This is F'ed ,LOADING SUCESS!

to rule out your press, put a dial indicator on the ram in top position. Check for repeatability with and without bullet.
You can also put dial indicator on the die, see if the die moves when seating the bullet.
I think most likely its the seating stem. Maybe drill out the centre of the stem or invest in a competition seating die.
 
Kelly Timoffee said:
8 more , Speer 180sp.

3.472” And 3.472” the Last 6 were 3.475” to 3.477”.

Apart come the dies , again , see if I can drill the seater out at bit at the point.
Click to expand...

Seems way better no?

I would guess the relation between the bullet shape/tip vs seating stem is the problem...

2-3-4 thou between std bullets seems reasonable to me... and way better than your long bullets...
 
xingyc said:
to rule out your press, put a dial indicator on the ram in top position. Check for repeatability with and without bullet.
You can also put dial indicator on the die, see if the die moves when seating the bullet.
I think most likely its the seating stem. Maybe drill out the centre of the stem or invest in a competition seating die.
Click to expand...

I drilled it out prior to the last dummy rounds , maybe need to drill more.
 
Mystic Precision said:
I would guess ... too much neck tension.

If you have a way to adjust the neck sizing, go with a net 1 to 1.5 thou squeeze after it comes out of the sizing die.

If the sized brass has upwards of 3 to 5 thou neck tension, that is likely the problem... plus runout may not be ideal either.

Finally, you may have donuts at the base of the case neck which affects the depth the bullet can travel in. Expand with a mandrel and outside neck turn.

If the brass has been fired a few times, anneal the case necks as well.

sounds like a neck tension issue.....

Jerry
Click to expand...

Here is the numbers on 5 cases after neck sizing...

Yes those are negative numbers for interference.

Ignore the ID and OD designations, they backwards.

 
Kelly a couple thoughts here. Incase I missed it, did you pull your seater stem and drop a bullet in? With basic Lee seaters anything with a high BC contacts the stem too high up the bullet where inconsistencies in the bullet greatly affect seating depth. Even when measuring BTO. I switched my 308 to a Forster BR seater rather than send bullets to Lee for a custom stem. This almost solved the issue for me. Which brings me to thought number two. My press is a Lee Breechlock Challenger and with the Forster BR die set up according to the instructions (mainly, backed out so that the shell holder does not touch the die at the top of the stroke) I still had variations in seating depth. I found that by varying pressure on the press handle affected seating depth by over 5 thou. The linkage had enough flex in it's topout stops to make seating depth as well as shoulder setback an inconsistent affair. Readjusting my BR seater to just lightly kiss the shell holder solved the issue and bullets were seating to within the .0005" claimed resolution of my crappy tire calipers every time. Also, I tried drilling a Lee seater but ended up giving up on it and learned that the Forster seated right off the ogive so was opened right up to nearly bullet diameter. I suspect opening your seater that far, if possible, and ensuring you are not experiencing any press linkage flex on top out will eliminate this issue as it did for me. Sorry, I missed which press and dies you are using but hopefully this can help you out.
 
supernova said:
Kelly a couple thoughts here. Incase I missed it, did you pull your seater stem and drop a bullet in? With basic Lee seaters anything with a high BC contacts the stem too high up the bullet where inconsistencies in the bullet greatly affect seating depth. Even when measuring BTO. I switched my 308 to a Forster BR seater rather than send bullets to Lee for a custom stem. This almost solved the issue for me. Which brings me to thought number two. My press is a Lee Breechlock Challenger and with the Forster BR die set up according to the instructions (mainly, backed out so that the shell holder does not touch the die at the top of the stroke) I still had variations in seating depth. I found that by varying pressure on the press handle affected seating depth by over 5 thou. The linkage had enough flex in it's topout stops to make seating depth as well as shoulder setback an inconsistent affair. Readjusting my BR seater to just lightly kiss the shell holder solved the issue and bullets were seating to within the .0005" claimed resolution of my crappy tire calipers every time. Also, I tried drilling a Lee seater but ended up giving up on it and learned that the Forster seated right off the ogive so was opened right up to nearly bullet diameter. I suspect opening your seater that far, if possible, and ensuring you are not experiencing any press linkage flex on top out will eliminate this issue as it did for me. Sorry, I missed which press and dies you are using but hopefully this can help you out.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the reply.

You kind of touch on a few things that I did do.

1)I have two presses , changing back and forth didn't seem to change much.I have a Rockchucker and a Lee Breechlock challenger I believe it is ,which I use for pulling/sizing things so if I have a problem I don't have to remove my dies from the Rockchuker for reloading.

2.I did drill out the seater, I definitely could go a tad wider and bring the contact area down further, just don't want to drill the seater right of the shaft though.

3.I also tried the seating die 1 turn in, flush and 1 turn out to see if there was a difference, there was not.

The dies are standard RCBS.
 
yes the longer bullets should not be used unless the seater plug matches the bullet design,

600 and 1000 yard br guys know this for a while.

sorry I did not see this thread earlier
 
If the ID of your sized cases are 0.303" to 0.304", that is your problem right there. My sized cases are 0.306" coming out of the Lee collet neck die.

For a bolt rifle, that is all I want. Some FTR competitors will run a 0.307" ID cause excessive neck tension is not helping with accuracy.

For a working rifle, more neck tension is useful as a safety measure... but I doubt the neck holds any better after 3 to 4 thou.

Consider expanding the sized necks to 0.306" and see if the seating issues go away.

Jerry
 
Dear Mr Kelly, I have suffered from the same thing for years. I found some useful tips to try in this thread. I’m pretty sure it’s my equipment because this issue of mine spans several different caliber s and bullets. I have spent many hours banging my head on the table trying to find consistency.... I feel your pain lol.
 
156821 said:
Dear Mr Kelly, I have suffered from the same thing for years. I found some useful tips to try in this thread. I’m pretty sure it’s my equipment because this issue of mine spans several different caliber s and bullets. I have spent many hours banging my head on the table trying to find consistency.... I feel your pain lol.
Click to expand...

I just found your problem, you are knocking your scale outa whack! ;)

If I didn't have a second press to help rules things out I'd really be spinning my wheels.

It is frustrating without a doubt especially when one does all they can to be diligent.I think it is a combination of a few little things adding up to make a more noticeable problem.That being said, if it wasn't for this forum, ones problems can take much much longer to figure out.

I am pretty sure what other steps I need to take here , I will post my results in a few days once I have a few more items on hand to put something together.Just want this done by end of August which I think is possible.

I know the gun shoots but I also know now why some things resulted in the things they did.
 
You already have shown that the length of the bullets is within your acceptable range. Try measuring the bullets alone in your seating stem. Ensure you keep the bullets in the same relative alignment to the stem by perhaps laying them in a “v” block and measuring OAL of stem and bullet. When you have sorted them into batch’s load a similar batch and check for cartridge OAL.
 
Measure off the ogive instead of COAL. see if that makes a difference. But, it's not uncommon amongst bullet manufacturers to throw bullets off different production lines where different dies are making bullets into one lot, instead of keeping one lot together off of one production line.
 
New brass, same nonsense.

Set first cartridge , 3.540" okay, carry on, 3.538 , 3.540 .3.539 , 3.540 , then 3.545 , ummmmmmmm, okay, then boom, 3.555 , 3.559..........
, back down again.

They did 10 more after those, of 79.5gr just to try that load, first one was 3.538 , then down , 3.526..............LIKE WTF.

I had a range of 3.521" to 3.559" , 0.038" fluctuation to me is not acceptable at all.

So , I did some dummy 7/08 rounds as well with the LRAB just threw the die and loaded some brass I had ready,2.894" to 2.904" on 10 rounds. 0.010" differences ,that can be acceptable variances.

SO, it has to be the dies or the bullets.IMO

I will have to measure some rounds in the seater.I will return with those numbers shortly.
 
270 totheend said:
You already have shown that the length of the bullets is within your acceptable range. Try measuring the bullets alone in your seating stem. Ensure you keep the bullets in the same relative alignment to the stem by perhaps laying them in a “v” block and measuring OAL of stem and bullet. When you have sorted them into batch’s load a similar batch and check for cartridge OAL.
Click to expand...

Well looky here!

That's enough to ruin ones day now isn't it? ;)

 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom