Tikka vs Lee Enfield

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boxcoach

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Strange day at the range.

I took my new T3 Lite 30-06 out to the back 40, to sight in, today. Took along my Lee Enfield Jungle Carbine, which I bought last year, and hadn't fired yet. I hadn't fired a high powered rifle in over 10 years, so wasn't expecting anything spectacular. The Tikka performed as expected. Only took half a box of ammo to get it zero'd well enough for hunting.

Wasn't expecting much from the old 303, especially since my eyes aren't what they used to be, and military peep sights weren't meant for MOA accuracy. Man, was I surprised! My first shots were at 25 yards, just to make sure it was close. Two shots in bullseye, so I switched to 100 yards. Two 3 shot groups, under 3 inches, within 3 inches of bullseye! I asked my friend to give it a try(his eyes are even older than mine), and he had similar results.

I started comparing targets, and the difference between the $800 Tikka, and the 1945 Lee Enfield was marginal in the real world. Made me wonder why I felt the need to spend $1100, just to shoot deer. I know the old girl isn't up to 300 yard shots, or rather, my eyes and the open sights aren't up to it. I had to think back almost 50 years, but I remember my dad shooting a deer at almost 300 yards, with open sights. I think, sometimes, all the shooting aids can diminish our shooting skills.

As far as the Tikka is concerned, nice trigger, nice action, and nicely balanced. Having second thoughts about the "Lite" version. Even with 30-06, it kicks pretty hard.
 
boxcoach said:
Strange day at the range.

I took my new T3 Lite 30-06 out to the back 40, to sight in, today. Took along my Lee Enfield Jungle Carbine, which I bought last year, and hadn't fired yet. I hadn't fired a high powered rifle in over 10 years, so wasn't expecting anything spectacular. The Tikka performed as expected. Only took half a box of ammo to get it zero'd well enough for hunting.

Wasn't expecting much from the old 303, especially since my eyes aren't what they used to be, and military peep sights weren't meant for MOA accuracy. Man, was I surprised! My first shots were at 25 yards, just to make sure it was close. Two shots in bullseye, so I switched to 100 yards. Two 3 shot groups, under 3 inches, within 3 inches of bullseye! I asked my friend to give it a try(his eyes are even older than mine), and he had similar results.

I started comparing targets, and the difference between the $800 Tikka, and the 1945 Lee Enfield was marginal in the real world. Made me wonder why I felt the need to spend $1100, just to shoot deer. I know the old girl isn't up to 300 yard shots, or rather, my eyes and the open sights aren't up to it. I had to think back almost 50 years, but I remember my dad shooting a deer at almost 300 yards, with open sights. I think, sometimes, all the shooting aids can diminish our shooting skills.

As far as the Tikka is concerned, nice trigger, nice action, and nicely balanced. Having second thoughts about the "Lite" version. Even with 30-06, it kicks pretty hard.
Click to expand...

And the jungle carbine is not renowned for its accuracy. Try a good no.4 and you would probably shoot even better.
 
I started comparing targets, and the difference between the $800 Tikka, and the 1945 Lee Enfield was marginal in the real world.
Click to expand...

Every tikka that I have fired did sub moa, which I consider a very significant difference compareed to 3moa.
 
With everyone moving towards lighter and lighter rifles, the old concept that was based on an 8 pound rifle, that most non-shooting adults could manage a .30/06 might have passed. A hot loaded .30/06 in a 6 pound rifle is more then some can enjoy, in fact it can be down right unpleasant, unless you underload it. The small bore guys keep telling me that a .243 can do anything an '06 can do, so maybe that's the way to go in a light rifle. I'm not quite ready to accept that yet, so I'll just keep shooting my 8 pound .30/06. It hits what I point it at and doesn't pound me doing it; when I want to get pounded I have bigger rifles. A 6.5X55 in the Tikka would make a nice hunting rifle though.

I've had a love hate relationship with Lee Enfield rifles throughout my life. I want to love em, but the one's I've owned haven't loveed me back. The best one I ever owned was a Churchill Arms #4 sporter, stocked in beautifully figured walnut that belonged on a high class custom rifle, not on a $60 K-Mart Special. I should have kept it, but didn't but charitably it was a 4 minute rifle. My issue rifle when I was in the Rangers was worse and the bedding was so soft I could push my finger through the wood. I ordered a new stock at my own expense, but no matter what I tried, I couldn't get that old 2 groove Long Branch to shoot. A pal of mine was shooting 100 yard MOA groups on demand from prone with his, which did my self confidence no good what so ever. I would have to pull out my old M-17 .30/06 to convince myself that I could still shoot, if it wasn't for that ole girl, I'd have probably taken up knitting.
 
If you can't handle the recoil of a Tikka in 30-06...then never buy a 300 Weatherby...a guy could put a brake on the Tikka if need be...
 
I can't even begin to brag or nag on those old war relics.
The ole pop of mine hated them with a passion.
I never got the chance to flavor the flavor.
Even at my age, I still don't have one in my locker.
I know where one is, just need to find a brown one and go git it.
Not sure what the Schultz or Mauser's or Brno would have to say
being kept in company with such, such, well for such a piece....... :p
 
My full wood No4, mk1*, will hold 1.5MOA, clear out to 500M, with good handloads. All I need to do this is the proper lighting, and perscription glasses specifically made for shooting iron sights (give up a bit of distance clarity, so that the sights are sharper)

So don't think the LE platform wont shoot.

