Tactical bolt action rifle caliber choices: .223, .308, .243 or 6.5mm Creedmoor ?

SteveB said:
Be careful with the 223 and heavier bullets. This is an experts cartridge combo for somebody well versed in reloading and match shooting. It has been popular in F-Class in years past but most of us who used it dropped it after a while. It can be an extremely frustrating combo to get shooting right.

The 308 is probably your best choice. The 6.5 CM while being an excellent choice is limited in brass quality and is not well supported in the shooting community. If you want to shoot precision matches then the 308 is the universal choice while the 6.5 will put you into an open class where there aren't many competitors.

Look at the 260 Rem or 6.5 x 47 Lapua for choices other than the CM. Lapua makes brass for both.

Steve
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Thank you Steve. 1 more for the 308.

Mystic Precision said:
Consider: if precision shooting with longer distances is the goal, start reloading now. Factory ammo just doesn't cut it

If you reload for precision shooting, the core tools and procedures are the same regardless of the chambering so your investment can span all the options you will want to try.

The odds of you staying with just one option for more then a season is highly unlikely.. Once you start and see all that is possible, it takes a strong resolve to not look over the next hill. So I wouldn't get caught up in trying to find your 1 true life mate.

Look at your goals and priorities for the next season. Work towards that. Then change as you see fit and as you are exposed to other options.

I have had the pleasure of shooting damn near everything considered accurate. Even designed my better mousetraps. I now spend most of my time on the 223 and 308. They work, simple to set up, lots of info out there.

For general plinking even to 1000yds (and beyond), the 223 is hard to beat. I would suggest bullet weights from 68gr to 80.5gr. All are easy to load and tune for. Use standard components and no more fussy then the match 308 ammo (or any other precision cartridge by the way) I make.

8 twist is ideal.

the 90gr VLD's offer wonderful ballistics but can be tricky to set up.. Not an option until you become a very experienced loader.

As for 1 rifle for two tasks... forget about it. First off, hunting rifles today are so inexpensive, why would you want to heave a big heavy pig of a rifle through the bush?

And Yes, most precision rifles are going to be heavy with stocks set up for position shooting and peak accuracy... not lugging quietly through the hills.

Enjoy your quest. There are as many options and opinions as there are shooters. Look at the cost of shooting and see if what you think you want, agrees with your wallet.

Add reloading into the mix asap.

Jerry
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Jerry, thank you. Seems like 308 would be a better option for me as I could make it a more viable round for deer hunting. From what I gather from your input, both calibers are workable rounds for plinking but I am by far an expert at hand loading. And, as you said, it all depends on the wallet. PS: I'll keep your website in mind if I need someone to prep a rifle for me. I gather you ship to Ottawa?

tiriaq said:
Unless you are going to play with very heavy .224 bullets, like 90gr VLDs, you don't need a 1:7 barrel. 1:8 may be optimal; 1:9 will do well with 69gr, perhaps some 75gr bullets. 69 and 75gr match grade ammunition can be purchased. Cheap 55gr ball is OK for casual shooting at shorter ranges.
There is excellent .308 precision ammunition available. Stuff like the Hornady 155gr match. It shoots very, very well in most all rifles.
However, if you are going to shoot seriously, you will want to handload. $2 a shot for factory match grade .308 gets old fast.
I have shot .308 for years. Last two seasons I went to .260. Past 500m, the difference is dramatic.
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Tiriaq, thank you. Are you saying that the .260 performs better than the .308 past 500m? and YES 2$ a round is a bankruptcy promoter. Sooner or later, I will have to learn hand loading.

kc34 said:
Not sure what part of Canada you are in but here in Alberta you need .240 minimum caliber to hunt deer with so that would exclude the .223
I think the .308 would be perfect as ammo is reasonably priced with lots of options but the .243 would work as well
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KC34, thank you. The .243 is no longer in my sights as it's a huge barrel burner. 308 is looking like a favorite at the moment from all these suggestions.

brts28 said:
+1 for 308 for both aspects of target and hunting. and 308 is a breeze to reload for compared to some calibres, lots of data and components out there
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BRTS, thank you. 308 seems to be gathering much praise.

SND said:
308win or 260rem.
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SND, thank you. Another 308 point!
 
If shooting cost is an issue, anything larger then a 223 will add up fast. All 308 based cartridges cost about the same to shoot

Add the 6BR to your list of gems for LR precision at lower costs to the 308. Ballistics are better too.

I still suggest splitting target and hunting. But that will be up to your budget and tastes.

Enjoy..

Jerry
 
Are you buying or building a rifle? I'm not sure what your expectations are for accuracy but you might find the tikka tactical in .308 a good compromise for a tactical/hunting. I recently started using one and it wasn't too hard to get groups in the .6-.7 moa range. Has an adjustable cheeck peice for prone shooting.
 
Mystic Precision said:
If shooting cost is an issue, anything larger then a 223 will add up fast. All 308 based cartridges cost about the same to shoot

Add the 6BR to your list of gems for LR precision at lower costs to the 308. Ballistics are better too.

I still suggest splitting target and hunting. But that will be up to your budget and tastes.

Enjoy..

Jerry
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Jerry, you brought some good points, much to think about and certainly more reading to better educate myself is needed. This isn't the military anymore haha. So many options it is crazy!
Than you for your great input once more.

.284 said:
Are you buying or building a rifle? I'm not sure what your expectations are for accuracy but you might find the tikka tactical in .308 a good compromise for a tactical/hunting. I recently started using one and it wasn't too hard to get groups in the .6-.7 moa range. Has an adjustable cheeck peice for prone shooting.
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284, thank you. I will be building a rifle. The Tikka Tactical in 308 (and also was in 223) is in my list of options. One thing I also have to factor into my choice is the type of shooting competitions available in the Ottawa (Canada region).

Tomochan said:
If you don't reload go with .308

If you do reload then the calibre I recommend is the .260 Remington
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Tomo....why, oh why did you have to bring in another caliber hahahahaha
 
Looks like you're off to a good start. Wish I had asked better questions when I started 2 years ago. I'm fine with where I am at and what I have but I am always looking at the green grass on the other side of the fence. Keep reading and asking questions
 
Seriously, do consider the .260 - ballistically it outclasses the .308 hands down, is easy to load for (if you reload) now that Lapua brass is available and isn't a barrel burner like some other cartridges. If not, then .308 is the best choice: so many 'go to' loads out there and so easy to work with. I do like .223 and have a nice custom I still play with but .308 is the choice I recommend if you don't take my .260 suggestion.
 
This late in the season I would wait and see what comes out of Shot Show. I have a feeling there are going to be some more brass options announced for a few calibers, and one of those will be 6.5 Creedmore.

At this point in time, the brass options are much better for the 260, but its been loosing a LOT of ground to the Creedmore down south. Winchester offered some 6.5 Creedmore ammo this year, so there is a good chance brass will follow. Norma announced both brass and ammo for the Creedmore last year, but not much was made due to them focusing on their big sellers during the shortage.

If nothing is announced, then I would agree with the above.
 

The nice thing about .308 is that components are pretty easy to find, and there is so much reloading info for .308........recoil isn't bad as well.

If I was going to build another rifle I would be seriously looking at the .260 Rem.
 
Ed82 said:
Looks like you're off to a good start. Wish I had asked better questions when I started 2 years ago. I'm fine with where I am at and what I have but I am always looking at the green grass on the other side of the fence. Keep reading and asking questions
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Thanks Ed82, knowledge is power. I am getting tons of valuable info from this forum. I am lucky to have fallen on suck a knowledgeable group of people.

Tomochan said:
Seriously, do consider the .260 - ballistically it outclasses the .308 hands down, is easy to load for (if you reload) now that Lapua brass is available and isn't a barrel burner like some other cartridges. If not, then .308 is the best choice: so many 'go to' loads out there and so easy to work with. I do like .223 and have a nice custom I still play with but .308 is the choice I recommend if you don't take my .260 suggestion.
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Tomo, I will indeed read up on that 260. First reads are interesting. Man...tons of choices but that's ok, I am still waiting to receive my PAL so I'll take advantage of the wait and better educate myself through the tons of info you guys are feeding me.

kombayotch said:
This late in the season I would wait and see what comes out of Shot Show. I have a feeling there are going to be some more brass options announced for a few calibers, and one of those will be 6.5 Creedmore.

At this point in time, the brass options are much better for the 260, but its been loosing a LOT of ground to the Creedmore down south. Winchester offered some 6.5 Creedmore ammo this year, so there is a good chance brass will follow. Norma announced both brass and ammo for the Creedmore last year, but not much was made due to them focusing on their big sellers during the shortage.

