Table start position

Maverik187

Maverik187

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I'm new to the whole IPSC thing so bare with me.

I saw this start position in an upcoming match and was wondering what some of you more experienced shooters do.

I found two methods on YouTube and decided to try them both out but still can't decide which one may be better.

Here is a vid of me trying to do both methods.


Some pros to method one would be, if you get it right the first time, it seems to be a bit faster. However on the flip side, if you screw up, it seems to take longer to recover then method 2.

Maybe I'm just thinking too much into it?
 
the first one looks cool on video when you don't pooch it. it also only works with you have a smooth flat surface that everything is laying on. the second one is far more consistant and can be used in any condition. its up to you but you wont see the big boys pulling that first one at majors.

try doing that with the gun and mag sitting on top of a plastic 55 gallon drum,which is a very commom subsitute for a table
 
Yep second method for sure. First one is good if coditions are perfect, which they seldome are. A lot of table starts that I have seen are on barrels or have a carpet etc under the gun.

Method 2 is much more consistant.
 
The problems with the first method are: 1- The magazine may not hit the mag well just right and without a good grasp on the mag you can't rectify the issue if it does happen. 2- God forbid you don't get a good grip on the pistol, you may push it past your hand with the magazine and onto the ground.

Method 2 looks great. I prefer the "fingers forward palming method" with the CZ, personally, as the recoil spring is light enough and you can get a pretty good purchase on the slide with your hand that way. Doesn't work as well with a GLOCK. The thumb back method (power stroking) means your support hand comes farther back from the pistol and then has to rotate back towards a supporting position on the support side (excessive waste movement).

Here's some of my videos on the subject ;)

 
Good point about possibly loading off a barrel instead of a table. It's looking more and more like method 2 is better simply for versatility and ease of recoveries if needed.
 
you dont plan for misses in your stage plan so does it make sense to plan for "in case this method screws up its easier to fix"? genuine question, why not employ the same process for everything
 
heavenIsAlie said:
you dont plan for misses in your stage plan so does it make sense to plan for "in case this method screws up its easier to fix"? genuine question, why not employ the same process for everything
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It's more about being prepared. Although we all plan to shoot and run perfect stages, things happen and having a backup is better than not having one.
 
Take into consideration some "table top" surfaces are not even or rough rather than slick. No 2 is more consistent when all variables are correct.
 
option 1, i do it all the time and gets some curious stares and people hoping i screw up. but it works. i try to get the magazine as close to the mag well as possible. practice makes perfect
 
heavenIsAlie said:
you dont plan for misses in your stage plan so does it make sense to plan for "in case this method screws up its easier to fix"? genuine question, why not employ the same process for everything
Click to expand...

Actually, you should definitely plan for misses in your preperation. You should probably not run your gun dry and if you're gonna shoot 11 rds you should plan on what it'll do to your planned reloads subsequent to running it dry if you have to do a standing emergency reload due to a miss.

Also, this line of reasoning means one should never practice malfunction drills.
 
Unloaded starts don't come up that often, fortunately, and a lot of the time you will be either doing it off the belt (dumb) or the gun and mags will be separated (really dumb) in which case option 1 is useless, it never hurts to have something like that in your tool bag if you can get away with using it (though it demonstrates why unloaded starts are just a dumb idea) but I would spend more time in option 2 since it will cover more types of starts. And even then don't spend a lot of time worrying about it, I'd work more on general reloads and transitions when dry firing rather than taking up value dry fire time with something you don't do in a match that much. Otoh if your local match director lacks imagination and uses unloaded starts on 50% of the stages (or more) then work these drills 'til your fingers bleed.
 
Videos won't load for me, but, consider this:Why spend a lot of time gaming on saving a half second on a table start when you can use that time practicing and become a faster, more accurate shooter? Perfecting a fancy table start will not be the difference that wins a match.
 
hungrybeagle said:
Videos won't load for me, but, consider this:Why spend a lot of time gaming on saving a half second on a table start when you can use that time practicing and become a faster, more accurate shooter? Perfecting a fancy table start will not be the difference that wins a match.
Click to expand...

I totally agree with that but for me being new to IPSC, I would rather try it out at home and not do it for the first time at a match.
 
Contondant said:
Actually, you should definitely plan for misses in your preperation. You should probably not run your gun dry and if you're gonna shoot 11 rds you should plan on what it'll do to your planned reloads subsequent to running it dry if you have to do a standing emergency reload due to a miss.

Also, this line of reasoning means one should never practice malfunction drills.
Click to expand...
Maybe, but im never going to take a slower/less good stage plan just because it is safer or lets me have more misses, or do an extra reload between arrays just in case I miss. I plan like im going to shoot it perfectly because that is how I'll get the best score.

its not the same as saying never practice malfunction drills, you dont determine if you have a malfunction, then gun does; but you do determine your plan and how you shoot.
 
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