Now even with collet dies I only get at the most 5 loadings per case before incipent head seperation causes me to toss them.I could back the load off but the load I've chose is the most accurate and brass is relatively cheap anyways.

Now take my 7mm-08 T3, I have.
It will shoot 1/2moa quite regularly, with numerous loadings, ranging from 120gr. to 162gr.
With optics I have far better low light performance over iron sights. Can wear my distance perscription contact lenses. (much better for hunting)
I am currently on the 7th loading for some of the cases I have for this rifle, and it doesn't look like the brass will be failing in anyway any time soon.

Sure I could hunt with my No4, but I feel it gives up a bit too much to be a great hunting rifle, as opposed to an OK hunting rifle.
 
The long whippy barrels of the Lee Enfields are a bit of a nightmare to properly bed. However, the military armourors who specialized in the match target rifles could get them to the 1 moa area.
But a cut down stock, leaving that long, slim barrel hanging out, was another story. Four inch groups at 100 yards is about par for the course.
Those armoury conversions Boomer mentioned are another story again. I have had the Churchill Arms he mentions. On it, the barrel was cut to 20 inches and this so stiffens the barrel that it groups much better.
I also have the English armoury cut down #4 MK 1 which is marked "SUSSEX," with the barrel cut to 19.5". The Sussex ones are reputed to have been made from better rifles. All these conversions come with Lyman aperture sights and are actually quite a nice little rifle.
I originally got mine as my protection gun in the bush. It is pretty close to ideal for that purpose. Short, fast handling, lots of power, the optimum of reliability, plus the ability to keep the full magazine in your pocket until you leave the quad, or truck, to walk in the bush, then slip the mag into the rifle.
One woud not be handicapped in using it for about 90% of hunting situations.
 
I thought the non 'Lite' versions of the Tikka were only marginally heavier than lite. I handled the laminate and certainly seemed heavier than the synthetic one but the specs would make it look like it was barely heavier. Wish they made the Varmint version in wood.

The only way to feel what the recoil is like on a 30-06 or a .308 for me is likely to find someone that has one and try it.

How do the rest of you guys find the Tikka's for bench rest shooting? A Limbsaver on my Benelli Nova reduced recoil by quite a bit so I'd definitely get one if I got a light rifle.
 
Try this folks...take the glass off the Tikka and mount irons on it, if using peeps, then make sure the orifice is the same diameter.

Shoot the thing. And then, shoot my Enfield #4 Mk2 with the designed bullet of 174 grains.

I did a comparison like that. I used my former Ruger #1 (30-06) with sights, my 308 Wby (irons), my M14 (irons) and my former Marlin 30-30 with 125 gr bullets (irons). I used a sandbag for a rest.

The results were indeed astonishing. My eyeballs did not change, nor did the wind. I used 10 shots with a little barrel cool down time in between.

The Enfield with elevator peep and the Marlin consistently hit the 10" gong. 10 for 10 with the Enfield, and 9 wit the Marlin.

The Wby 308 (with Williams irons on it) and the M14 hit about 3/4 of the time. (7 and 6 shots respectively).

The Ruger missed half - in my opinion, due to the poor sight picture. (four shots hit - but some were flyers due to the amount of guessing for the sight picture).

With glass mounted, the Ruger and Wby were 10 for 10.
 
I only ever had of those old Lee's. It came in an estate sale. It was kinda interesting in the looks department, she was a carbine with the funnel on the end of the barrel. I only shot it a few times. Kept her for quite some time. A buddy saw it in the safe one day and fell in love. Didn't take long to transfer it to his name. He still has it and likes it. However he doesn't hunt with it anymore. I would buy another one, in the same model, if one comes along for a "can't say no" price! or take it on a swap. Oldest son had a Tikka T-3 in 308, he liked it lots and would have kept it if it had been in a more interesting cal to him.
 
My dad's old Enfield, which I still have, shoots the first two shots of the day accurately
and within 1.5 moa. The third shot is well out there, and forget the fourth! I think I
found the reason, a casting defect, a rough area on the left side of the barrel about
60% down towards the muzzle. As the barrel gets hotter, it bends at this defect and
the POI shifts. Not a big deal for hunting, as you very rarely if ever need a third shot.
It wouldn't be fun in a combat situation though...:)
 
Full discosure: I looked for a long time before buying this Lee Enfield. It has a really bright bore, and no wear on the action. I paid a premium price for it, at Armco. Gunnar delivers the goods. Still, it was built in 1945, to military specs.
 
kamlooky said:
I can't even begin to brag or nag on those old war relics.
The ole pop of mine hated them with a passion.
I never got the chance to flavor the flavor.
Even at my age, I still don't have one in my locker.
I know where one is, just need to find a brown one and go git it.
Not sure what the Schultz or Mauser's or Brno would have to say
being kept in company with such, such, well for such a piece....... :p
Click to expand...

Was he perchance on the receiving end of them at some time?;)

What's to say? They're great rifles, look right, feel right and shoot right. I've only ever owned one K98 a "nice" bcd4 in a laminated stock. The thing was horrific: heavy, miserable sights, slow bolt, mediocre safety, no half-####, the list goes on and on. But a P14 or M17? Best of both worlds if you ignore the five round mag and lack of half-####.

If the Enfields were coming onto the market now in the condition of the Moisins for example, you'd never see the end of the threads on forums like this one, saying how fantastic, yadda, yadda.
 
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