Tikka T3x TAC A1 Factory Muzzle Brake Installation - Orientation and Indexing Issue

thegazelle

thegazelle

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Hi there:

Hopefully someone can help steer me in the right direction here. I don't see anything in the manual to address this.

Just got this rifle today. Installing the factory included muzzle brake. Manual says to just screw it in until it tightens and then tighten the fastening screw, which I can see will clamp it tight, with the slit closing.

Initially when I did this, and at hand tightness (it just stops so I don't think it can turn any further), it turns out that the brake is upside down and on a slight angle (ports not pointing to 9 and 3 o'clock but more 8 and 2 o'clock. But it's upside down). See photos below.

According to the manual when the orientation is correct, the mirage strap fitting screw (the small flathead one) should be facing up with the gas exhaust ports on the sides.

I can turn it a half turn back so that the flat screw faces up and the slit part is at the bottom, and then tighten the fastening screw, but no matter how much I crank that thing fastening scrw bolt/screw, it will not clamp the muzzle brake tight and it can turn easily.

I know with other muzzle brakes on other guns, this would happen if the crush washer wasn't installed, but I didn't see a crush washer included.

I have included some photos of what it looks like when tightened all the way on the threads by hand as per the manual (it can't be threaded beyond this). That slit you see is supposed to be on the underside.

That mirage strap fitting screw makes no difference in tightening as it is already at the tightest.

Is there a trick I am missing to get this orientation right and tightened? Thanks in advance for any assistance.

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Just index it and tighten the bolt. Don't over tighten the mirage band scew...it does nothing.
 
If I understand you? you are expecting the "brake" to time @ TDC? , it won't, after it "bottoms out" turn it counter clockwise to get the mirage screw @ TDC & tighten. U can use a small bubble level to get it level and apply some blue loctite if you choose. Cheers.

From the pics it looks like the brake screw is "captured" on the other side of the slit? just make sure? if it is?, maybe the brake itself is defective?
 
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Level the rifle with a level on the top rail and index the top seam on the brake to 12:00 and tighten the screws. The brake doesn't have to be bottomed out on the barrel.
 
b_w. said:
Just index it and tighten the bolt. Don't over tighten the mirage band scew...it does nothing.
Click to expand...

Yeah this is the problem. After indexing it I have tightened the bolt with as much force as I can muster with my allen key. It doesn't seem to make any difference as the brake can still turn either way VERY EASILY. It is possible I have a defective brake, but whenever these happen, I always always presume I am doing something wrong. I did see one video of someone installing the same brake on a CTR and when they hand tightened it, it indexed right where it should be and what it says in the manual.

I will check the box to see if the parts bag has a crush washer or something else that I need. I will never presume something is defective until I exhaust all avenues of what I could have done wrong.
 
mildot said:
If I understand you? you are expecting the "brake" to time @ TDC? , it won't, after it "bottoms out" turn it counter clockwise to get the mirage screw @ TDC & tighten. U can use a small bubble level to get it level and apply some blue loctite if you choose. Cheers.

From the pics it looks like the brake screw is "captured" on the other side of the slit? just make sure? if it is?, maybe the brake itself is defective?
Click to expand...

I don't think the fastening screw is captured as I am able to completely remove it. I think the problem of having to hand tighten it and then counter twist it so it is indexed is that the turn is way too much to get to that point so the brake is very loose and any tightening of the fastener bolt yields no effect.

Even if I were to leave it upside down and then turn it slightly to index it (upside down) and then tighten the fastener, it doesn't stay in place.

Whereas if I were to hand tighten the brake to its maximum point and then tighten the fastening screw, it keeps it in place and I can't hand-unscrew it. So it works as designed if it is hand tightened, but then the orientation is wrong (upside down) and it is on a slight 8/2 o'clock angle. Can I use it this way?
 
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You may? need to "squeeze" the MB in a vise so that the screw can start on the other side of the slit, if you say, you can remove the screw without unscrewing it?. I installed one of these & like I stated, the "best" way is to bottom it out, turn it counter clockwise and level and then torque the screw to the factory specs. If at the last step the screw keeps "spinning' and doesn't snug up? then the MB is defective or the screw isn't captured on the the brake. Just an FYI are you using/have the right screw in? the MB
 
mildot said:
You may? need to "squeeze" the MB in a vise so that the screw can start on the other side of the slit, if you say, you can remove the screw without unscrewing it?. I installed one of these & like I stated, the "best" way is to bottom it out, turn it counter clockwise and level and then torque the screw to the factory specs. If at the last step the screw keeps "spinning' and doesn't snug up? then the MB is defective or the screw isn't captured on the the brake. Just an FYI are you using/have the right screw in? the MB
Click to expand...

Thanks for your feedback. No, I am not saying I can take the screw out without unscrewing it - I have to unscrew it counterclockwise, but then after a while it just comes out (maybe I don't understand the captive screw term - I am unfortunately not handy whatsoever).

I believe I am using the right screw since it was already in the muzzle brake half screwed in when I took it out of the package. I checked the rest of the package, and there are a set of 4 other screws that came in a baggie but they are WAYYYY too long and appear too thick to go in the MB. Perhaps spare for the receiver or something.

Yeah, what you suggest is how I believe it should be done, but even after doing that the muzzle brake doesn't tighten whatsoever even on the maximum torque I can muster. But the fact that I had to turn it close to 180 degrees counterclockwise to get it to that indexed level may be too much play or unthreaded too much for any tightening to make a difference. I totally understand the concept of what I need to do - it's just achieving the expected result. the screw does snug up - well it stops turning at a certain torque level, but the muzzle brake at that point can turn clockwise and counterclockwise without any resistance.
 
Maybe buy a better brake?

That seems to be a pretty poor way of timing a brake, and I've heard gunsmiths say that it's not a good idea to "pinch" the bore, such as with devices that utilize a bolt to clamp onto the barrel.

Lots of good self timing brakes out there. If it was me, I would ditch that brake and put a more proper one on.
 
kthomas said:
Maybe buy a better brake?

That seems to be a pretty poor way of timing a brake, and I've heard gunsmiths say that it's not a good idea to "pinch" the bore, such as with devices that utilize a bolt to clamp onto the barrel.

Lots of good self timing brakes out there. If it was me, I would ditch that brake and put a more proper one on.
Click to expand...

Yeah I would do that if I can confirm it's just not something dumb that I am missing. My other guns have Lantac Dragon brakes and those are really good at reducing barrel rise...but at $229.99 + tax it's a bit steep at the moment...but the Dragon is really easy - install crush washer, thread in brake, tighten and done.

Part of the challenge (at least for me being very unhandy) is the fact that the Tikka manual unlike most manuals are devoid of illustrative pictures to accompany the instruction steps. Perhaps it presumes that the owner has a certain degree of technical handiness and aptitude, which in my case is an extremely poor assumption.

Thank you very much for your feedback so far, everyone. I am going to keep playing around with this
 
Yeah, so I am convinced it's not me. Everything the manual and everyone else describes is exactly how it should be, but it mounts upside down. So what you see in the photos with how mine is laid out when fully hand tightened - the orientation is 8 and 2 o'clock. If I just counter turn it just a wee bit and straighten out so the gas ports are 9 and 3 o'clock (very slight turn), and then tighten the fastening bolt, it secures it perfectly. This is exactly what the manual says to do but my orientation is just reversed. I have tried all sorts of stuff, even to the point of using a different screw - it makes no difference. The over 180 degree counterclockwise turn to put it to the right orientation does not work with fastener bolt doing nothing to tighten it.

Here's a video of a guy putting the same muzzle brake on a T3x CTR...you can see that when he hand tights it (2:30 of video), it indexes pretty much exactly what the end orientation should be (mirage strap screw facing up) and then it's just a minor adjustment, if any, before tightening the fastening screw.

However, when I hand tighten mine, the end point where it stops is reversed and I end up what you see in the photos (slit facing up, mirage screw facing down). I can then slightly turn it to get the slit to face up. And then tighten the fastener which retains everything in place.

[youtube]aV2bHRLLLJo[/youtube]


I am not going to return the gun just because of this. I am wondering whether I can possibly use this muzzle brake upside down like this - gas ports are still exhausting on the side but I suspect if it could be used either way, there wouldn't be in the instructions a "proper" orientation.
 
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Muzzle brakes can be very frustrating. Buy one with a lock nut and don't look back! I really like my MDT brake and the price is very reasonable. There are other more popular or "renowned" options, but can be harder to source and more $.
 
I think you guys are right. I ordered what I thought were the proper crush washers for my barrel: 1/2 - 28. They showed up and I tried them and can't even get them on the barrel. I give up. Gonna either run this brake upside down (doesn't seem like there's an orientation problem as the holes seem to point the same way whether it's right side up or upside down, or order one of the brakes you guys suggested.
 
You muzzle is a 5/8-24 I believe. If you can't tighten the screw then the brake itself may be "stripped" see if you can get another via the warranty, Stoeger are pretty good IIRC.
 
mildot said:
You muzzle is a 5/8-24 I believe. If you can't tighten the screw then the brake itself may be "stripped" see if you can get another via the warranty, Stoeger are pretty good IIRC.
Click to expand...

This is really bizarre...

My T3X TAC A1 is clearly a .223. I confirmed that on the barrel stamp. Apparently most .223s run with 1/2 x 28. I thought maybe the washers are defective, so...

I took the original muzzle brake for my WK180 (5.56/.223) and it does not fit onto the Tikka.

I took my Lantac Dragon 5.56/.223 muzzle brake off my WK now, and it doesn't fit the Tikka.

I thought that the 5/8 -24 is for .308 or 6.5 or thereabouts. Mine is a .223.
 
mildot said:
You muzzle is a 5/8-24 I believe. If you can't tighten the screw then the brake itself may be "stripped" see if you can get another via the warranty, Stoeger are pretty good IIRC.
Click to expand...

You are absolutely right...I just looked at the box sticker and it says on the sticker:

T3x RH 223REM TACT A1 FS NS 10RD MB 24in MT5/8-24

So it looks like I need either a 5/8 -24 shim or crush washer to make this work. OR I use it upside down
 
Well, thank you to the poster who suggested the MDT brake.

I went to one of the LGS today and picked up 5/8 - 24 crush washers. While there, I saw the MDT brake on the shelf so just in case the crush washer did not work, I bought the MDT Elite 5/8 - 24 brake as well.

Got home, put the crush washer one and then put the Tikka brake on. Turned the brake all the way and now it is obviously not upside down but on a weird angle. It was about a 45 degree turn counterclockwise to put it back to the indexed point, so I did and then started tightening the fastener screw. Was not surprised that it did not tighten anything as the brake could still be turned either way on the threads. At that point I realized I was spending way too much time on this, opened up the MDT Elite brake, put it on and got it all balanced. Looks lovely! This is how it should be. Quick and easy.

I have installed a number of brakes before, but until this Tikka one with this "pinch and collar" method, I have never had a problem. The guy at the store said yes, it should be easy to install the Tikka brake, but mine is likely defective because when hand tightened, that mirage screw should always end up near 12 o'clock when it can't be tightened any more. But mine does the exact opposite with the bottom facing up. And by virtue of the design, there is no way anyone can tighten it another 180 degrees when it stops cold, and if you loosen it 180 degrees, it just wiggles and then the fastening screw is useless anyways.

The MDT Elite has two flat sides (top and bottom) so it's easy to use a bubble leveler and make adjustments. Got it all working and it looks LOVELY!

Thanks to everyone for their input and assistance on this one!
 
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