Tokarev TT33 primer strike

Leviathan024

Leviathan024

CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Rating - 100%
66   0   0
Location
GP Alberta
Gun nutz,

my soviet TT33 seems to be striking primers at an angle. it appears as if the firing pin is hitting between the primer and case and "sliding" toward the center of the primer? is there something i can do to fix this issue?

thanks
 
Hi,

did you remove the firing pin ? if not, maybe you have old cosmoline (russian grease) ...very dense grease or small amonth of fire residu who is pushing the pin at angle.....
 
I soaked the slide a few times in cleaner and was hoping this would remove most if the cosmoline. I will try removing the pin but hoped i would not have to. It looks like a pain in the ass
 
It's common to all TT pistols.

There was this thread two months ago, if you want to read more. Is yours as pronounced as pictured?

Chances are it's striking centred (where the hole is in the slide) and wiping across as the barrel tilts when it un-locks slightly early in the cycle. You're not going to eliminate it, but start by stripping the pistol and cleaning it well; Soviets come caked in Cosmoline. Drive out the split pin holding the firing pin, remove the firing pin and spring, and blast some brake cleaner down the hole followed by a good pipe cleaner scrubbing of the firing pin channel, there will be Cosmo.

When Wolff (Gunsprings dot com) finally catches up and starts shipping to Canada again, you can get replacement recoil and firing pin springs from them. Cleaned and new springs is as good as you're gonna get, unless you re-load light charges for it.
 
red_bailey said:
It's common to all TT pistols.

There was this thread two months ago, if you want to read more. Is yours as pronounced as pictured?

Chances are it's striking centred (where the hole is in the slide) and wiping across as the barrel tilts when it un-locks slightly early in the cycle. You're not going to eliminate it, but start by stripping the pistol and cleaning it well; Soviets come caked in Cosmoline. Drive out the split pin holding the firing pin, remove the firing pin and spring, and blast some brake cleaner down the hole followed by a good pipe cleaner scrubbing of the firing pin channel, there will be Cosmo.

When Wolff (Gunsprings dot com) finally catches up and starts shipping to Canada again, you can get replacement recoil and firing pin springs from them. Cleaned and new springs is as good as you're gonna get, unless you re-load light charges for it.
Click to expand...

thanks that thread helped! My primer strikes look very similar. I will clean out the firing pin but my goal will be to find springs and a backup firin pin
 
Backup firing pins can be had from Numrich Arms in the US - the ONLY place that I could find Both the firing pin AND a willingness to ship to Canada (shipping ain't cheap, so buy some other stuff).

The replacement pins I have no idea if they are new or used (Numrich being the auto-wrecker of the gun world). They are different, though, in that they are flat top and bottom instead of round, and the taper near the front is different. I take it out tomorrow to see if it works or not.

Numrich fouled up my order. I also ordered a sling for my mauser. Got billed for it, but it did not arrive...

I'm curious to know how many others have fired more than 1k rounds through their Tok (with heavy pin wipe), and have had no breakage of the firing pin.
 
red_bailey said:
It's common to all TT pistols.

There was this thread two months ago, if you want to read more. Is yours as pronounced as pictured?

Chances are it's striking centred (where the hole is in the slide) and wiping across as the barrel tilts when it un-locks slightly early in the cycle. You're not going to eliminate it, but start by stripping the pistol and cleaning it well; Soviets come caked in Cosmoline. Drive out the split pin holding the firing pin, remove the firing pin and spring, and blast some brake cleaner down the hole followed by a good pipe cleaner scrubbing of the firing pin channel, there will be Cosmo.

When Wolff (Gunsprings dot com) finally catches up and starts shipping to Canada again, you can get replacement recoil and firing pin springs from them. Cleaned and new springs is as good as you're gonna get, unless you re-load light charges for it.
Click to expand...

Mine does this as well. I believe it's caused by the fact that the firing pin, unlike a 1911, extends from the primer, all the way back to the hammer. When the firing pin strikes the primer, it is held in place by the hammer, therefor when the barrel tilts down it drags the firing pin across the primer leaving the gouge. A 1911 has an inertia type of firing pin. It is too short to contact the hammer and primer at the same time and relies solely on forward inertia or it's own weight to carry it forward.
 
I wish I had confirmed your theory with my old pin. With my new one, when I have it flush with the breech block - where the hammer would hold it - it extends a fraction of a millimetre past the breech/bolt face (unsure of the terminology for pistols). I'm pretty certain that at least for this new one there will need to be some intertia effect to fire it - the old one produced deeper depressions in the primer than this one will be capable of otherwise. I'm off to the range soon. Hopefully I'll be able to find/capture a few spent casings to see what they look like. Probably have to hold a canvas bag up to the ejection port or some nonsense, since this thing spits casings into the next time zone.

I wonder if a heavier recoil spring would counter some of the effects of this too-hot ammo, and if Wolf would make them up...
 
The Numrich firing pin is too short. Hammer down it barely protrudes and I was getting nothing but light strikes and misfires galore

It does protrude far enough if you press it below the level of the hammer stop. I am thinking of cutting a few coils from the firing pin return spring to lighten it and allow for more momentum to carry it forward
 
Here is the explanation to these drag marks on primers.


In the picture there is two toks that I have. One that is on the left is a 1951 and the right is 1944
The 1951 has a notch on the hammer that when it is fired the hammer with this notch slows down the travel of the slide. This is just enough to jolt the firing pin back in to the channel and prevents it from contacting the rear of the cartridge after initial strike on the primer. While 1944 being earlier production gun has no notch and the drag marks are more common on cartridges that were fired in tokarev with early hammers.
type 54 and other post war tok variants have this notch. Polish toks are copy of earlier soviet toks and that is why they have these drag marks on primers.

g76
 
Interesting.

I was puzzling the problem of the too-short pin with my father. Since the pin is capable of traveling deep enough to impact the primer, I'm going to try building up the rear of it a thou or two as a test - just with some JB-weld and shim stock. Perhaps I can find a happy medium. If I can run a few mags before it fails, without misfires, then perhaps I can get someone with a TIG to put a small blob on the back of the pin and then file it to the right thickness for a permanent fix.
 
The thread mentioned by red_bailey is worth reading.
I replaced my Polish Tokarevs recoil spring with a Wolf recoil spring and the drag marks are still present.
I would say it is a design feature.
 
Mark II, what you described is perfectly normal and how most guns are fitted for firing pins. None of the pin should be sticking out the front face when the hammer is down. If it does then the guns would be unsafe to carry with the hammer down and a round chambered.

The normal method is for the firing pin to come back a little so it sticks out the rear a hair and the hammer strikes and it goes ahead and sets off the round by inertia only. It should then be short enough that when the spring pulls it back it retracts the nose of the pin to just even with or even a very slight hair back from the face of the slide.

So as long as it sticks out the rear enough for the hammer to hit the back of the FP and as long as the spring will let the front of the FP stick out the face then all is well.

Besides, JBWeld isn't some miracle goop. A little blob of it won't withstand strikes from the hammer for more than a couple of tries.

Now since you are getting misfires there's a few things you can do or check out. First off good primer strikes rely on a very fast and snappy motion of the hammer and firing pin. If your TT-33 is new and if you have not removed the firing pin to clean it out REALLY well then it could still have blobs of cosmoline inside. Any slight drag in the firing pin travel due to goop in the slide could easily slow down the pin enough to cause this issue. So get a proper pin punch and push out the retention pin and clean things inside really well. Once clean put the FP back in without the spring and check that it can easily slide back and forth with no signs of any dragginess at all. If there is any you'll need to find out if it's a burr inside the slide's FP channel or if the FP itself is bent or misformed.

Similarly soak the hammer and action assembly in a solvent for quite a while then blow out the mainspring area as best you can with brake cleaner. Cosmoline in the curved mainspring path could be slowing the hammer down just enough that it's not hitting the firing pin with enough energy AND SPEED to set off the primers. SPEED is what is needed more than actual power. It's the speed of the primer strike that sets the round off, not pressure. And any blobs of cosmo in the hammer or FP areas can produce enough viscous drag to damp down the speed of travel. Think waving your hand in air vs waving your hand in a big tub of water.
 
Last edited:
I know it's not a permanent fix - just something to try. I mentioned the possibility of weakening the firing pin return spring slightly in order that it soaks up less of the FP momentum in the store where I bought it and was given the impression of grave consequences if I did this. I still think that it's the best route, personally, and in the end I may very well end up with a Tok that BOTH operates reliably and eliminates the pin drag that must have contributed to the original pin failing.

If it doesn't work, then I'm no worse off, with a pistol that is still inoperable, and springs will certainly become available when Wolf resumes shipping.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom