Swiss Arms Over The Beach Shooting UPDATE, Final Results and Conclusions Post #108

[dizzy]

This has me wondering, would a subsonic rifle load have the same problem?

Yes, unless you are shooting flat faced projectiles that might push the water out of the muzzle.

The point of the bullet wedges the water up against the barrel, then the bullet wedges itself past the water, the heat and pressure work like a hammer on the barrel creating a bulge where both the projectile and water momentarily occupy the same space in the barrel. It would be interesting to recover a bullet and check the diameter after its been through the trauma. talk about hydroforming.

 

[Steve Janes]

Yes, unless you are shooting flat faced projectiles that might push the water out of the muzzle.

The point of the bullet wedges the water up against the barrel, then the bullet wedges itself past the water, the heat and pressure work like a hammer on the barrel creating a bulge where both the projectile and water momentarily occupy the same space in the barrel. It would be interesting to recover a bullet and check the diameter after its been through the trauma. talk about hydroforming.

For anyone who didn't understand some of the other explanations, this ^^^^^ is another excellently explained description of what is happening inside the barrel when you try this.

I agree, recovering a round would have been very cool.

 

[Ardent]

Spooky, that was pretty close to missing fingers or eyes, lucky. Takes some stones to come out and show what happened to the rifle, so bravo.

 

[lupothebutcher]

(Laughing) I never said I was hating or looking down on anyone; I just calls em as I sees em; I've done similar things (course, I was 12).
And no, I don't drive a kia, I drive a plain old work van for work - what does that make me? A wanna be worker......not really.....a wanna be retiree maybe...

 

[BenL]

Undersized bullets would simply shoot down the barrel likely bouncing back and forth and scrape by the lands and grooves loosing jacket on its path and damaging the barrel as it goes.
Poorer quality jacket gilding will be stripped off into the rifling and add to the material in the bore as more and more rounds pass over top.

and thus creating interesting sideways bullet target patterns down range !

 

[Steve Janes]

(Laughing) I never said I was hating or looking down on anyone; I just calls em as I sees em; I've done similar things (course, I was 12).

You didn't need to say it, everyone here is mature and smart enough to read your underlying tone. Take the trolling attitude elsewhere.

And just out of curiosity, what kind of destructive firearms testing were doing at age 12? Please enlighten us?

 

[Captain Paul]

thanks again for post 108, very interesting!

 

[Ardent]

thanks again for post 108, very interesting!

Indeed, while I wouldn't ever try it, and when I saw post #1 and the video cringed and decided to avoid the thread, I respect somebody taking out a $3000 rifle most treat as a range queen and making it work for a living. Even if very dangerous and very ill advised, we all got to learn things from it and only one fella risked his body parts for it. So for that, whatever any of us think of the initial decision to fire a rifle with water in the bore, bravo it's appreciated.

 

[Captain Paul]

for science!

 

[ntm]

I would love for somebody to attempt an explanation on how cheap ammo wears out a barrel faster than expensive ammo, especially in this case where corrosive/non corrosive isn't a factor. I call BS...

It's related to the projectile materials as well as the other things previously mentioned.

http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/foru...An-Epic-Torture-Test&highlight=Steel+vs+brass

Personally, I only use norinco or wolf with what I consider disposable barrels like spike's chf. My noveske barrels only get the good stuff.

 

[Ardent]

I would love for somebody to attempt an explanation on how cheap ammo wears out a barrel faster than expensive ammo, especially in this case where corrosive/non corrosive isn't a factor. I call BS...

Yep, solid fact, see the link in ntm's post. Some US guys did an unbelievably good test involving 40,000 rounds of ammunition. 10,000 rounds each of the different loads through individual ARs, four guns in total, ranging from Federal brass case to Wolf Steel case. They did cerrosafe casts at 5,000 and 10,000 rounds, and sectioned the barrels at the end and there was an enormous difference between the Federal and the cheap steel cased.

Excerpt:

While the carbine firing Federal ammunition maintained acceptable accuracy up to and including the 10,000 round mark, the Brown Bear and Wolf carbines exhibited significant accuracy loss by the 6,000 round mark. It is quite possible that this first started occurring earlier than 6,000 rounds, because groups at 4,000 were well within standards of 5MOA or less, while some shots at 6,000 “keyholed,” or impacted the target sideways.

 

[Not Long]

Very cool thread, thanks for all of this through to a documented (and somewhat expected) conclusion. Glad you came out of it with just a cracked barrel too Steve. Remarkable that these barrels can take that repeated hydraulic pressure and remain intact.

BTW, somewhat of a n00b question here, why do you want a 1 in 10 twist barrel specifically Steve? I love the way both my 1 in 7's shoot 55 and 62 grain anyway. Both shoot way better than I do, put it that way.

 

[Steve Janes]

Very cool thread, thanks for all of this through to a documented (and somewhat expected) conclusion. Glad you came out of it with just a cracked barrel too Steve. Remarkable that these barrels can take that repeated hydraulic pressure and remain intact.

BTW, somewhat of a n00b question here, why do you want a 1 in 10 twist barrel specifically Steve? I love the way both my 1 in 7's shoot 55 and 62 grain anyway. Both shoot way better than I do, put it that way.

How did J996 put it? "I'm a naturalist"

The Swiss made it with a 1in10" twist, and this is one reason that I have always felt wrong with the 1in7" twist barrel (Yes I know a lot don't understand this, but you don't need too, I'm weird, gimme a break)

 

[Not Long]

How did J996 put it? "I'm a naturalist"...
...I'm weird, gimme a break

Good thing for the rest of us.

You and your videos are one of the reasons I now own two and enjoy them very much so thanks again for putting your experiences out there.

 

[CarbineOne]

For anyone who didn't understand some of the other explanations, this ^^^^^ is another excellently explained description of what is happening inside the barrel when you try this.

I agree, recovering a round would have been very cool.

The near-inability of liquid water to compress and deform like other liquids also turns the water into a sledgehammer being driven by a speeding chunk of lead and copper.

This is why belly flops hurt so much.

 

[dizzy]

probably one of the more informative posts on the boards recently. Glad you weren't hurt and kudos for posting the good the bad and the ugly.

 

[Steve Janes]

probably one of the more informative posts on the boards recently. Glad you weren't hurt and kudos for posting the good the bad and the ugly.

Agreed the board has been kind of dead lately

 

[ianfroese]

Great video. I love seeing what these can go through... I quite enjoy your other YouTube vids as well Steve. Keep up the good work.