Thoughts on Threaded Muzzles

horseman2

horseman2

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Is there any thought that threaded barrels have diminished accuracy?

Maybe not so much on heavier barrels with a 0.920" measurement up front but very leery when the barrel is pencil thin.

While it may serve a purpose south of the border but in Canada the only use might be with a compensator.

My Ruger 10/22 with a Dlask barrel has a compensator but I have not tested enough ammunition to suggest there is that much benefit.

I can't see the purpose but they are being brought in by Cabela's so the choice is limited.

There have been no real tests completed where the information made available.
 
Threaded barrels are only really useful if you thread something on to it, but I don't mind them even if they are wearing a thread protector.

Barrel tuner, flash hider, compensator,muzzle brake, sound suppressor all have their uses depending on calibre and the amount of freedom a person enjoys.

A real basic muzzle device also makes a good crown protector.
 
My factory 10/22 came threaded with a brake. I took it off and it shot much worse. With the brake it shot better than my factory T1X barrel. I ordered the IBI barrel unthreaded because of the concern about thin threaded muzzles. My Howa centrefire has 1/2” thread on a 30cal barrel. Way to skinny I think. Will see when I try a thicker one.
 
I've threaded a couple 22 barrels and not noticed any effect on accuracy. And I recently shot a 10 shot group at 50m with one of them that measured 3/8" center to center, with only a thread protector on the end of the barrel. That particular barrel is around 0.750" at the muzzle, so relatively heavy but not a straight bull barrel either. I haven't got around to trying to build a tuner for it yet, but with results like that, maybe I don't need to bother.
Kristian
 
I did some experimenting with my original Vudoo when I first bought it. While trying different lots of ammo I shot both with an Insite brake and without the brake with the different ammo I was trying. All the different ammos and lots shot better with the brake than without. Since then I added an Insite tuner and have great results on a particular lot of Center X that was mediocre and now very acceptable. My testing was not thousands of rounds but conclusive enough for me to notice a difference. I have a skinny barrel Browning T bolt that’s threaded and shots extremely well with both brake and thread protector. Maybe someday the Overlords will get their head out of the sand and realize firearms with suppressors are not an Evil thing. Most European countries make it mandatory.
 
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No one threads a .22LR muzzle because the threading alone improves performance. Rimfire barrel tuners used by serious rimfire benchrest shooters have been clamped to the muzzle for the very purpose of avoiding altering the muzzle by threading.

Is there any device that must be threaded on the barrel that adds improved performance to a barrel that can otherwise shoot well?

Threading a .22LR muzzle seems to serve a dual purpose, neither of which is improved performance. One is the use of sound moderators, which of course are not legal in Canada. The other is to add devices for aesthetic or "tactical" appeal.
 
grauhanen said:
No one threads a .22LR muzzle because the threading alone improves performance. Rimfire barrel tuners used by serious rimfire benchrest shooters have been clamped to the muzzle for the very purpose of avoiding altering the muzzle by threading.

Is there any device that must be threaded on the barrel that adds improved performance to a barrel that can otherwise shoot well?

Threading a .22LR muzzle seems to serve a dual purpose, neither of which is improved performance. One is the use of sound moderators, which of course are not legal in Canada. The other is to add devices for aesthetic or "tactical" appeal.
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Clearly many barrels arrive pre-threaded for other markets and most people just get what comes in the box..... others seeking to compete do other things I suppose, such as replace stock barrels with custom barrels, and measure out and sort ammo batches etc.

It would not make much sense for most people to take a winning barrel and modify it with threads to improve performance, just like it would not make sense to take a winning barrel that happened to be threaded and cut the threads off... why mess with a barrel that shoots lights out?
 
Personally I don't mind them I like to use them but I only have them on certain rifles for muzzle brakes which will control recoil in higher calibers for example I had it on a 300 win mag
 
I have a Tikka T3x that came threaded from factory with a thread cap and muzzle brake. I didn't think I'd use the brake at all since it was a hunting rifle but I find myself using it all the time now. With a 6-7lb gun I can shoot it all day without discomfort then quickly put the cap on and rezero for hunting.
 
Rodder said:
I have a Tikka T3x that came threaded from factory with a thread cap and muzzle brake. I didn't think I'd use the brake at all since it was a hunting rifle but I find myself using it all the time now. With a 6-7lb gun I can shoot it all day without discomfort then quickly put the cap on and rezero for hunting.
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Just out of curiosity, how much point of impact difference are you experiencing between the two. Is it just elevation or windage as well? Thanks
 
Can-down said:
Clearly many barrels arrive pre-threaded for other markets and most people just get what comes in the box..... others seeking to compete do other things I suppose, such as replace stock barrels with custom barrels, and measure out and sort ammo batches etc.

It would not make much sense for most people to take a winning barrel and modify it with threads to improve performance, just like it would not make sense to take a winning barrel that happened to be threaded and cut the threads off... why mess with a barrel that shoots lights out?
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Indeed. The bottom line remains that, although rifles with threaded muzzles get shipped here anyway, the rimfire world in Canada would not suffer for unthreaded muzzles. When it comes to performance they don't add a thing.

The only performance-enhancing muzzle device, the tuner, could be manufactured to be clamped on. Anything else is for appearances only.
 
grauhanen said:
Indeed. The bottom line remains that, although rifles with threaded muzzles get shipped here anyway, the rimfire world in Canada would not suffer for unthreaded muzzles. When it comes to performance they don't add a thing.

The only performance-enhancing muzzle device, the tuner, could be manufactured to be clamped on. Anything else is for appearances only.
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What kind of clamp on tuners do you like?

I think it would be hard to compare threaded to non threaded barrels for their innate accuracy as some barrels, even from the same run, same gun, shoot better then others, likely due to small differences in harmonics.

Your suggestion that a threaded barrel reduces accuracy is a new concept for me.
 
Can-down said:
What kind of clamp on tuners do you like?

I think it would be hard to compare threaded to non threaded barrels for their innate accuracy as some barrels, even from the same run, same gun, shoot better then others, likely due to small differences in harmonics.

Your suggestion that a threaded barrel reduces accuracy is a new concept for me.
Click to expand...

Until relatively recently, rimfire barrel tuners have been clamped to the muzzle. Tuners were first used among rimfire benchrest shooters. Among the most widely used is the Harrell rimfire tuner. Other tuners include Hoehn, Ezell, Holeshot, DiOrio, FAT Cigognani, Lowey, Starik, Bee Sting to name a few others -- all clamp on.

Only in recent years have threaded tuners become more widely available. This is likely due to the growth of .22LR shooting games such as PRS and the desire to improve results with the relatively anemic performance of the cartridge at long distances. And here, as elsewhere, tuners can't make mediocre ammo into something else.

You claim that my "suggestion that a threaded barrel reduces accuracy is a new concept for me." It ought to be a new concept because you just made it up or didn't read very carefully. To be absolutely clear, I didn't say that threaded muzzles reduce accuracy. I said they do nothing to improve it. As noted previously, no one threads a muzzle to improve accuracy.
 
grauhanen said:
Until relatively recently, rimfire barrel tuners have been clamped to the muzzle. Tuners were first used among rimfire benchrest shooters. Among the most widely used is the Harrell rimfire tuner. Other tuners include Hoehn, Ezell, Holeshot, DiOrio, FAT Cigognani, Lowey, Starik, Bee Sting to name a few others -- all clamp on.

Only in recent years have threaded tuners become more widely available. This is likely due to the growth of .22LR shooting games such as PRS and the desire to improve results with the relatively anemic performance of the cartridge at long distances. And here, as elsewhere, tuners can't make mediocre ammo into something else.

You claim that my "suggestion that a threaded barrel reduces accuracy is a new concept for me." It ought to be a new concept because you just made it up or didn't read very carefully. To be absolutely clear, I didn't say that threaded muzzles reduce accuracy. I said they do nothing to improve it. As noted previously, no one threads a muzzle to improve accuracy.
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Thanks for clearing that up, I misunderstood your point by "they do nothing to improve accuracy". Barrel harmonics is interesting, and mounting different devices to a threaded barrel will alter harmonics.

The concept of barrel tuners first came to my attention only after Ruger offered them on the target model of their mini's 14's.

When it comes to .22lr's it seems that for what ever reason some ammo will shoot better then others and it's not strictly based on the grade of the ammo. Clearly independent factors are involved beyond the target or plinking grade of the ammo. Serious target shooters that weigh and measure rims etc, should also use premium ammo that works with their gun. The tuners do offer the ability to fine tune things and possibly make the search for "the best" ammo an easier thing.

Has anyone tried composite tuners? Seems like it could be a good 3-D printer project.

Thanks again for the list of clamp on tuners to check out!
 
Can-down said:
What kind of clamp on tuners do you like?

I think it would be hard to compare threaded to non threaded barrels for their innate accuracy as some barrels, even from the same run, same gun, shoot better then others, likely due to small differences in harmonics.

Your suggestion that a threaded barrel reduces accuracy is a new concept for me.
Click to expand...
I think IBI barrels has some reservations about threaded Rimfire barrels providing the best accuracy too.
 
Longstud said:
Just out of curiosity, how much point of impact difference are you experiencing between the two. Is it just elevation or windage as well? Thanks
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My tikka has a fluted pencil barrel which may play a part but my POI changes by almost 2ft if I remember right. Next time I take it out I should do some testing and see if the POI change is consistent.
 
Very good summary.
The compensator on my 10/22 will suffice.
The Remington has a Harrell Tuner. Ammo is tested prior to purchase of any quantities then the tuner is put back on to make good ammo better.
The selection of ammo is such that only so much can be ordered and guarantee a case is available when testing is complete.
This make finding "better" ammo and tuning to make it the "best" somewhat unlikely.
The Coopers are sporters and will stay as is. ARA and local hunter rules do not allow any attachments to the barrel.
 
There have been studies performed that prove that a reduction in the outside diameter of the barrel causes an increase to the inside diameter of the barrel.

The smaller you turn the OD the larger the ID will get. Now this ID growth may not be enough for you to notice an affect on accuracy, but it does occur at least to some degree.

Bottom line is that if you are in control of the muzzle threading, make sure you specify the largest practical thread size to minimize the effect of this phenomenon.
 
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