say there is a lot of food for thought in some of the posts here. Spank I use the hold point you describe. If I try to push past it I start missing because I am hurrying too much. Oddly enough I can still shoot high house from #8 about 3 or 4 yards closer to the house. Couldn't believe it when a really fast shooter challenged me to try it. I wasn't as fast as him, no way, but I was faster than I thought. Go figure! Ducks & Dogs all ways of shooting are important as you say. It's the name of the game for hunting isn't it and all this started with exercises to get ready for hunting. Adamg...Oh No! It's the bead thing!!! I brought this up many moons ago after attending a trap workshop with Big Dog from the U.S. I think he holds the records for number of consecutive hits from the 27. He seemed to have the bead more present than other shooters. I tend to miss if I look at the bead...bottom line. Berretta Boy being familiar with all kinds of techniques and being able to use them sounds right. Like I said before, it is the name of the game in hunting. Sadly, I don't hunt anymore... One does have some advantages in shooting various clay sports because we know where the game is coming from and how it is coming. Gwagen really took your point about coaches for beginners vs coaches for advanced or experienced shooters. I think you are clearly right that the skills for both are entirely different. One thing that has been on my mind for many years in this regard is that one needs lots of success under ones belt to find errors interesting rather than off-putting. Having been trained by a battle school instructor (my dad) many, many years ago I learned very early to correct mistakes. This wasn't bad, but in the early years working on success and what worked is more productive. I wish he was around so we could talk about it. Later on making a miss gets interesting because you know g.d'd well you hit other birds and lots of them to be sure. So, the two populations have very different needs. Would like to thank you guys very much for allowing me to sit in on your comments. Thursday is the day we shoot and I'll be there doing my best and trying to apply some of the things you all have said. Would especially like to thank Gwagen for his/her comments and the offer of help on the phone...What does that mean anyhow? The closest I could come was Widgeon :)!!! You know, I just might take you up on your kind offer Gwagen, but I have to put in a little more time first. Best wishes to you all...Fred
 
Hello BCfred,

I read all the answers and has you can see, there are many different techniques. I would like to share my opinion on this topic. There are some important stuff that were not fully covered before even choosing on how to shoot a target.

#1 Type of shotgun? O/U? Since you are mostly missing your second shot on the low house, are you sure you are not twisting your shotgun when moving on the second target? Is the U barrel still aligned with you sight?
#2 Feet positioning and placing yourself facing where you want to break your targets? They should be broken not very far away from each other. This is even more important for international skeet.
#3 is the gun moving faster than you body? This needs to always be in sync.
#4 You need to always have a clear image and plan where the target will break. If you don't, you will hesitate, flinch, run after the target, put the breaks on, etc.

Once you have done all of the above, practice, practice and practice the same position until everything becomes predictable. No matter what technique you are the most comfortable to use.

This is why Fitasc is fun, because this is where you can master you gun mount while doing a sustained lead and pulling the trigger has soon the stock touch you cheek.
 
Thank you for the offer Pat and for allowing me to call you Pat. I have no problem with consulting on the phone. I just feel I should put in some more effort before taking someone's time, especially with the comments made here. I think I have to move my eyes before moving my gun for the second shot for one thing. I may even have been doing this before and then fallen into bad habits.
Patof13. My shotgun is a Beretta Silver Pigeon II with 28 inch barrels and the automatic safety removed. It shoots 50/50. I don't believe I am canting my gun, but I do have to concentrate to not raise my head on the second shot. I believe I almost always know if I have done this. Foot position is toward the low house regardless of shooting station, with the exception of #7 low and high house and #8 high house. I might vary my foot position a bit following some of Barney Hartman's analysis. For most positions I point the gun to the break point and wind back to the hold point. Hold point varies a bit depending on the day. If I'm having a slow day it is a little further out. Gaze is soft and directed toward where I intend to pick up the bird for the first time. I don't know if the gun is moving faster than my body. It's a good question and worth thinking about. I'd like to say my body is moving as an integral unit but...thanks for the tip. I'm not sure that I have a plan in quite the way you describe. I usually visualize what the lead will look like before I call for the bird, then turn my attention to looking at the bird after calling for it. I don't think much about where I'm going to break it though I know I want to take it before the center line. I do vary some of this. From #6 & 7, for example, I let the high house bird come right to where I will be shooting it in the double. With number 1 high house I elevate my gun to just under the flight path (about 15 feet) then raise my eyes above the gun to look for the bird. I try to take the bird when it gets to my gun. I take your point about "...practice, practice, practice..." and I'm only shooting 2 rounds of skeet and 2 rounds of trap each week right now, but I will be able to shoot more in a few weeks time. Never had a chance to shoot Fitasc, only read about it...mores the pity. Thank you for your comments...more food for thought.
 
