Type 97 Classification Issues - PART TWO
- Thread starter Clobbersauras
- Start date
No one has said they were going to just hand the guns over.
Clobbersauras
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Waaay out west.
oooookay....Guys we need to stop discussing strategy in these threads. Please. It does us absolutely no good to talk about what we may do to legally fight this issue. Why tip our hand?
I have to say though, I'm very touched by the show of support and solidarity among our community.
These threads are full of great letters and shows of support. 
Throttle_monkey1
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Letter sent to Toews:
To the Hon. Vic Toews,
It has come to my attention that the RCMP firearms lab has recently reclassified the Norinco Type 97A rifle from restricted status to prohibited status. This has resulted in registration revocations being sent to the lawful owners stating they have 30 days to turn in their rifles without compensation, or appeal the ruling.
This rifle was given restricted status when first brought into Canada, as it met the criterion for such classification. The CBSA then seized a shipment of longer barrelled Type 97A's under direction from the RCMP that were to be of the non-restricted classification. 18 months have passed and now the RCMP want to seize the guns that are owned by law-abiding gun owners, saying that they are full-auto guns because they can easily be converted.Numerous Access to Information requests regarding their evidence, results, and testing methods have been denied, or with the relevant information blacked out citing a ludicrous excuse of "national security".
Mr. Toews, are yourself or Mr. Harper aware of the ramifications of gun confiscations perpetrated against law-abiding gun owners by the RCMP while the CPC is in power? Myself, and many others applaud the efforts of the CPC government with the progress made on Bill C-391, but these gun confiscations could undo much of the work done to garner the support of gun-owners by the CPC. We all know which direction Kim Campbell's political career went after she implemented her horrible gun control laws.
I trust that you will look into these matters, as it is of utmost importance when Section 8 of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms is being violated by the RCMP through confiscation of private property without compensation.
Sincerely,
To the Hon. Vic Toews,
It has come to my attention that the RCMP firearms lab has recently reclassified the Norinco Type 97A rifle from restricted status to prohibited status. This has resulted in registration revocations being sent to the lawful owners stating they have 30 days to turn in their rifles without compensation, or appeal the ruling.
This rifle was given restricted status when first brought into Canada, as it met the criterion for such classification. The CBSA then seized a shipment of longer barrelled Type 97A's under direction from the RCMP that were to be of the non-restricted classification. 18 months have passed and now the RCMP want to seize the guns that are owned by law-abiding gun owners, saying that they are full-auto guns because they can easily be converted.Numerous Access to Information requests regarding their evidence, results, and testing methods have been denied, or with the relevant information blacked out citing a ludicrous excuse of "national security".
Mr. Toews, are yourself or Mr. Harper aware of the ramifications of gun confiscations perpetrated against law-abiding gun owners by the RCMP while the CPC is in power? Myself, and many others applaud the efforts of the CPC government with the progress made on Bill C-391, but these gun confiscations could undo much of the work done to garner the support of gun-owners by the CPC. We all know which direction Kim Campbell's political career went after she implemented her horrible gun control laws.
I trust that you will look into these matters, as it is of utmost importance when Section 8 of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms is being violated by the RCMP through confiscation of private property without compensation.
Sincerely,
I got phone call today. They said that my t97 now is considered "prohib" and I'll have to dispose it. Letter with all instructions about disposal will be sent out next week. I asked if they going to reimburse me my cost but lady from CFC said that no cost reimbursement will be provided. She said "unfortunately it will be your loss and there is nothing you can do about it". At that point I just lost it! I asked her how she would feel if I just take her personal car away and say that there is nothing she can do! She said that she is not in position to discuss it any further and just merely hanged-up on me!!!
WHAT IS GOING ON IN THIS COUNTRY?!!! Where is all that famous human right and democracy here??? Government today just decided to steel from me! I work and pay my taxes on time, I obey law and that is what I got as "thank you" from them!
May be we have to start taking from them and let them feel our pain?!
They are called "public servants" but I do not know what “public” they serve. All I know – they do not serve me!
WHAT IS GOING ON IN THIS COUNTRY?!!! Where is all that famous human right and democracy here??? Government today just decided to steel from me! I work and pay my taxes on time, I obey law and that is what I got as "thank you" from them!
May be we have to start taking from them and let them feel our pain?!
They are called "public servants" but I do not know what “public” they serve. All I know – they do not serve me!
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#1bcshooter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- North Of The DMZ (US border)
Still for sale (pre order) om Canam web site ??????
It is only considered prohibited by the RCMP/CFC, this does not mean that it is prohibited, only that they consider it to be. If you also consider it to be prohibited then follow their instructions, if not then challenge them in court. As soon as you start a legal challenge to their ruling their ruling becomes null and void.
You have a choice, bend over and take it where the sun don't shine or fight the bastards.
