Twist rate for 6.5x55. What is better? 1 in 8 or 1 in 9.

Even manufactures statements on bullet boxes are deceiving. Some of them (Sierra, Berger) are adviseing 1-8" twist for 6,5mm 140gr VLDs. This is bs. Those bullets should have minimum RPM asaigned to them instead. Somebody building say 6,5mm Whisper aka 6,5x223Rem, short barreled 6,5mm Carcano or something simmilar useing 1-8" twist with speeds not much more than 2000fps if that much will tumble those long, long bullets all the time every time. They need over 200 000 RPM to stabilize IMHO. Those same bullets at 3100fps from 1-10" twist in 264WM will have 223 200 RPM and will stabilize them nicelly.

I agree..overspin isnt' always the best wither. I believe a lot of the Winchester 264's were 9" twist and worked because they had the velocity.

I also agree that with the 8 twist you woudlnt' need to worry or calculate anything. (unless you were going for very low velocity as mentioned above).
 
personally i would't be shooting 160's out of a 6.5x55 but to each there own however ill state my reasoning..

* oal will have the bullet seated very deep into the case
*speed is very slow

The Swede is meant to have lots of bullet sticking out. The 140gr SST is a very long bullet, 1.400" according to my calipers. I load them to a 3.100" OAL to suit my mag length (SAAMI max OAL is 3.150"). This length puts the base of the bullet dead flush with the bottom of the shoulder and doesn't intrude into the body of the case. Typical 160's are a fair bit shorter than the SST, so they won't affect case capacity at all.


Mark
 
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The Swede is meant to have lots of bullet sticking out. The 140gr SST is a very long bullet, 1.400" according to my calipers. I load them to a 3.100" OAL to suit my mag length (SAMMI max OAL is 3.150"). This length puts the base of the bullet dead flush with the bottom of the shoulder and doesn't intrude into the body of the case. Typical 160's are a fair bit shorter than the SST, so they won't affect case capacity at all.


Mark


Yeah, I never found the Hornady 160 to be very long due to to the RN design....
 
The only reason to get a 1:8 twIst is because you can't find a 1;7 barrel. There is little disadvantage to a fast twist, but plenty of disadvantages to a slow twist. The most obvious is that the slower twist won't produce stability in longer bullets. Now I'm speaking to you as someone who lives at sea level and shoots in the cold, so by definition I need a faster twist to stabilize the same bullet that a fellow living in a warmer part of the country, and shooting at higher altitudes uses successfully. But mono-metal hunting bullets and VLD target bullets tend to be longer then traditional lead core semi-spitzer flat base bullets of the same weight, so expect them to do better with more twist. Conversely, there is no loss of accuracy with the use of short bullets from fast twist barrels.

But the fast twist has other advantages. The long range shooter using a fast twist barrel will not experience the loss of stability as his bullet crosses into the transonic velocity range as does the shooter with a slow or "optimum" twist barrel. The hunter will observe deeper penetration on big game from the same bullet if his twist is faster, although this is easier to see when long bullets are used. The reason for the deeper penetration is that the bullet precesses (yaws) for a less time when it impacts resistance denser than air than it would if it were spinning slower. The less time that the bullet is in yaw, the less resistance there is to its forward progression, so the deeper it penetrates.

So what are the disadvantages of a fast twist barrel? I've been a fan of fast twist for quite some time now, and I've only seen 3 disadvantages of a very fast twist. One is that if you're shooting bullets with very thin jackets, the fast twist might cause them to fail prior to hitting the target, or once the target is hit, the expansion is more violent and penetration is dramatically reduced. This was my experience when shooting Hornady SX and Sierra Blitz from a 1:7 .22 center fire. Therefore choosing the appropriately constructed bullet is more important if you have a fast twist barrel.

The second disadvantage of the very fast twist barrel is for the cast bullet shooter. With a very fast twist, the velocity of your cast bullet will have to be dramatically reduced. If you've been shooting cast in the 1600-1800 fps range, expect to reduce that velocity to 1200 fps to prevent severe leading and poor accuracy. I discovered this when attempting to shoot cast bullets from my 1:8 .308, so now I simply save my cast bullet shooting for my 1;10 and 1:12 twist .30s.

Lastly, a bullet fired from the fast twist barrel is effected more by spin drift. I don't consider this a significant problem myself, as spin drift exists with any bullet fired from a rifled barrel, and it only becomes an issue at extended ranges. But spin drift is a constant, and is therefore easily compensated for.
 
Good points. I have another: some will disagree, but a faster twist will result in slightly higher pressures.

If you'll never shoot anything heavier than 100's, go with a 1:12, if 140's, a 1:9 etc. This will allow higher MV's, wider bullet choice, and reduced likelihood of "spin drift" (the bullet planing" and not following a parabolic path).
 
Good points. I have another: some will disagree, but a faster twist will result in slightly higher pressures.

If you'll never shoot anything heavier than 100's, go with a 1:12, if 140's, a 1:9 etc. This will allow higher MV's, wider bullet choice, and reduced likelihood of "spin drift" (the bullet planing" and not following a parabolic path).

Ackley suggested it takes about 30% of the energy of the propellant gases to spin the bullet, so it would follow that a faster twist would produce higher pressure. But in practical application I don't know if the difference is measurable. I get very high velocities with my 1:8 .308 due to the long lead and minimal seating depth of the bullets, I'm getting 2650 with a 210 VLD from a 28" barrel. Would I get 2700 had I chosen a 1:13? I doubt it if keeping primers in their pockets was part of the deal. My go to load for the .222 with the factory 1:14 Remington barrel was 25 grs of 748 and a 52 gr MK, when I switched to the 1:7 Gaillard, I saw no difference in velocity after working up to the same load, and the accuracy I observed with the new barrel was just nuts. Based on case measurements and velocity, there appears to be no appreciable difference in pressure that couldn't be accounted for due to normal manufacturing tolerances between my wife's 1:12 .30/06 Husqvarna and my 1:10 Brno. What is noticeable though is that the Husky won't stabilize 240 gr Woodleighs, but the Brno does.
 
Yeah, I never found the Hornady 160 to be very long due to to the RN design....

Woodleigh`s are long bullets (160 grain the other bullet). Picked them up at tradex. 1.38 inches and is going to be my preferred round for everything. They have a very high bc and pretty long. That is the reason why I started this thread. The consenus is 1 in 8 twist from all the responses.
 
Woodleigh`s are long bullets (160 grain the other bullet). Picked them up at tradex. 1.38 inches and is going to be my preferred round for everything. They have a very high bc and pretty long. That is the reason why I started this thread. The consenus is 1 in 8 twist from all the responses.

yeah Woodleighs are a lot longer and has a much different profile than the Hornady (0.283)
 
Well I see lots of reason for a 156-160gr bullet as that's what made the 6.5's into giant killers.Sighted 3" high at 100 yards ,you're dead on at 200 and a foot or so low at 300 .No problem drilling moose out to three.Been there ,done that.Neither the T3 or Win FWT we have will shoot 160's without mild bullet tipping/yaw but will the 156gr Sakos.A Swede 38/96 has a 1-7.25 twist and has no problem with 140-160gr bullets.My son's T3 shoots 130 Scirocco's into the same hole great for deer but me I'll use the 140 and up...........Harold
 
Good points. I have another: some will disagree, but a faster twist will result in slightly higher pressures.

If you'll never shoot anything heavier than 100's, go with a 1:12, if 140's, a 1:9 etc. This will allow higher MV's, wider bullet choice, and reduced likelihood of "spin drift" (the bullet planing" and not following a parabolic path).

:agree: IMHO slower twist will allow higher MV's b/c there is less spike in pressure behind the bullet compared to fast twist barrel.
 
Woodleigh`s are long bullets (160 grain the other bullet). Picked them up at tradex. 1.38 inches and is going to be my preferred round for everything. They have a very high bc and pretty long. That is the reason why I started this thread. The consenus is 1 in 8 twist from all the responses.

That is almost as long as the 140gr SST and as long as most of the VLD target bullets. With the lower velocities that you will see using the 160gr you will definitely want the faster twist.


Mark
 
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