Tracer rounds

You're no different than any other ostrich that comes up on this subject. You only look at the rules you want to because you can't accept the truth, and whip yourself into a frenzy convincing yourself that you're right. Your "interpretations" stop as soon as you think you've got the answer you want. I've been shooting explosives probably longer than you've been alive so I think I know the regulations concerning my business. This has been discussed on this board ad infinitum and nothing has changed since you came along.

And I know you've already got yourself convinced but I took the liberty of emailing Jean-Luc this morning on the matter:

In the current Explosives Regulations pursuant to the Explosives Act, it is not lawful to possess or sell cartridges with tracers. As you mention, there is a definition for safety cartridges. See section 2 of these Regulations.


“safety cartridge”
“safety cartridge” means a cartridge for any shotgun, gun, rifle, pistol, revolver and industrial gun the case of which can be extracted after firing and that is so closed as to prevent any explosion in one cartridge being communicated to another cartridge but does not include tracer, incendiary, high explosive or other similar military type cartridges; (cartouche de sûreté);

Jean-Luc Arpin
A/Director, Chief Inspector of Explosives, Directeur/I, Inspecteur en Chef des Explosifs
Tel; 613-948-5170 Fax; 613-948-5195
cell: 613.355.1291
email/courriel; jarpin@nrcan.gc.ca,
Explosives Regulatory Division/ Division de la réglementation sur les explosifs, Natural Resources Canada, 580 Booth street, 10th floor, Ottawa, Ontario, K1A 0E4
Ressources naturelles Canada, 580 rue Booth, 10e étage, Ottawa, Ontario, K1A 0E4
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His phone number's there so feel free to continue your argument with him personally. Best of luck.
 
I did call him

interesting conversation.

the confusion lies with the fact that the explosives act does not list you cannot buy class 6 div 3, it assumes you can't by not listing it in the sale and storage regulations part for individuals (apparently if its not listed it is assumed illegal)

You have to refer to
the storage section Part XI 125 that only lists storage requirements for div1 class 6
and 120.1 sale of safety cartridges


That is the most messed up thing I have ever heard, you can't use it because we don't list its safe storage or sale practise therefore it's illegal.
If the proposed amendment goes though (new explosives act) this will be fixed and clarified


well whatever,

I apologize to you AK
and will remove my posts to prevent confusion
 
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No worries. I'm actually surprised and impressed that you took the time to call Jean-Luc and verify it yourself. You now see the uphill battle I struggle with whenever someone asks about this subject! I don't know that many (any?) people take my credentials seriously. Oh well.
 
LordEvilPepper said:
it truly is frustrating and disappointing that the reason you can't have them under the current explosives act; is not because it say you can't have them, its because it doesn't specifically say you can.
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Yep, the same goes for any explosive. It's actually not a bad system overall because it keeps dangerous and unsafe explosives out of circulation. If you compare the US for example they have a disproportionately higher number of accidents per capita that can be attributed to relatively lax regulations. However as you point out it also doesn't permit for us to have useful and interesting articles that are reasonably benign (grass fire hazard notwithstanding)

The good news is the ERD is actually fairly open to changes and new ideas, but they have to be organized and reasonable. Coming to them with "The law is stupid and we demand our freedom" will go nowhere. On the other hand stats, figures, and a reasonable argument can (not necessarily will) get them to listen and consider your point. There are some very good changes coming in the new regulations that will be realized shortly.
 
AK said:
The good news is the ERD is actually fairly open to changes and new ideas, but they have to be organized and reasonable. Coming to them with "The law is stupid and we demand our freedom" will go nowhere. On the other hand stats, figures, and a reasonable argument can (not necessarily will) get them to listen and consider your point. There are some very good changes coming in the new regulations that will be realized shortly.
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Which is why I made the point about tracers being the perfect way to demonstrate the very real danger of ricochets.

I can still clearly recall firing 3 tracers in rapid fire across a lake, and seeing them go 3 different directions.
My buddy thought that they would simply go more or less straight forward. He was boggled when one went high up, one went to the left and the other went to the right.

As well, tracers would be most useful as a rescue aid if you get lost after dark in heavy forest.
 
tootall said:
Which is why I made the point about tracers being the perfect way to demonstrate the very real danger of ricochets.

I can still clearly recall firing 3 tracers in rapid fire across a lake, and seeing them go 3 different directions.
My buddy thought that they would simply go more or less straight forward. He was boggled when one went high up, one went to the left and the other went to the right.

As well, tracers would be most useful as a rescue aid if you get lost after dark in heavy forest.
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i would argue that suggesting using tracers in place of rescue flares would be a reason that the ERD would continue to enforce no tracers.

Tracers have their place, as an aid to get you onto target. As mentioned before its a good tool for teaching new shooters, as it can demonstrate ballistics and give positive feed back to a hit on a non reactive target.. It is also a good tool for ranging while firing when you just don't have the time to swap between a laser range finder and you gun: like when you hunting coyotes and they start to bolt over an open field.
 
tootall said:
Which is why I made the point about tracers being the perfect way to demonstrate the very real danger of ricochets.
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I wouldn't call it a perfect way! a dramatic way, a possible way but not a perfect way. Depending on what the projectile hits those ricochets you see are sometimes just the tracer element exiting from a shattered/stopped projectile. But yes I agree you can show ricochet possibilities with tracer.

Shooting a bullet (tracer) in the air is a little irresponsible! I have a flare gun for that purpose.
 
There used to be tracers made and sold in various non-military calibres just for signaling. I once bought some in 7mm RemMag
 
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