If nothing is announced, then I would agree with the above.
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I never went to or read about the Shot Show. Something to look forward to!

redshooter said:
:D In a way he didn't, the 6.5 CM and the 260 Rem are very close, pretty much equals on the firing line.
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Redshooter, thx. I am loving the fact that all of this info is getting thrown at me. I am learning more and more every day and when I do make the final choice, it will be a sound choice based on facts.

maple_leaf_eh said:
Your lat lon address is the Court House in downtown Ottawa. Odd choice.
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What's odd about it? If I tell someone to meet me at Court House and they don't show up...that says a lot doesn't it? ;-)
 
There is something magic around the 308... This caliber shine everywere and if you are looking for an extra cool rifle, you can be certain they are made in 308... And 223... JP.
 
260 Remington. Available components, cost effective, good bullet selection, High BC and SD, outperforms the 308 at long range, has similar ballisitics to a .300 Win Mag, a lot less recoil, all in a short action! Will take game from deer to elk and moose!
 
I will spend a lot more money on anything 308 ( for me buying 308 rifle, is more like an investment, more than an expense), i had a custom build in 6.5 Creedmoor costing 3K + ( it was a great, accurate rifle but did not have the 308 aura, so i sold it, it was deem to become a safequeen) but it shine over the 308 at longer distance, my 308 shooting is almost always within 600 metres, this is 308 territory... JP.
 
Hey i was your neighbor at valcartier (5rgc, 1995-2001). I went for the .308 because of availability of ammo, rifles, rifle parts reloading components etc., price, selection and that it gets the job done. If your starting out like i am in this now non job related hobby, why not choose the good old, very well covered .308. I am not the foremost expert here for sure but it’s what i chose and i’m happy i did, i think that it will take a while before i can say that i have outgrown the .308, there is alot to learn with it and it's a good overall hunting round. And if recoil bothers you, you can use a muzzle brake and/or butt pad.
 
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The stats are starting to roll in from this year's PRS finale:
http://precisionrifleblog.com/2014/10/14/rifle-calibers-what-the-pros-use/

Although, isn't as meaningful for the matches we shoot here in Canada because they are almost exclusively shot at single, known distances. The trend down there is towards midsized 6mm cartridges because of the flatter trajectory and low recoil (things that matter when speed is important and there is uncertainty in the distance). Hoping this will mean more brass options for the 6.5 Creedmore (or better yet 6mm Creedmore)... I think it will.
 
First off OP, THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE. I have a hard time matching what my 113 y.o. Swede Mauser can do with a 29inch barrel and the 6.5x55mm cartridge. (I have a Remington 700 .308 Heavy Barrel, braked and sporting an Accuracy International AICS AX chassis). Since you're punching holes, you may as well get the most bang for your buck. Jerry Teo from Mystic Precision hit the nail on the head. Regardless of calibre, you will need to reload to get the precision you want. So, if you snag a Savage short action in say .308...you can swap in a prefit barrel to a .260 Remington or 7mm-08 since they both use the .308 as the parent case. Nice thing about most 6.5's...they pretty much duplicate what the .300 WM will do. You've been given some great advice.
 
kombayotch said:
The stats are starting to roll in from this year's PRS finale:
http://precisionrifleblog.com/2014/10/14/rifle-calibers-what-the-pros-use/

Although, isn't as meaningful for the matches we shoot here in Canada because they are almost exclusively shot at single, known distances. The trend down there is towards midsized 6mm cartridges because of the flatter trajectory and low recoil (things that matter when speed is important and there is uncertainty in the distance). Hoping this will mean more brass options for the 6.5 Creedmore (or better yet 6mm Creedmore)... I think it will.
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The 6mm Creedmore was "announced" in a gun mag about 1 yr ago. Then it went dead cold. Why Hrn hasn't rolled with it is beyond me.. maybe too busy rolling in 6.5 Creedmore dough????

But obviously, PRS shooters are making their own brass so it really doesn't matter.

I personally like the 6XC just from a case shape perspective. I like a the larger shoulder length which would ease feeding (I am splitting hairs here). And the ease of forming from 22-250 brass is appealing to me.

For a run and gun, mag fed, zapper, hard to debate the effectiveness of a 105gr VLD at 2900fps from a 22" barrel.... and a suppressor (man, I wish we could use these)

But this is a wonderful example of how a game/set of rules, will drive development of the best mousetrap. Love to see how this evolves in 2015.

Bring on the new brass :)

Jerry
 
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