The M1 Garand
- Thread starter svt1940
- Start date
The modern ammo is a huge bit if Fudd lore.
Even the CMP statement of "174gr and 50,000 CUP" covers 0% of commercially avaliable ammo. SAAMI has been standardizing ammo production since nearly a decade before the Garand was adopted. (1920's)
Keep your mainspring at the correct length (19.5" min if you're usgi spec)your rifle greased, and you will never have a issue.
This is something of an over-simplification. The Garand receiver is quite massive and can easily handle chamber pressures of 50,000 PSI as generated by commercial .30-06 loads. Rifles were fired with proof rounds more powerful than this at time of manufacture.
The issue with propellants in the Garand isn't chamber pressure, but rather the pressure pulse at the gas port. The MILSPEC propellant for the Garand was IMR4895 which generates the correct pressure pulse to cycle the action reliably without damage. Commercial .30-06 ammo is generally loaded with slower burning proplellants than IMR 4895 in order to achieve higher muzzle velocity. These propellants generate a different gas port pressure pulse than IMR 4895.
Conventional wisdom, as well as advice from reloading manuals, is to use propellants in the IMR 4895/ IMR 4064 burn rate when reloading for the Garand. Some people do use adjustable gas plugs when using slower burning propellants in the Garand.
After shooting, building and reloading for these rifles for nearly 50 years, I've always stayed with either MILSPEC ammo or handloads with IMR 4895, IMR 4064 or H4895. There's really not much reason to look further for reloading as IMR 4895 and IMR 4064 generate excellent accuracy and reliability. Its not a good practice to deviate from recognized reloading manuals. MILSPEC .30-06 ammo has dried up, but Garand specific ammo is available from several commercial manufacturers. It's marked as such on the boxes.
Handloading with quality components is a good way to go for safety, reliability and accuracy. There are caveats on case preparation and primer selection and seating when reloading for the Garand.
I endorse the comments on op rod springs and keeping the rifle lubed at specified grease points for proper functioning.
A 7.62 Garand has the same gas system as a .30-06 Garand. I've found MILSPEC 7.62 ammo made by DA, IVI, Lake City, RG and Hirtenbirger to work well in my 7.62 Garands. Other than that, reloading is recommended with propellants suitable for the .30-06 Garand. These are faster burning powders like IMR 4895, H 4895, IMR 4064 and IMR 3031, and all deliver fine accuracy and reliability. Old saying; "if your .308/7.62 doesn't shoot well with IMR 4895, you have a rifle problem".
I've used WC755, a commercial grade ball powder with a slightly slower burn rate than IMR 4064, in my 7.62 rifles with an adjustable gas plug. An adjustable gas plug is recommended when using ammunition with slower burning propellants.
I've used WC755, a commercial grade ball powder with a slightly slower burn rate than IMR 4064, in my 7.62 rifles with an adjustable gas plug. An adjustable gas plug is recommended when using ammunition with slower burning propellants.
I've shot thousands of that norc stuff out of many garands. Never a issue.
I really want someone to tell me what ammo will bend my op rod. So I can go buy a bunch of it and just torture test a Garand.
I once put black powder in my 308 cases and fired it out of my Garand. That turned some heads at the range.
My finding are.. when i was setting up a adjustable gas plug in my tipo 2 308 garand just to see how soft i could get to to shoot. So i set it so my reloads with service rifle charge of imr4895 150gr spfb bullet would just cycle every time( super soft shooting and the casing would land within 6ft) . When i went to shoot the norc 308 some wouldn't cycle... eject but not pick up the next round 50% of the time. So this doesn't feel to me like the norc suff is harder on the cycle system. Maybe that was a one off with that gun.
So i just built a garand recently and when test shooting it i knew it had a pretty small gas port on the new barrel but i tried it anyway. I used the standard gas plug this time and my reloads cycled just fine even with the small barrel port. The norc 308 copper wash again would eject but not pick the next round maybe 60% of the time.
Just my finding for what its worth.
P.s. my load was 47gr imr4895 150 gr with the handloads they chrono to 2600fps average in the tipo 2
the norinco were 2700 fps average in the tipo 2
its curious that the faster one was short stroking. but being steel case and i imagine a different power impulse i guess as purple says it changes things.
I still dont feel it is harder on the op rod or follower system. but the steel cases on the ejector and other innards who knows..
Every single Criterion. 308 Barrel I've had has a improperly sized gas port. It'll be to the 3006 spec. Nothing a quick drill can't fix.
Just shot 60 rounds of PMC Bronze 147gr FMJ's through my Springfield Tipo 2 with no issues. First time shooting a Garand, I know it's only .308 but I'm surprised at how soft shooting of a rifle it is. I can really see the advantage a regular GI had over his counterpart.
I took my new (to me) .30 Garand to the range for the first time today. Had good fun though ran into a couple of issues.
#1: Shooting high at 100m. That's with the rear sight bottomed out. Windage seems OK for the time being.
#2: Failure to chamber rounds. I believe it's a short-stroke issue though I haven't been through the troubleshooting process yet.
The rifle ejected brass fine but occasionally didn't pick up the subsequent round. Going to try with different ammo and look at a few other possible causes.
#1: Shooting high at 100m. That's with the rear sight bottomed out. Windage seems OK for the time being.
#2: Failure to chamber rounds. I believe it's a short-stroke issue though I haven't been through the troubleshooting process yet.
The rifle ejected brass fine but occasionally didn't pick up the subsequent round. Going to try with different ammo and look at a few other possible causes.
I used 147gr Norinco FMJ through my Garand the other day. It was actually fairly accurate on the 200 yard gong. Quite surprised for the crap stuff.
Quick question regarding NM sights:
Will a NM rear sight fit on a 1940s Garand? I understand there's some fitting/sanding/filing of the rail on the aperture required but I couldn't find a definitive answer regarding the rest of it, mainly the windage and elevation knobs.
AFAIK, the indents (not sure the correct term) that are part of the receiver where the elevation and windage knobs are installed are designed for 1 MOA adjustments and the NM sights are designed for 1/2 MOA adjustments. I'd read something about the tracks/indents not being compatible?
Will a NM rear sight fit on a 1940s Garand? I understand there's some fitting/sanding/filing of the rail on the aperture required but I couldn't find a definitive answer regarding the rest of it, mainly the windage and elevation knobs.
AFAIK, the indents (not sure the correct term) that are part of the receiver where the elevation and windage knobs are installed are designed for 1 MOA adjustments and the NM sights are designed for 1/2 MOA adjustments. I'd read something about the tracks/indents not being compatible?
I recently completed my M1 Garand (30-06) build and finally got to the range. Worked great, no issues and super accurate, at least to me anyway. I like to retrieve my brass to reload, but this rifle likes to chuck the brass forward, well beyond the firing line. I shoot at an indoor range, so I won’t be able to always retrieve my brass. Was advised against removing the gas plug, but what if I drill out the gas plug, could I turn it into a single shot straight pull (i.e. no cycling after firing, allowing me to eject and keep the brass)? Anyone tried this? I understand there are after market adjustable plugs to accommodate ‘commercial’ ammo, but I don’t think these can be adjusted sufficiently to prevent cycling. Any help or insights would be appreciated.
Hang a piece of cloth over the ejection port to slow the brass down. Add weight or use a heavier/longer cloth as required
