Turret or progressive?

[Gatehouse]

Your problem on something like a 650 will be changing between small and large primers, which takes a bit longer.

I load 3 different pistol calibres on a 650 and switching between calibres with dedicated toolheads makes things faster but they're all small primer. If I read correctly, you'll be loading 9 mm, .45 and 10 mm. Changing will/might require a different dedicated toolhead, different shellplate, different station locator, different locator buttons, different body bushing, different case arm bushing, different casefeed adapter, different casefeed plate and completely swapping out the priming system if you're going from small to large or vice versa. I'm not sure how everyone else is doing this in 90 seconds.

With all that said, I think you're too concerned about the time it takes to change between calibres, but that's your prerogative. Once my 650 is setup, I can pump out 1K rounds in ~1.5 hrs. In my opinion, and it's just that, speed matters much more when loading pistol rounds. While you're fiddling around with a turret press, I will have loaded all my rounds and BBQed a few steaks. You're just displacing time from setup to loading, again, just my 2 ¢ (probably not even worth that).

I sure can't swap out a 750 in 90 seconds but the toolhead is a couple of seconds (assuming you have a dedicated powder measure) The shellplate is a few minutes to remove, install, check for proper operation and lock it down. The bushings/locatorsetc can be done in a few minutes too. The priming system from large to small can take a few minutes but it's not really complicated once it's been done a few times. Maybe 15 minutes to do it all? I guess I lied on my first post, I was thinking about just the toolhead and shellplate.

I agree 1000 rounds in 1.5 hours is certainly doable.

To me, going with a progressive is about having lots of brass and components and loading a big pile of ammo before swapping to another cartridge.

I find priming and primers in general to be the most finicky part of most progressives, and causes the most stoppages so these days I break loading down into 2 steps. Deprime using a FW spring loaded decapper which gives almost 100% positive decapping, then priming and case sizing. Then run primed and sized brass through the case feeder and because I already know all the cases are properly primed I don't worry about a primer seated too high or a missing primer. Charge with powder which expands mouth, bullet feeder drops the bullet then seat and crimp. This greatly reduces annoying stoppages, which I find to be the biggest time waster with progressives.

 

[Meroh]

I run two Lee Pro-1000s so caliber changes are not a big issue. One is almost continually set up for large pistol primers (this is the most difficult part of any change over; shell feed adjustments needed between calibers also, (long cases lie 38/357 and diameter changes like .45 ACP. However, for what I am doing, they are doing a great job!!

 

[hunter5425]

I use a lee classic turret which is self indexing for my 9mm loading. Changing dies is about the same as a single stage press . I modified the press to run the opposite direction as I find it easier to operate and made a loaded round ejector that speeds it up as well. No where near as fast as a progressive but ok for the volumes I load.

 

[BillSussman44]

I use a lee classic turret which is self indexing for my 9mm loading. Changing dies is about the same as a single stage press . I modified the press to run the opposite direction as I find it easier to operate and made a loaded round ejector that speeds it up as well. No where near as fast as a progressive but ok for the volumes I load.

I load 200 rounds/hour manually indexing a lee classic turret which I am happy with considering the availability of primers. I only shoot 100 rounds pre range visit now, so 30 minutes of work before going to the range isn't a big deal.

 

[hunter5425]

My brother comes up to load with me occasionaly as he has a pistol and a 9mm carbine he needs to feed so tweaking the speed helps when we're doing higher volume batches.

 

[Butcherbill]

I have used numerous press's over the years from an indestructible Herters (the one I learned on and still have that one) a couple RCBS single stages a couple Lee progressives to 3 Dillons ( 2 650's and a 550) and a Lee Classic Cast Turret....and without a minutes hesitation I will say that the Lee Turret will still be on my bench long after the Dillons are not needed & gone.
One point I will make is that every press I have used produces excellent ammo, even the much maligned Lee progressives, they make ammo but the primer attrition rate is what soured me on them and that was when primers were $35 a brick, canr imagine how frustrated I would be at 3-$400 per brick now.

As for your stated caliber change time being your make-or-break criteria, If no primer size change is required i can change my 650 over in 90 seconds or so and that includes an already set to go powder slide. I can change my Lee Classic over in 45 seconds but then I have to re-set a powder drop or scale for the new cartridge and that will easily double the time to change a Dillon over.
I kept one Dillon ( the other 2 given to a family member that started reloading) just because the wife & I still shoot a large volume of pistol caliber but when that part of our lives dies out that Dillon will go and that Lee Classic will still be here.

Had the same dilemma a few years ago, and went with a Lee classic turret press. It has been reliable with no issues. I do all the operations on the press (de-priming, priming, powder load, bullet seating, crimp) I use the lee-auto drum (very accurate with ball powder), and the lee safety prime. I reload 25 acp, 32 acp, 38 special, 9 mm, 40 S&W on it.

Interesting, I’ll have to do a bit more homework on the Lee turret, when I decided to start reloading it was one of the first presses I considered buying before a friend offered to sell me a spare singe stage for a good deal. It seems like both of you are happy with them, I don’t really need the volume that a progressive press can load and the Lee classic cast turret checks all the boxes that I’m looking for, for some reason I wasn’t giving it enough thought.

I’d be happy with 150-200rds in an hour with the ability to change die plates easily, the nice thing with the Lee is the cost of extra turrets and powder measures. I could get the press kit and extra die plates and powder measures and still be half the cost of the Hornady AP kit, will have to watch more YouTube videos I guess.

 

[Gatehouse]

For the Lee indexing turret press users, how well does the priming system work? I've only seen videos of it and it doesn't look ideal- but never seen one in person.

 

[dan belisle]

For the Lee indexing turret press users, how well does the priming system work? I've only seen videos of it and it doesn't look ideal- but never seen one in person.

It's OK, but I do most of my priming for the Lee separately. Same for my two Lyman and one RCBS. Dillon I use the primer feed system, same with the shotgun presses. - dan

 

[SP641]

The latest version of the safety prime works great, they made the dispensing arm sturdier by adding ribs. It works well enough to prime on the press as you go.

For the OP

My output for 9 and 40 is on average 150 to 200 per hour. I am slower with other calibers.

I have different powder measure and keep them on turrets for caliber I reload the most.

 

[ted_dent]

Interesting, I’ll have to do a bit more homework on the Lee turret, when I decided to start reloading it was one of the first presses I considered buying before a friend offered to sell me a spare singe stage for a good deal. It seems like both of you are happy with them, I don’t really need the volume that a progressive press can load and the Lee classic cast turret checks all the boxes that I’m looking for, for some reason I wasn’t giving it enough thought.

I’d be happy with 150-200rds in an hour with the ability to change die plates easily, the nice thing with the Lee is the cost of extra turrets and powder measures. I could get the press kit and extra die plates and powder measures and still be half the cost of the Hornady AP kit, will have to watch more YouTube videos I guess.

My first press was a Rockchucker (whose wasn't?) but I then picked up two Lee Loadmasters really cheap and they have been my go-to progressive presses for 20 years or more. I have learned all their little intricacies and unlike some people seem to I have never had an issue with the primer feed because I 1) keep the primer feed immaculately clean and 2) I make sure there are always lots of primers in the primer tray. I recently also bought a Lee Six Pack progressive press and it looks like it's going to be a real winner although it's cost is getting up there compared to other Lee presses.

All that being said, from what you have described as your requirements I think the Lee Classic Turret is exactly what you are looking for. It can easily do 150+ rounds per hour, is very reasonably priced, extremely sturdy (get it, not the original Lee Turret press) and uses 4 die tool heads which aren't expensive and allow for quick calibre changes. The Safety Prime system, while not automatic, is also quite effective and reasonably quick. hunter5425 also mentioned reversing the turret rotation (Inline Fabrication sells the kit) and it really speeds up the loading process by automatically ejecting the loaded rounds so you don't have to touch them.

I bought one to load calibres where I don't need thousands of rounds per year and I can honestly say it is perfect for that task.

I am not slagging any of the other suggestions but I think when your requirements are considered it is probably the best combination of economy, quality of build, simplicity and speed that you are going to find. Lee has been making variations of this press for at least as long as I have been reloading (40+ years) so a lot of people must think the same about it as I do.

 

[I Dont Care About You]

I’m looking to speed up the process, the volume between either a turret or progressive in an hour is fine for my use. In order of importance I’d rank ease of caliber change/setup over total number of cartridges I can load in an hour, I’m not loading for ipsc or anything else. If the Hornady AP will do both for me then bonus, I know the Hornady progressive will be better quality than a Lee turret.

Just want to speed thing up from loading pistol calibers on a single stage, so anything between 150-250/hr is fine by me. I don’t need to load 300-600/hr, I have plenty of free time to handload and I enjoy the process to begin with. Loading 9mm, 10mm, .45auto, likely 7.62x25 somewhere down the line.

If ease of shell plate / holder change is of paramount importance to you then an indexing turret is the way to go. Changing out the shell plate on a progressive is a PIA and takes 10x longer.

I have both an old Lee 3-station indexing turret and a Dillon 550. My Lee has many hundreds of thousands of rounds on it and still works like a charm. The notion that the Lee is of "lesser quality" is false.

Like any press, the Lee turret has its idiosyncrasies and needs maintenance in certain areas over time. My Dillon 550 has not required less maintenance / care than my Lee turret.

The answer is Dillon 550.

Well that depends. If he wants to change between shell plate sizes then it is not the 550 because shell plate changes on the 550 are a PIA.

An auto indexing turret like the Lee is WAY faster for shell plate, or in that case, shell holder changes.

I can swap out calibers, say from 9mm to 45ACP on my Lee turret in about 5 seconds. The same change on a Dillon requires removing the die plate, removing and replacing the shell holder and swapping out the primer feed mechanism. That is at least a 30-40 minute set of tasks.

 

[I Dont Care About You]

The 750 eliminates any chances of more than 1 primer detonating. I still reload with ear muffs with the 650 just to be safe. .

Really? Do you walk around with a condom on at all times ... just to be safe?

In 36 years of reloading and several hundreds of thousands of rounds, I have never had a primer detonate ... ever. Why on earth would you spend hours upon hours wearing ear muffs for something that has such a teeny, tiny, approaching zero chance of happening?

 

[I Dont Care About You]

I have used numerous press's over the years from an indestructible Herters (the one I learned on and still have that one) a couple RCBS single stages a couple Lee progressives to 3 Dillons ( 2 650's and a 550) and a Lee Classic Cast Turret....and without a minutes hesitation I will say that the Lee Turret will still be on my bench long after the Dillons are not needed & gone.
One point I will make is that every press I have used produces excellent ammo, even the much maligned Lee progressives, they make ammo but the primer attrition rate is what soured me on them and that was when primers were $35 a brick, canr imagine how frustrated I would be at 3-$400 per brick now.

As for your stated caliber change time being your make-or-break criteria, If no primer size change is required i can change my 650 over in 90 seconds or so and that includes an already set to go powder slide. I can change my Lee Classic over in 45 seconds but then I have to re-set a powder drop or scale for the new cartridge and that will easily double the time to change a Dillon over.
I kept one Dillon ( the other 2 given to a family member that started reloading) just because the wife & I still shoot a large volume of pistol caliber but when that part of our lives dies out that Dillon will go and that Lee Classic will still be here.

I kind of agree on the Lee turret. I've had mine for over 36 years and it still works just fine. I have swapped over to the Dillon 550 for the callers I tend to load in the largest volumes but I still find lots of work for the old Lee turret.

I'm not familiar with the 650, I only have a 550. How are the shell plates and primer system of a 650 changed out?

Is as if there is a fear or do not know how to set up dies in a press - I use a single stage Rock Chucker - every time, the die is re-set up - talk about "saving time" - "quick to change" - sounds like advertising or marketing - you are going to sit there for 1/2 hour or 2 hours reloading - what difference did 5 seconds or 15 seconds make to change the die? Is perhaps different if you do not know how, or had someone else set it up for you - my advice to the young fellow that I am coaching to reload is to learn how to set up his dies - every time - that way he will KNOW they are done correctly. If they are done "wrong", there is only a finite number of rounds that were sized or seated in error.

It's not a fear of setting up dies, it is a matter of doing a job once, rather than 10,000 times. Why on earth would anyone choose to set up dies each and every time one sits down to load? It is pointless work for work's sake and all you are doing is setting yourself up to make a mistake. A turret or progressive requires the dies to be set up once, then they don't change after that.

What you are suggesting is to remove the wheels from your car, every night and then re-install them every time you want to drive somewhere, just to make sure the lug nuts are correctly torqued. I assume you don't do this ..... because it would be stupid and pointless and set you up to make a mistake.

 

[john777]

Really? Do you walk around with a condom on at all times ... just to be safe?

In 36 years of reloading and several hundreds of thousands of rounds, I have never had a primer detonate ... ever. Why on earth would you spend hours upon hours wearing ear muffs for something that has such a teeny, tiny, approaching zero chance of happening?

Great that you have never experienced primer detonation. Neither have I. But it still can happen with the 650. Wearing muffs don't bother me so I just do it after reading reloaders have experienced primer detonation. As far as I know, they weren't noobs and possibly got careless or didn't detect a different feeling when seating the primer. You can call me paranoid. 1 primer detonating is deafening enough. I can't imagine having many going off at the same time. They're my ears and choose to reload with muffs.

 

[Janeau]

Really? Do you walk around with a condom on at all times ... just to be safe?

In 36 years of reloading and several hundreds of thousands of rounds, I have never had a primer detonate ... ever. Why on earth would you spend hours upon hours wearing ear muffs for something that has such a teeny, tiny, approaching zero chance of happening?

Same here..never ever

 

[Gatehouse]

Really? Do you walk around with a condom on at all times ... just to be safe?

In 36 years of reloading and several hundreds of thousands of rounds, I have never had a primer detonate ... ever. Why on earth would you spend hours upon hours wearing ear muffs for something that has such a teeny, tiny, approaching zero chance of happening?

It happens, and it's nice to be wearing glasses and ear pro when it does. I haven't had it happen on a 750 (Don't have a 650) but I've had it happen with my 1100 and Mark7. The 1100 happened in the actual priming stage, the Mark 7 I have had a few when the loaded travelled down the tube and the bullet hit the primer of a round already in the bucket. (Both my 1100 and Mark7 have a funnel that the loaded round drops down and then into a bucket on the floor) Primers going off when loading is uncommon but load enough rounds and it might happen. I've never had a primer tube or similar blow up but some people have.

I typically wear airpods and listen to a podcast or something when loading large volume and will put ear muffs over top, plus a pair of safety glasses. I don't bother when using a single stage though, as I normally hand prime for those cartridges and it's easy to feel if a primer is going in wrong.

 

[Gatehouse]

Thanks for the LEE priming system info guys. I won't get one but I am always interested in how different presses perform.

 

[kjohn]

I use a Lyman turret, a later model. For years I used a Lyman Spar-T. Nothing wrong with the Spar-T. I hand prime all rifle brass. I use a Lee Pro1000 for 9mm, 38, and .45 acp.

This winter, I’ll have to do a major revamp of my little office/reloading room, as I’ve sold my shop, but I get to keep the use of the office and the attached room, both heated.

I enjoy reloading. I look forward to setting up a neater arrangement to work with.

 

[Gatehouse]

I have a Lyman 8 die turret press, only had it for a little while. I haven't used it for priming yet but some people are not satisfied with it's priming. I also understand lyman shellholders are slightly more "shorter" and maybe they were using RCBS/Redding etc shellholders. Anyone with experience with this?

 

[downwindtracker2]

I picked up a older Lyman T-Mag turret. I planned to use it for dirty jobs like decapping. That is about all it is good for. I took it apart and overhauled it. Kubota orange is better looking than Lyman. I take it the later ones are better designed.