Have no doubts - I'm fighting it! First thing tomorrow I'll send letters to everybody. I already contacted our MP and will schedule personal meeting where I'm going to "express all of my feelings".
As soon as "revocation notice arrives" I'll take it to local court and file reference hearing.
I also briefly had it all discussed with my friend/lawyer and he is totally going to help me fight it in court. But he was wondering why don't all affected people get together and file class case against RCMP?
May I suggest stripping your gun down to bare reciever so in the event they come a-knocking to "take it for safe keeping" all they get is a chunk of metal?
It wouldn't be above the RCMP to do something like that in the hopes you'd lose heart and just give up. Or they would "lose it" while you were fighting them.
Also, hopefully there's a group of T97 owners joining forces so they can fight it as a group, rather than individually. Best of luck guys - I'm rooting for ya!
It wouldn't be above the RCMP to do something like that in the hopes you'd lose heart and just give up. Or they would "lose it" while you were fighting them.
Also, hopefully there's a group of T97 owners joining forces so they can fight it as a group, rather than individually. Best of luck guys - I'm rooting for ya!
LOL... Didn't even remember that, but I AM a fan.... Something tells me my subconscious was involved in the drafting of my post.
Anyways, I think some of the above posters have the right angle on this: We really need to be thinking about this from a property angle. If we can successfully make it an issue of property and law-abiding citizens who have done nothing wrong, we win.
I do feel bad for the guys involved, but this is worth the fight.
OH, and by the way: DO NOT provide an understrength lifting hook. Being on the proverbial hook for involuntary manslaughter is not worth it. I do absolutely agree with the idea of a block of concrete however, even if only a small one.
The simplest way to achieve an absolute solution with concrete would be:
1. Drill two holes through the receiver (I know, I know), and pass rebar through these.
2. Tie a cage as described above; Include scrap steel (but nothing sharp)
3. Cast in Type 30, high early strength.
Job done...
CE
Oh: And the reason for the Type 30? Really don't need much time, and you can do this quite late in the game... With only days remaining you can "resort" to the block of concrete.
Here's a quick idea for you:
Construct a box 24"x18"x12" deep, internal dimensions. This will achieve a block of concrete around 200kg in weight so that it is juuuust man-portable with four guys. (You don't want to be accused of being unreasonably vindictive about it, right?)
Suspend the receiver from the top of your form with the serial number as near as flush to the surface as possible.
Typically bagged concrete comes in 60lb and 80lb bags (due to our neighbours' much larger imperial market). A standard 60lb bag of concrete provides 0.45 cubic foot of cured concrete. A standard 80lb bag of concrete provides roughly 0.6 cubic feet of concrete...
So, you need 3 cubic feet to fill the above form, this being acheived very well with 5x80lb bags, or you could go with between 6 and 7 sixty pound bags, but you're over or under. Better to make the form a little bigger if you only have access to 60 lb bags.
Cheers,
CE
Here's a quick idea for you:
Construct a box 24"x18"x12" deep, internal dimensions. This will achieve a block of concrete around 200kg in weight so that it is juuuust man-portable with four guys. (You don't want to be accused of being unreasonably vindictive about it, right?)
Suspend the receiver from the top of your form with the serial number as near as flush to the surface as possible.
Typically bagged concrete comes in 60lb and 80lb bags (due to our neighbours' much larger imperial market). A standard 60lb bag of concrete provides 0.45 cubic foot of cured concrete. A standard 80lb bag of concrete provides roughly 0.6 cubic feet of concrete...
So, you need 3 cubic feet to fill the above form, this being acheived very well with 5x80lb bags, or you could go with between 6 and 7 sixty pound bags, but you're over or under. Better to make the form a little bigger if you only have access to 60 lb bags.
Cheers,
CE
The CanAm rifle is the non-restricted version, they have no ETA because the shipment has been seized... AND, I just pre-ordered one last night & intend to sit on the order till "the cows come home..." Actions sometimes speak louder than words!
Cheers
Jay
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All of this was also done without any transparency or fairness of due process. The procedures done, the length of time taken, the hiding of testing results and so forth fly against the notion of natural justice or procedural fairness as a legal and democratic philosophy. It also violates procedural justice as it has not allowed fairness in how this dispute has been resolved. As such, it brings the administration of justice into disrepute. How it further divides the camps of legal gun owners and the ‘civil servants’ will be painfully obvious from coast to coast.
- Location
- Montreal, Quebec
And the notices of revocation are being done with the blessing of the DIShonorable Vic Toews, the steaming pile of dog poo...
Harper chose an "anti" firearms type as public safety minister. Kind of speaks volumes about how "friendly" the CPC are towards us.
As Harper gains strength against his opponents, we become a lesser value to him. With friends like these, who needs enemies?
Vic Toews is NOT our friend, Wendy couldn't have been a worse choice as Public Safety Minister.
