Torture Test! Sig Legion P226 vs Rex Zero 1

gdawg said:
Seriously? You put your $1800 gun in worse conditions then submerged in sand, silt and water? 'Arguably' is probably the correct adverb
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The range I shoot at has a VERY dirty/dusty pistol bay, and shooting a carbine from various prone positions basically ensures that every orifice available on the gun gets packed with crap. Between doing that plus running 4-500 rounds through it while in that condition, and the fact that all this dude was lay his gun down in a container of sand, i'll use the word "arguably"

If you'd like, I can show you pictures of the wear and tear that my 229 Legion suffered last weekend, and you can be the judge. Hopefully i'm not talking out of my ass on this one, but I really did give it a tough couple days for its first test.

I will repeat that I am surprised by the results. I know nothing of this Rex gun, but I've shot a 226 or 229 a hell of a lot over the last year or so, and I think I've literally had one unintentional double feed in thousands of rounds through either. I agree with whoever said that a sample size of 1 isn't indicative of overall quality.
 
jory said:
Better sights, better trigger, PVD finish, undercut trigger guard, different beavertail, and glory.
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Not to mention the adjustable Bruce Gray P-SPIT trigger--this is not a trigger that would be subjected to over-the-beach testing.

Also, I will say the Legion finish is a bit gritty until worn in a bit--sort of sounds like a tiny bit of fine sand in the rails. I have not noticed this gritty feeling in any other new Classic P-Series pistol.
 
RC Fan said:
Not to mention the adjustable Bruce Gray P-SPIT trigger--this is not a trigger that would be subjected to over-the-beach testing.

Also, I will say the Legion finish is a bit gritty until worn in a bit--sort of sounds like a tiny bit of fine sand in the rails. I have not noticed this gritty feeling in any other new Classic P-Series pistol.
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Has your finish began to wear off the frame rails yet?
 
Not to remove any credit to the P226, I love the weapon and initial design but the fact is that it was designed as a duty weapon for both MIL/LE. As such it has to whitstand abuse and still be operationnal. I don't expect it to group like a X5-X6 or P210 on the range, but I expect it not to choke after if it's been dropped in sand or mud. I understand that 99.99% of casual shooters wont ever encounter harsh environment with it but if it's what it was design for, I expect it to be able to whitstand these conditions nonetheless. Believe me, some duty handguns can see more harsh treatments that what was shown in that video.
 
Harry Callahan said:
Not to remove any credit to the P226, I love the weapon and initial design but the fact is that it was designed as a duty weapon for both MIL/LE. As such it has to whitstand abuse and still be operationnal. I don't expect it to group like a X5-X6 or P210 on the range, but I expect it not to choke after if it's been dropped in sand or mud. I understand that 99.99% of casual shooters wont ever encounter harsh environment with it but if it's what it was design for, I expect it to be able to whitstand these conditions nonetheless. Believe me, some duty handguns can see more harsh treatments that what was shown in that video.
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The thing you have to remember, is that video is part of a gorilla marketing campaign, not any sort of scientific comparison. Dramatic yes, useful , not so much.

I read somewhere, that the competition criterion for the US militaries new handgun is 350 pages long. Any pistol that passes it will have legitimate bragging rights as a duty weapon.
 
Harry Callahan said:
Not to remove any credit to the P226, I love the weapon and initial design but the fact is that it was designed as a duty weapon for both MIL/LE. As such it has to whitstand abuse and still be operationnal. I don't expect it to group like a X5-X6 or P210 on the range, but I expect it not to choke after if it's been dropped in sand or mud.
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If he had picked a MK25, or a P226 with the standard trigger, I would agree with you.
 
Sig is really great at two things. Mass producing mediocre, but adequate handguns and marketing the hell out of them.
How many different sub brands of 226 are there? By my count over 20. Truthfully I don't trust Tim whatsoever, and hardly consider him unbiased source of information.
 
RC Fan said:
If he had picked a MK25, or a P226 with the standard trigger, I would agree with you.
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How does model or trigger type makes a difference on the malfunctions experienced in the video? As far as I know, the issues the pistol experienced was not related to trigger type or model. The Legion series of pistols are manufactured with the same slides, frames and barrels as the rest of the P226 lineup.
 
Harry Callahan said:
Not to remove any credit to the P226, I love the weapon and initial design but the fact is that it was designed as a duty weapon for both MIL/LE. As such it has to whitstand abuse and still be operationnal. I don't expect it to group like a X5-X6 or P210 on the range, but I expect it not to choke after if it's been dropped in sand or mud. I understand that 99.99% of casual shooters wont ever encounter harsh environment with it but if it's what it was design for, I expect it to be able to whitstand these conditions nonetheless. Believe me, some duty handguns can see more harsh treatments that what was shown in that video.
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I wouldn't take an instance of one gun having issues as evidence that the gun is no good. Like I said earlier, I've subjected my own legion gun to abuse and it's yet to have a single malfunction.

Just as my experience isn't indicative of all legions, neither is this video.
 
Harry Callahan said:
How does model or trigger type makes a difference on the malfunctions experienced in the video? As far as I know, the issues the pistol experienced was not related to trigger type or model. The Legion series of pistols are manufactured with the same slides, frames and barrels as the rest of the P226 lineup.
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Let's agree to disagree. I'd like to see a re-do with a MK25--I bet we'd see different results, but probably not the results that would sell Arex pistols for MAC/Tim.
 
RC Fan said:
Let's agree to disagree. I'd like to see a re-do with a MK25--I bet we'd see different results, but probably not the results that would sell Arex pistols for MAC/Tim.
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If someone lend me both MK25 & Legion I would do this test myself and get to the bottom of this :)
 
Harry Callahan said:
How does model or trigger type makes a difference on the malfunctions experienced in the video? As far as I know, the issues the pistol experienced was not related to trigger type or model. The Legion series of pistols are manufactured with the same slides, frames and barrels as the rest of the P226 lineup.
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From what I saw, the trigger had no bearing on the results. If it did, then it would be a valid criticism of the Legion series guns maybe. What I saw suggested a tighter frame to slide fit with the Sig. Tim's comments and methodology that suggested the Rex was tighter suggest he's either a machinist savant, or a BS artist (he skirts the issue carefully). Given his financial interest in the Rex, I'll go with the latter.

The long and short of it is, anyone who watches that video and thinks wow there's a smoking gun if I ever saw one, should stay out of the Florida real estate and Brooklyn infrastructure markets. The whole thing is ludicrous.
 
Tom Morrison said:
From what I saw, the trigger had no bearing on the results. If it did, then it would be a valid criticism of the Legion series guns maybe. What I saw suggested a tighter frame to slide fit with the Sig. Tim's comments and methodology that suggested the Rex was tighter suggest he's either a machinist savant, or a BS artist (he skirts the issue carefully). Given his financial interest in the Rex, I'll go with the latter.

The long and short of it is, anyone who watches that video and thinks wow there's a smoking gun if I ever saw one, should stay out of the Florida real estate and Brooklyn infrastructure markets. The whole thing is ludicrous.
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Exactly

Bob
 
The Legion's that I examined at the Shot Show this year were all fitted tighter than the rack grade P Series guns. It was actually a nice job of fitting and very tight. The SAO trigger, as mentioned on this board before, was spectacular.

Rich
 
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