TNW troubleshooting thread

That's too bad, I was hoping for an easy fix.

Maybe a dumb question, but have you checked for debris where the threaded portion ends inside the receiver?

Yes I have checked and cleaned the threads. I wish I could upload pictures with my phone but it says my file size exceeds what's allowed.

Ugh frustrating. Imgur seems to no longer allow me to upload either.

I am able to get the barrel to tighten down if I put a piece of steel wire wrapped around the barrel so that the barrel nut crushes it against the conical surface the nut engages on.

This is where a picture would really help...

If there was some thin conical washer I could put in there to solve the problem I would just do that and be done with it. I don't want to use a piece of wire because I don't believe it will be repeatable for attaching the barrel and I'd need to sight in every time.

Just trying to provide as much info as possible.

Is it something as simple as a barrel nut that's worn out or out of spec?
 
Not sure , to be honest.

Maybe you can get a permanent fix by removing material from the end of the barrel nut, so that it doesn't bottom out so early inside the receiver. (If that's where the interference is happening)
 
Not sure , to be honest.

Maybe you can get a permanent fix by removing material from the end of the barrel nut, so that it doesn't bottom out so early inside the receiver. (If that's where the interference is happening)

No, don't remove any material from the back of the barrel nut! The taper which pushes the matching flange on the barrel into the receiver starts at the back edge. There is no 'extra' material there to trim. It is not possible for the barrel nut to 'bottom out' on anything, as the back end of the barrel nut only contacts the barrel flange. If the nut stops prematurely and the barrel is still loose, something else is going on, it's not the barrel nut at fault. There are threads going several millimetres past where the barrel nut should be clamping the barrel tightly into place. It's just not possible for the back of the barrel nut to both push on the barrel flange, and bump into anything - the barrel flange itself would prevent it from contacting anything else. So either something is out of spec in your rifle (unlikely, as you say it worked previously), or something has been introduced into the threads or receiver somewhere else, causing this issue.

Without images we're left guessing. I use my personal domain, luthier.ca, for image hosting. But imgbb works fine, is free, and easy to use.
 
No, don't remove any material from the back of the barrel nut! The taper which pushes the matching flange on the barrel into the receiver starts at the back edge. There is no 'extra' material there to trim. It is not possible for the barrel nut to 'bottom out' on anything, as the back end of the barrel nut only contacts the barrel flange. If the nut stops prematurely and the barrel is still loose, something else is going on, it's not the barrel nut at fault.

I don't have it in front of me, so I can't disagree about how the taper engages the flange. From what you've posted previously, I have no reason to doubt you.

I agree that that is how it is supposed to work, but that's not how Vik's is working. Easiest would be for him to try a different barrel assembly in his receiver, but maybe that's not an option.

Maybe it's possible to send him relevant measurements of the barrel nut, and relative positions of the nut on the barrel when in the engaged position. Mine is a 45ACP, so I wouldn't count on it being the same.
 
Well as I mentioned earlier, with my 9mm ASR there is room to screw the barrel nut 4.5mm further into the receiver if the barrel is not in place. That's a rather generous amount of extra thread in the receiver before the nut contacts a step, where the hole in the receiver becomes several millimetres smaller internal diameter. I thought about posting other measurements, but concluded that there's not much point doing so, owing to this extra space, and to the fact that the taper interface between barrel nut and barrel flange has no overlap, no place where contact could be made between that step in the receiver tube and the barrel nut. And there's no increase in diameter in the barrel nut ahead of the threads, either. The largest diameter on the barrel nut is the threads, so it should just keep on tightening until the barrel flange hits that step and stops. I don't see what could get in the way of such a simple assembly.
 
When I said the nut was "bottoming out", I meant that the nut reached the end of the threads in the receiver. I tested this by putting a piece of wire around the barrel so the nut clamps the wire against the barrel. This spaced the nut out far enough to clamp the barrel before the nut reached the end of the threads in the receiver.

That imgbb site seems to work for me but my post edits disappear when I switch tabs in my phones browser. I'll get on my pc tonight when I get home and get some pictures uploaded.

I am wondering if the screw that locates the barrel could be somehow damaged or undersized?

I have thought about this before but couldn't find a spec online to measure the screw against and I also couldn't find a place to buy it.
 
Just tool my barrel alignment/barrel stop grub screw out to measure tip diameter. Mine's 6.2mm on average, slightly oval but only varying about 0.02mm from narrowest to widest. That translates to an average of about 0.245". I slightly domed and quickly buffed the tip of mine early on, as it had rather sharp edges which I thought might gradually scrape the barrel slot for no good reason. I installed it again, as always, with a dab of medium thread locking compound in the threads, ran it right up to where it locked the barrel in place, then backed it off about 1/6 of a turn.

TNW_ASR_barrel_alignment_stop_bolt.jpg
 
Interesting - Mine is a different design, with a grub screw, spring, and floating pin. Different generations, I suppose.

Huh? Mine had that too. I'm not showing nor talking about the tiny grub screw which acts as a ratchet on the little ridges around the barrel nut. This is one of the two, identically dimensioned, larger grub screws which are behind that tiny one up front. One guides the bolt, running in the slot along the top of the bolt. The other acts to locate the chamber by fixing its stop against the grub screw's cylindrical portion, as the slot in the top of the barrel bottoms out.

The tiny one with spring and pin perform no other function than to make a little ratcheting noise when you're tightening or loosening the barrel nut... and theoretically, I guess, to offer some slight resistance to unscrewing, but it doesn't really do that, hence the barrel nut generally coming loose. That's why I replaced this one with a fatter pin and heavy spring, after making the hole larger in steps and threading the top end of it for a larger, drilled grub screw, trimmed to just a short threaded ring. That retains the spring for my barrel nut lock.
 
