Tax write off?

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the rifleman

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I have wondered about this for some time, and wondered if anybody has tried.

If you are shooting in competitions, and winning money, this money may be considered taxable income. If that is the case, then any costs associated with earning that income, could be used as a write off against it. I guess you could claim "self-employed", as a "professional target shooter". There are pro shooters who make a living doing this, although they are usually sponsored as well.

Could I be on to something here. Just imagine being able to write off your entry fee's, shell costs, guns, travel expenses, meals. :dancingbanana:

I probably could write off enough that it might even lower my taxable income from my regular job. That would be nice!:)
 
You'll be asked to prove that you have a reasonable expectation of someday making money through that venture, on a net of expenses basis. It's not only that you earn SOME money, you have to prove that it's reasonable to assert that it will eventually be profitable. Good luck with that!
 
One day I am going to be a formula 1 driver. Bastards won't let me write off my daily gas while I practice to and from work.....:rolleyes: :D
 
There are some people who try and make a living at this. Generally they have many related ventures going on. Often they give lessons. Usually there is some representation for some different manufacturers. They may sell supplies and other related wares.

Prize money from shooting would be one small portion of this income. I can't imagine there is anyone in North America who is generating a reasonable income from prize money alone.

So if you wanted to make the lifestyle change and take up something like that as your primary income source, then you could probably convince CRA that was a legitimate occupation and be subject to taxation appropriately.
As nairbg mentions, you would still have to show that over time there is a reasonable expectation to make money (and good luck with that).

A very interesting question though. I wonder where the income threshold lies with CRA on this. Many of Canada's top curlers travel across the country participating in cashspiels. In the last several years there has been significant amounts of money available to be won. I don't think it is to the extent where a top curler could rely only on this as their sold source of income, but I'd have to assume it is to the point where at very least CRA is interested in having a look.

Personally speaking, I have a lot more money going out than coming in and I'm in no danger of CRA coming after me for a cut of my prize money.:D

Brad.
 
If you are making income on it and CLAIMING it on your taxes, then the expense deductions are appropriate - this is what you had to spent in order to earn that money.

However, if you keep claiming deductions year after year without any income from it, you're going to get called on it.
 
Grouse Man said:
If you are making income on it and CLAIMING it on your taxes, then the expense deductions are appropriate - this is what you had to spent in order to earn that money.

However, if you keep claiming deductions year after year without any income from it, you're going to get called on it.
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I think even in the short term, you are not going to get away with it (of course you'd have to get audited before anything would come of it).

Otherwise, I'd claim that I was a professional gambler, and write off my vacation to Vegas.
 
you can't claim deductions if you didn't make money. i claim guns and ammo for trapping expenses. for items over $200(guns)i claim the depretiation of its value so you can carry it through years you don't make money. items under $200(ammo) are deducted for 1 year.

in the end, if you win $1000, and you don't claim it you are left with $1000 in your pocket. if you spent the hours to do the paper work and claim the $1000 income and deductions, when the smoke clears, you are left with $1000 in your pocket.

for my purpose if i make $2000 in fur, i would owe about $500 in tax. with my deductions i get a maximum of $500 tax credit. so in the end i just keep the same amount of money i made. deductions only get you the taxible portion of that income back, not more.

confused yet? unless your making a living winning matches, don't bother claiming it.
 
There was a recent court case judges ruling that has set a precedent, that changes the fundamental expectation of having to make a profit. It used to be that a profit over expense's should be expected by the third year of a business. The new ruling from what I understand means that a business could go on losing money forever. (If they can stay in business) The judge ruled that it was not up to the government to decide if a business could legitimately lose money endlessly.
 
I carry a gun at work for protection as a forester. I don't really need it and the company doesn't make me carry one. So can I write off my guns, ammo, and ATC & ATT? probably not. Maybe if I owned my own company.
 
get bussiness liscence for each municipality you do bussiness in (shoot in).

Get a GST number.

Get a Wokmen's Compensation Self employed # (you'll probabley have to get a hearing test done yearly)

Get a Liability insurance plan under your bussiness name.

Insure your vehicle for occassional Bussiness use.

Now file a tax return for you and your bussiness and get ready to have every tom #### and mary from revenue fighting over your case!

reload shotshell and drive 80 km./hr to the range and you'll save more with less headache?
 
david doyle said:
get bussiness liscence for each municipality you do bussiness in (shoot in).

Get a GST number.

Get a Wokmen's Compensation Self employed # (you'll probabley have to get a hearing test done yearly)

Get a Liability insurance plan under your bussiness name.

Insure your vehicle for occassional Bussiness use.

Now file a tax return for you and your bussiness and get ready to have every tom #### and mary from revenue fighting over your case!

reload shotshell and drive 80 km./hr to the range and you'll save more with less headache?
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Yah, but you actually have to make some $$$
 
There is a simple answer. Call CRA up and ask for an advance ruling from them.
 
There is a fella at my club who must be 70+ and he tells a tale of claiming trapshooting expensies as well as money won on his taxes years ago. He just says that he did it for a few years and then stopped....can't remember why ??
Now he can really shoot too so maybe he was making some dough ??

Jacky
 
david doyle said:
get bussiness liscence for each municipality you do bussiness in (shoot in).
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I don't even think the city admin would say that that's necessary but you never know where the city bylaw officer does inspections. ;)

"Get a GST number."

Free? I can't remember. Needed only if over ~ $18,000 per year. Can't remember exactly


"Get a Wokmen's Compensation Self employed # (you'll probably have to get a hearing test done yearly)"

Not mandatory but get it if you want to pay into an insurance fund for your potential loss of trap earnings due to injury go ahead. It would be about 4% of your earnings filed quarterly.


"Get a Liability insurance plan under your bussiness name."

You're just as liable now as a person shooting for fun or as a proprietorship that claims the income.


"Insure your vehicle for occasional Bussiness use."

To work or school probably just like now. In B.C. anyway.

"Now file a tax return for you and your bussiness and get ready to have every tom #### and mary from revenue fighting over your case!"

Well since the magic number for forming a Ltd company is $100 Grand gross profit and before that you're better off with a proprietorship in your name (which doesn't have to be a registered name) just add in "other" income on YOUR taxes .

"reload shotshell and drive 80 km./hr to the range and you'll save more with less headache?"

Probably but if you earn $ at shoots you are supposed to claim all income and if you claim income it's expected that you claim the expenses it took to earn that income.

:bigHug:
 
jacky said:
There is a fella at my club who must be 70+ and he tells a tale of claiming trapshooting expensies as well as money won on his taxes years ago. He just says that he did it for a few years and then stopped....can't remember why ??
Now he can really shoot too so maybe he was making some dough ??

Jacky
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It is my understanding that there was some serious money to be had in trap a while back. It is not so much the case any more, but if you look at the payouts in some of the bigger shoots, you could see why CRA would be interested.

I do know that the IRS keeps an eye on our US friends. Payouts at the Skeet 'World Championships' (NSSA) that for payouts larger than say $700 or so, they require a Social Security Number. There are also grumblings about non citizens winning above that threshold and whether or not they would be able to collect (as no SSN).

I'd be happy to claim all the moneys I received because I'm sure I could come up with $10-$15k in expenses without trying too hard.

Brad.
 
I believe there are State Championship handicap ( calcuttas I assume) that can bring in over twenty grand to the high gun. For some reason I thought Nevada had a big one like that not long ago ?? Southern states mostly.

At the North Okanagan Trap and Skeet club this past Labor day the calcutta paid out more than at the PITA grand. It was big. A couple of guys from Washington came up for the calcutta day only and one of them won. Can't remember the exact payout to the high bidder and shooter but it was worth the drive.

There are still guys around that make a few thousand a year shooting trap. I for one am not one of them although I contribute to their income :( ;)

Jacky
 
You bet there are some good winnings! One fellow I saw receive a cheque for $6500 for one handicap shoot. Some Calcutta's are up in the 12-15k range, although there is several pays on a big dollar shoot like those.

Now the ideas about needing to have all the various municipal licenses, insurance coverages, etc. are likely not really needed in a situation like this, anymore than a Tupperware sales lady would need. As it would likely be a fairly low income venture for most shooters, the "big business" type set up is not required. You would need to keep receipts, vehicle mileage log, a record of winnings. Sure if you were going to start making and selling education videos, teaching lessons, holding shooting demonstrations, etc. I could see where you would need to organise more as a business.

I know almost everyone would have more costs then income, my main idea is that "if" you could carry the loss's over to further reduce taxes on your main income.(regular job)

I should check with CRA, we could be missing the boat here.:)
 
I'm pretty sure there is no way you could claim more then you make... which just means you'd end up with the full amount of the winnings. (the same as not claiming it...)

I can't see how you could claim the cost of one buneiss against the earnings of another.

and if you're on a salary job, well you can't even claim anything anyways. including costs for that job itself.
 
scott said:
I'm pretty sure there is no way you could claim more then you make... which just means you'd end up with the full amount of the winnings. (the same as not claiming it...)

I can't see how you could claim the cost of one buneiss against the earnings of another.
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If you were self-employed, one angle you may be able to play is advertising. Plaster your company name all over your shooting attire and maybe keep a pic of you shooting at the event for your records.

Another self employed angle is when you travel to a shooting event, see if there is some business related event going on in the same town, convention, trade show etc. If you keep proof you attended said event, (entry fee etc)travel and accomadation can be claimed as a legitimate expense.

Or so I've heard....;)
 
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