The IPSC Box.

General Ripper said:
Well we had a box at the Kelowna match and my Edge had to compress the rear site to squeeze in. Can't be good. I think another was bumped to open because his site did not compress. Needs to have the mag well shaved a bit. Is this not taken into account when manufacturing this gun? It is a Standard gun primarily isn't it? I haven't altered the external dimensions since I bought the gun.
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What Base Pads did your mag have? All Edges/Executives/Legends/IPSC Guns/etc. running Dawson or Josko / Frank's knock offs of Dawson bases have to have the rear sight compressed. The Factory STI 126mm plastic base pad doesn't cause this. In other words, it's our desire for extended mag pads that causes the sight compress requirement - not the manufacturer of the gun. ;)
 
ipsc box

first thing i have done when i recived the IPSC canada box was to check both of my std gun into it

The EDGE was OK with mags
but my RK custom got a little tight( tactical adjustable sight) so i checked to see aluminium expansion
i was on my patio with this box on the table for around 30 mins (july), then i pick the gun up from the box evrything was ok , but i put the gun back in underground laird for the evening
The thing was so stuck that i got to take the box appart to get my gun back

so lesson learn
just loosen the screew on the side of the box to get some slack and evrything is ok and nobody will ever notice......not sure anymore....:kickInTheNuts:
 
so lesson learn: just loosen the screew on the side of the box to get some slack and evrything is ok and nobody will ever notice......not sure anymore....


And now your box is no longer certified by NROI and can no longer be used in your section. You section will be invoice.... :)
 
"so lesson learn: just loosen the screew on the side of the box to get some slack and evrything is ok and nobody will ever notice......not sure anymore...."


And now your box is no longer certified by NROI and can no longer be used in your section. Your section will be invoice.... :)
 
DVC1911 said:
"so lesson learn: just loosen the screew on the side of the box to get some slack and evrything is ok and nobody will ever notice......not sure anymore...."


And now your box is no longer certified by NROI and can no longer be used in your section. Your section will be invoice.... :)
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So how many other sections have done the same? taken the box apart... put it back together... what a nightmare!

Wait a minute... I think Phil did that to the IPSC Alberta box too! No??? Or was it IPSC Ontario's box... Ha Ha Ha!!!

Poor design... poorly thought out...
 
ipsc box

when i took the box at the shop for a through inspection before i took it apart to get my gun back
first i started with mitsutoyo digital micrometer i was close but not enough precise for me
then took the zephyr lazer at inpection post and run a real life 3D of the inside of the box

mesurement X-224.89mm y-149.97mm Z-45.03mm

so i guess the box wasn't that good after all
 
philproulx said:
when i took the box at the shop for a through inspection before i took it apart to get my gun back
first i started with mitsutoyo digital micrometer i was close but not enough precise for me
then took the zephyr lazer at inpection post and run a real life 3D of the inside of the box

mesurement X-224.89mm y-149.97mm Z-45.03mm

so i guess the box wasn't that good after all
Click to expand...

Which section's box is that? And what temperature? Good to see that you have looked into this deeper than most.

I have full access to equipment for even tighter measurements than that, and I would gladly give it a try (and give a detailed report) for my section's box.:cool:

The aluminum is a bit of a question mark for me. Since when do we shoot aluminum guns? The co-efficient of expansion for aluminum is twice that of steel. There may be composite or aluminum grips but all barrels are steel ( stainless or carbon), and barrels and slides are steel. In other words............. the box will expand and CONTRACT twice as fast as a steel gun being put into it. Might just be a few thousandths of an inch, but that could be enough to put you in Open class too.

There are just too many variables that can be brought up. I think the problem some people are worried about is a DIFFERENCE in the boxes. In other words, your gun may fit tightly in one box, but not at all in the other. This is the tolerance (is that right Quigley?) at play. Unless you know the exact dimensions of the box you tried your gun in the first place, you don't know if that is on the high or low side of the tolerance. The next box may be different, yet still legal.

Obviously the smart money is to make everything a little loose just to be safe. I am just going through this myself as I am getting my Para-Ordnance equipment ready to pass the box test (first I had to dust it off). I machined my old Viper bases (now Josko sells them already done) and then realized once I milled them all exactly the same, that there are subtle differences in the magazines that will affect the box test more than anything else. Some are closer than others to just squeezing in when they are in the gun. I will take a little more off all of them to be sure.

Now that I have wound Quigley up by playing "Devil's Advocate", my work is done.:D

Bottom line..........make it loose in the box!!!:rolleyes: You aren't going to win or lose points by a few thousandths of an inch on your mags or magwells.
 
Pushing the limit on the box test is really no different than pushing the limit on the chrono. Every chrono is different...temp and elevation can effect the ballistics...

Push it to the edge everytime...you will eventually get bit...
 
I'm sorry, but this is an attitude I see too often; it's always everyone else's fault except your own.

"Waaah! I got bumped into open. It wasn't because my gun was too big, it was because your box was too small!"

Actually, that sounds a bit dirty...
 
Freedom Ventures said:
What Base Pads did your mag have? All Edges/Executives/Legends/IPSC Guns/etc. running Dawson or Josko / Frank's knock offs of Dawson bases have to have the rear sight compressed. The Factory STI 126mm plastic base pad doesn't cause this. In other words, it's our desire for extended mag pads that causes the sight compress requirement - not the manufacturer of the gun. ;)
Click to expand...

I run stock short mags. There was no issue there. The contact points were the edge of the stock magwell and the rear site. Email sent. I will have to grind the magwell to make a smooth fit. No issue with the box just curious about the gun construction having such close tolerances. As I said it is stock outside dimensions.

John
 
General Ripper said:
I run stock short mags. There was no issue there. The contact points were the edge of the stock magwell and the rear site. Email sent. I will have to grind the magwell to make a smooth fit. No issue with the box just curious about the gun construction having such close tolerances. As I said it is stock outside dimensions.

John
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Email replied to. As you said, your gun fits, it doesn't have to fit smoothly.
I'd stay away from the grinder.:eek:

I just tried 3 Edges, an IPSC Commemorative, an IPSC Double Stack and an Executive in both the RD's Box and IPSC NS's Box (I have two identical boxes) with the factory 126mm mags with the factory plastic mag bases and they went in easy.
 
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Freedom Ventures said:
I just tried 3 Edges, an IPSC Commemorative, an IPSC Double Stack and an Executive in both the RD's Box and IPSC NS's Box (I have two identical boxes) with the factory 126mm mags with the factory plastic mag bases and they went in easy.
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To back that up...an Eagle & Tactical too this time...
1.jpg

2.jpg

3.jpg


(The Scratch Marks on the Right hand Box are courtesy Stormbringer at the Nats...:D:p)
 
you guys have any issues with mag insertions with the mags basically being flush fits with the mag well? I'd have thought you'd want the mags to stick out a bit, so make the magwell a bit smaller?
 
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