Hi Guys,

A user reached out and offered to post up some pictures for me because I'm clearly too much of an idiot to do so myself.

I saw someone post the size of the front grub screw. Are the front and rear ones the same size?? If not it could be possible that I put the rear one in the front and it's undersized?

Once I track down my calipers I will pull mine out and measure it. Hopefully Buster95 posts soon with the pictures that I emailed him.
 
Hi Guys,

A user reached out and offered to post up some pictures for me because I'm clearly too much of an idiot to do so myself.

I saw someone post the size of the front grub screw. Are the front and rear ones the same size?? If not it could be possible that I put the rear one in the front and it's undersized?

Once I track down my calipers I will pull mine out and measure it. Hopefully Buster95 posts soon with the pictures that I emailed him.

No, the two are identical, at least in my rifle.
 
Hi Guys,

A user reached out and offered to post up some pictures for me because I'm clearly too much of an idiot to do so myself.

I saw someone post the size of the front grub screw. Are the front and rear ones the same size?? If not it could be possible that I put the rear one in the front and it's undersized?

Once I track down my calipers I will pull mine out and measure it. Hopefully Buster95 posts soon with the pictures that I emailed him.

Here are the pics ;)

z1nHPsH.jpg


EauQYAL.jpg


MFEFlog.jpg


6TQEHgA.jpg
 
I'm puzzled when comparing description of the problem with the pictures.

The threads shown, with the small pin poking out (which makes the little ratcheting noise when turning the barrel nut), seem to go to the same depth as in mine, which is to say the threading goes well beyond where they need to go, as the barrel nut just doesn't need to go that far into the receiver. The little pin is located in the same place, and should end up at about the middle of the ridged area at the end, beyond the threaded part of the barrel nut.

I suppose it's possible that the little pin is actually small enough, or the holes in the barrel nut used for accessing the barrel nut retaining spring (a circle of spring) with a small punch to remove it from its interior groove are large enough, that the ratchet pin is falling into one of those holes... stopping the barrel nut from turning before it's fully tightened on the barrel flange. But that would then jam, making it impossible to remove the barrel nut without removing the small grub screw, spring, then somehow fishing out the little ratchet pin, so this seems very unlikely.

I don't understand the bendy looking loop of wire around the barrel flange would help, considering that all other dimensions and threaded depth seem to be correct. Is it the spring clip which was supposed to be mounted in the barrel nut groove, retaining the barrel nut such that it can't slide past the slightly enlarged portion of the barrel just ahead of the flange? It looks too large in wire gauge to be that, though perhaps that's an illusion. The wire loop otherwise looks about right for that job. Mine measures 1.3mm in wire thickness, about 0.050". It is put in place by placing the loose barrel nut onto the barrel, within less than 1/2" of the tapered flange, with the spring clip already there ready for it. Then push the spring clip carefully into the taper at the back of the barrel nut with two small punches, one on either open end of the spring, holding the barrel nut firmly. Once the spring clip tips drop into the groove, slide the punches along either end of the spring around the barrel, towards each other, until the whole clip springs out into the barrel nut groove. Then the barrel nut is properly retained on the barrel, with about 1/2" of play forward and back.

I've stared at the images a while and can't see any other issue. Of course if that is the spring clip, then it is very bent, and needs to be straightened before it will go into the groove. Or you could cut almost a full circle (leave about a 1/8" gap) out of the same sized normal compression spring, clean up the ends with a file or Dremel burr, then follow the above procedure to install it. It's not a super important part - there's nothing wrong with the barrel nut coming all the way off - but it probably shouldn't be loose like that to tear up the aluminum taper of the barrel nut. You want full contact between the two tapers.
 
I'm puzzled when comparing description of the problem with the pictures.
I don't understand the bendy looking loop of wire around the barrel flange would help, considering that all other dimensions and threaded depth seem to be correct. Is it the spring clip which was supposed to be mounted in the barrel nut groove, retaining the barrel nut such that it can't slide past the slightly enlarged portion of the barrel just ahead of the flange?

It's not the spring clip. It's a piece of wire I put between the nut and the barrel to test if the nut is clamping the barrel in place properly. Putting that wire there, I can tighten down the nut and the barrel is tight. I can zero it and shoot all day long if I wanted and it maintains zero. However the next time I take the barrel off and put it back on, the optics will need to be zero'd again (because a random piece of wire doesn't have any repeatability).

As for things looking like they are in spec, that's expected because whatever is out of spec is only JUST out of spec. It needs to be measured but I don't know what parts are supposed to measure out to.
 
Okay, well from what you've shared so far, and knowing that consistently matching dimensions from batch to batch through various small revisions at TNW aren't likely, I'd suggest a slight modification. If it is truly the case that your barrel nut threads are bottoming out in the threaded receiver tube, preventing the nut from clamping the barrel tightly - and going from your wire shim testing, this does seem likely to be the case - I'd suggesting machining off the first turn of barrel nut thread. You could also try to use a huge tap and cut the threads a bit more deeply into the receiver, but as it's by far the more valuable part, you're better off trimming the barrel nut so the threads don't bottom out. That should still leave about 4 full turns to hold the barrel in place, more than enough. If you don't have a lathe and machining skills, find a machinist you trust to do the job. Shouldn't take more than a minute to set up and another minute to do the operation.

barrel_nut_trim_threads.jpg


Taking it down match, or to slightly less than the diameter of the knurled section, maybe 0.005" smaller OD, ought to be plenty to clear the tube at the end of the threads. A couple of minutes with a small file to clean up what will probably be a sharp edge on the new leading end of the threads will prevent it jamming when screwing it in, maybe a Dremel if you're handy with one of those.
 
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