The fist of ham

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w squared

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So. I'm a doofus. Read a little further, and you'll know why.

I've been putting the finishing touches on a Norc M14 that I took to Hungry's clinic in Calgary on the weekend. After plenty of help from Hungry and other folks in the clinic (and a 4 pound sledge with a cold chisel), I finally got my flash hider off. I tried the "180 degree" treatment to tighten up my gas lock. It was an improvement but not great. So I figured out which side of the gas lock would require the removal of the least amount of material and set to it with some 100 grit sandpaper on a nice flat bench.

Insert long pause because it took me a while. I stopped and test fit pretty frequently, knowing that I really didn't want to be taking too much off.

Once I got to where I thought I wanted to be (I would need a mallet to close it all the way) I figured that I was in good shape. I put the handguard back in place, rested the end of the gas cylinder up against a wood block, and gave it a few taps. And then a few more taps. And said to myself "This will be great....it'll be nice and tight!". And a few more thumps. (notice that these are no longer taps).:HR:

Long story short, my gas piston will now slide through my gas cylinder only when pushed through. :(

-If the piston is to the rear and I let the bolt slam forward as it would during normal operation, the op rod moves all the way forward and the bolt returns to battery.

-If I ride the cocking handle forward and control the op rod's movement so that it's slow, the op rod will not move all the way forward, and the bolt does not return to battery. It stops about half an inch shy of being in battery.

-The piston will no longer slide to the rear under gravity's pull. I need to pull out the gas plug and press firmly with a punch in order to get it to move to the rear.

My gut hunch is that I bent my gas cylinder by being too enthusiastic about having a tight gas system. Being a doofus, sometimes I end up learning things the hard way. I accept this.

Here are my questions:

-Am I correct in thinking that this level of "stiction" within the gas system is cause to replace my gas cylinder?

-Should I replace my piston too?

-If I need to replace the cylinder, will a USGI cylinder fit onto my Norc barrel, and with the Norc gas lock?

-Can I re-use the Norc spindle valve, or should I install a new valve/spring/pin?

-If I'm going to buy a new piston anyways, is there any mileage in buying the grooved Sadlak NM gas piston?

-Am I correct in thinking that the Norc gas lock is threaded differently than the USGI gas locks, and thus the Norc barrel needs a Norc gas lock?

Needless to say, this is not my proudest moment. Will being a ham-fisted doofus make my d&ck fall off?
 
Yer #### might not be affected .....cos you have one HUGE set of balls for fessing up :)good on ya.
I garantee other nutters have done similar but buried the evidence in the woods, like the 400 dolar stock that "needed a bit of bedding"
Hope you get a fix for it and YOU are a MAN......with a hammer !

"Arte et Marte"
 
Are you absolutely, positively 100% sure that the gas piston is inserted correctly in the cylinder? With the flat side properly aligned.

I'm not trying to be a smart ass but I helped an M14 newbie that had the same problem. He was trying to force the piston but he used a screw driver instead of a punch. I checked it out and the piston was off by a couple of millimeters or so and he swore that it was aligned.

It is easy to do if the tolerances on the 'norc are a shade off.
 
Turf said:
Are you absolutely, positively 100% sure that the gas piston is inserted correctly in the cylinder? With the flat side properly aligned.
Click to expand...

I am. I own three of the delightful money pits, and I've spent a fair few hours stripping, cleaning, and re-assembling. This cylinder/piston combo has never been an issue before. I also removed/re-inserted a number of times, thinking that misalignment was my issue before I took a close look at the rear of the gas cylinder to check alignment (obviously with the op rod removed)
 
w squared said:
I am. I own three of the delightful money pits, and I've spent a fair few hours stripping, cleaning, and re-assembling. This cylinder/piston combo has never been an issue before. I also removed/re-inserted a number of times, thinking that misalignment was my issue before I took a close look at the rear of the gas cylinder to check alignment (obviously with the op rod removed)
Click to expand...

Okie dokie see below

evanmatthews509 said:
8 ring is too tight. Piston is binding. Get new 8 ring. Try it again.
Click to expand...

Sounds right.

As a reminder W_Squared, from the stickies

Skullboy said:
The gas cylinder lock should start to tighten up at the 3 or 4 o'clock position, and be tight at the 6 o'clock position.If the gas lock tightens up past the 6 o'clock position, then the gas cylinder needs to be shimmed.

Now if your gas lock tightens up past the 6 o'clock position, in order to re install the gas nut you must back off the gas lock to be able to screw in the gas nut.This pulls the gas cylinder forward from the shoulder on the barrel inwhich the gas system butts up against and causes there to be play in the gas system.This isn't good for accuracy.
Click to expand...
 
evanmatthews509 said:
8 ring is too tight. Piston is binding. Get new 8 ring. Try it again.
Click to expand...


Figured that it was worth a try. I removed the gas plug and gas lock, and lo and behold I had "le movement". The piston was sliding free and clear.

So I sanded some more off of the backside of the gas lock (very gingerly, I might add). It started tightening at 3 o'clock, and was a nice firm hand-snug at 5 o'clock. Two little love taps with a nice soft mallet, and we bob's yer uncle. (he might be your uncle, but he's actually my cousin).

After a brief visit with Mr. Birchwood Casey's cold blue, everything slid back together without a hitch.
 
P1190597.jpg



I had to polish the inside of my gas cylinder to get the piston to float freely.

Taped some 400 to a 30-06 casing and chucked it into a cordless drill.

Gave it five seconds and tried it. Gave it five seconds more and flawless.
 
Ya wont find that in the owners manual eh.. and yer #### never fell off :) Thats going into me little alternative maintenance notes. Thanks for sharing
 
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