Fred ...

A "couple of rounds (of Skeet) each week" is perhaps not ideal to work on problems, especially followed by Trap, however it's better than sitting at home !

It sounds like you've got all the basic principles of shooting sustained lead in place, but continue to have trouble with the second bird on doubles. I'd concur
with Brad's point of view on that ... I think it's mostly a "timing" issue ... which is something that needs a lot more practice. Two conventional rounds of
Skeet per week only gives you what ... 8 shots at "second" birds over the course of some 40 minutes of shooting ... or about 16 % of your shooting.
If that's where most of your problem lies, why not practice doubles, doubles, doubles until you get a feel for the technique, swing and timing to hit the
second bird consistently. Maybe just you & a puller for 50 or 100 shells at nothing but doubles from 1,2,6 & 7 ?

From most of what you've been reading, watching & referencing here ... and I don't mean to be demeaning or insulting ... but wonder if you're not "over-thinking"
the game ? I have a friend who when someone is having a bit of trouble flare-up just says "Don't think, just Shoot" ... and inevitably, the next few birds
are hit. All -too often we are prone to try and apply something or other to change an outcome, when all we really have to do is rely on our instincts and
natural hand/eye co-ordination to achieve a result. The brain often works better if we don't try to control it quite as much ! Skeet is a wonderful game of applying
consistencies ... but with all those things to remember at every station ... stance, gun mount, foot position, hold point, break point, swing, method of
applying forward lead, how much lead & the technique to get you there, etc., etc., etc., it's no wonder new shooters find it overwhelming ! The point being, the
more we can move toward shooting almost sub-consciously applying all those control techniques, the easier it should be to just focus on the leading edge of the
next target we need to break. And it's one target at a time. You need to break the first one before setting up for and breaking the next. You can't be worrying about
breaking (or not breaking) the second target first !

The saying that the 1st- 100,000 targets are the hardest to break is a veiled reference to several things ... among them the amount of practice required to develop
the "muscle memory" required to "just get up there and shoot". If you can spend all your "on the pad" concentration on the target and not on technique, stance, foot position
and what shooting method or breakfast cereal so-and-so eats before a tournament, your scores will definitely improve.

I wish you all the best my friend, but believe more focused practice specifically on doubles will help tremendously. Pick-up the timing, push technique to the back of your mind and just
shoot more doubles ... better scores should follow.
 
Well Beretta boy it would take a pretty poor person to be insulted by an honest question. I appreciate very much the fact you are willing to express an opinion. In fact, 'thinking' has been a definite challenge for me and I am prone to overthink. I have had to work hard to "just shoot" as you have mentioned. Another related problem is letting poor results get one down and lead to negative self-talk of some kind. Right now I am a bit tighter when I go to the line because I know there is a problem. It's not easy to overcome these things. Your point about focussed practice is very encouraging and absolutely right. It is exactly what I intend to do. My wife is willing to help with this and we have done it in the past. We just don't have the time right now. The small group I shoot with shoots the way I described. We do occasionally play games, but there isn't a lot of room for specific practice. Focussing on doubles as you suggest sounds like the best approach too. One good thing is I shot today and I'm sure that looking for the second bird is part of the problem. I took all the second birds from #1 several yards further out with just a small change in looking. The overall scores never went up all that much though. Mom never said it would easy right! Thanks again. Fred
 
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