Trail Boss need air space ?

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smokee

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Can trail boss powder be loaded with no air space ?
From what I can find out its low wieght + shape leaves enough air space for expansion
I am looking to make shotshells from .44 mag cases for an antique revolver , useing 2 or 3 grains of trail boss , plastic disc , #12 shot (about 250 gr), glue plastic disc into the end , I'll trim the brass as needed
Any one done this before ?
Do I need some kind of wad for airspace ?
 
Be careful. This powder can spike up the pressure rapidly with very little change in load. I have never done this. I reload for an antique revolver though. I think... And I take no responsibility ... That it should not be compressed. Research this well before attempting as it can blow up your gun. Personally I'd go with black powder for this idea.
 
Trailboss shouldn't be compressed. HOWEVER, load data no longer applies. The case volume remaining for the powder will be much, much smaller than if a bullet is seated. This drastically raises pressure. (think multiple times, not small percentages)

I recall there are shot cups available for several calibers, 38, 44, 45. (Speer?)
 
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from my reading on it and light messing around with it in a 500 S&W making shot shells as well, as long as it is not compressed. it if gets compressed the doughnuts break and change the burning rate.

i also tried IMR 4198 with the shot shell idea. i put in roughly have a case worth and put in 2 shot cards made from thick cardboard packing (not corrugated, but i will try that next) cut into 1/2" circles with a punch. then i filled the rest of the case with shot (7.5 or 8) put another card on top, crimped and glued with wood glue.

they spread quick and leave a bit of unburnt powder, but 4198 may not be the best for this application. i had 2 shot shells in the cylinder and after firing the first one it dislodged the shot card on the second shot.
 
Hogdon says that you can load up to the base of the bullet but NEVER COMPRESS IT...NOT EVEN LIGHTLY. Compression causes major pressure spikes, as others have already said.
 
kayaker1 said:
Hogdon says that you can load up to the base of the bullet but NEVER COMPRESS IT...NOT EVEN LIGHTLY. Compression causes major pressure spikes, as others have already said.
Click to expand...

I think it says that on their website...case filled to where the base of the bullet will seat to is your max load. Reduce and go from there.
 
It's in a PDF for load development they have posted somewhere. 100% uncompressed volume is the max load, 70% of that is the starting load. The sweet spot for accuracy in most of the cartridges I've tried it in seems to be around 75-85% of max. One thing to note is that some black powder cartridges have load data published and their listed max is below the 100% mark.

*Edit*
Found it:
ww w.imrpowder.com/PDF/Trail-Boss-data.pdf

I would be hesitant to use it in a shotshell pistol load without a seated and crimped capsule of some kind in place of a bullet. Just seating a disk with shot above it could produce some really weird pressure values.

Have you looked at 44 special loads using Unique? It's not very compression sensitive (works fine in very light rifle loads or in tightly packed shotshells) and burns well with low pressures.
 
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Yes , I see how the shot would knock around in there and crush or compress the powder , especially the ones in the cylinder still to be shot , BAD IDEA !
This is exactly why I posted the question on here
I originaly was thinking black powder , but I dont want the extra fire hazard at close range
So , Unique is safe to compress ?
I am only looking to use a small charge
 
I've run both very loose and tightly compressed Unique loads and both work wonderfully. I would find the weight of the shot + wads + glue and use that as a bullet weight. 200gr is the lowest Alliant has data for and it's 7.8gr for 44 special. I've used as little as 3gr under a .433" round ball to comical effect. The ball was I think 120ish grains and when fired you could literally watch it leave the barrel, travel down range, drop a bit, and punch through the board. Maybe 500-700fps? Didn't obturate the brass properly though so there was a lot of carbon inside the chamber and on the outside of the brass. Just makes for more cleaning afterwards.

It was the kind of load you want to make sure actually cleared the barrel after each shot before chambering another round.
 
I will look into this Unique , I have a bit of it I got with some other stuff from a guy at my club
Now I just need to find a little #12 shot , maybe in that big box of odd shotgun shells I have
I should have time to play with this again in a couple days
Any other suggestions ? or experiences ?
 
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