Ukrainian surplus coming soon?
- Thread starter Tompullings
- Start date
You're a few years too late.
The bulk of the SKS's and Mosins that were coming in all through the early 2k's up until a couple years ago, along with surplus x39 and 54R, was coming from surplus stocks in the Ukraine. The well was sucked nearly dry, and whatever was left over, is currently in use by various "independent patriotic militias" dealing with their current Russian troubles.
- Location
- East ontario
Countrys don't surplus guns when they are in all out war.
I'm guessing "not much".
The war is being fought with rockets, mortars and artillery. SKS rounds will be low on the list. Lots of old ordnance to go through...
That transition process is very slow and gradual, it would be plainly stupid to dump of what's already available and familiar and you have infrastructure to service it and have huge expenses on rearmament. So that reasoning won't work.
But as I mentioned earlier, in other thread Ukraine resumed offering military surplus firearm I think about 2 years ago. Guess what, prices are not the same as they were 10 years ago. I see no importers jumping on these prices and I can surely understand them, this market is still saturated with so many SKSs and MNs.
All militia groups were incorporated into Army and National Guards in 2014 and never at any stage any single SKS or regular MN was officially issued or officially supplied to anyone on Ukrainian side. Country is full of AKs, there were no and there will be no shortages in supply even with bigger scale war. National Guards troops also have access to local licensed version of Tavor 21. So SKSs and MNs are surplus. Ammo is not. 7.62x39, 7.62x54R we were enjoying for cheap is not surplus anymore.
I don't know how many MNs or SKSs left, I have a feeling SVTs are either all gone or just some junk remains. Seeing those new prices for MNs and SKSs I would guess they are running low too.
There are couple of other countries with Soviet surplus, but chances of us getting those guns are extremely low for a number of reasons.
Oh, those things are probably in good hands now
Classic scenario for back home. Steal something, sell it and than when inspection is supposed to audit the facility burn it down. I still remember one going night next to Artemovsk. Artillery shells were landing on the streets. Luckily nobody was killed by there was a lot of damage, including my families store. That was before war, I can only imagine amounts they are stealing now.In theory. In practice, a lot of the militias and militiamen are still largely independent.
https://globalriskinsights.com/2018/12/challenge-far-right-ukrainian-militias/
"Officially issued" has nothing to do with it. When the situation went pear shaped in the Ukraine, armories ad stockpiles were broken into and raided, with or without the assistance of the forces that were supposed to be guarding them. Typical of any civil war (or at least, a war the Russians would prefer people think is a civil war), if it goes bang reliably, people are going to grab it and use it. It doesn't take any time at all to come across plenty of images from reliable news outlets (Reuters etc.) of combatants from both sides using SKS's and MN's. And the security situation in eastern Ukraine is bad enough, that even non-combatants are grabbing up whatever small arms they can for personal defense.
Regardless, it doesn't really matter who's using them or grabbing them. Small arms and ammo aren't leaving the Ukraine for the foreseeable future.
I know at least one person from _each_ of the independent militia groups that were operating in 2014. I know some ppl from groups called in this article "neo-nazi" and I find most of the article laughable. One can't call civil group "militia", militia is an armed group. There's so much wrong in this article but this will be total off topic to discuss the article. So I won't. Let's talk about guns.
You're making too broad conclusions from limited number of facts. Only some police departments were raided, their armories had Makarovs and AK (mainly AKSU) Consider following sources for pictures during initial stage of confict: private guns, reactivated guns, dewats and AK airsoft guns too were used by separatists on road blocks. All this chit was abandoned after first fights and there were no shortage of AKs and modern MGs for any side since then.
Exceptions are dozen of reworked MN snipers (abandoned project) and some number of Maxim MGs currently used, they have very interesting reason to use it.
As for private guns just in case - you underestimate Ukrainians. As captured guns are not accounted all my friends have at least PM, many have Stechkins they are more desirable - this is "for home defense" and "just in case" choice is usually AKMSU or even RPKs in some cases
Again, nothing of it we can import. Nobody needs SKSs and MNs, I can assure you. If one is very concern about legality - he buys legal converted auto AK and couple of spare parts to make it back select auto. Sound moderators are legal too BTW.And you're wrong, as I mentioned before Ukraine has been offering military surplus, I won't publish price lists, I don't think it's appropriate. Dealers had offers, they did not liked prices. That's all I can comment on this. There are also openly available yearly reports so everyone could see what guns were sold by Ukraine to which country.
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Oh, those things are probably in good hands now
hmm...covering up theft had not occurred to me. That is plausible.
I was leaning toward Russia having some hand in it.
It's quite possible separatists had something to do with some of recent incidents but first major fire at storage facility near my home town happened before the war. Blame usually gets dumped on people who die during the incident. Welder not following safety regulations, guard smoking on duty etc. Selling military equipment is not something out of ordinary back there and it started very long time ago, I'm talking early 90s. Corruption and theft went from higher ups all the way to regular soldiers. When I was growing up we used to go over the fence/through holes in the fence of local garrison and trade with conscripts for smokes and alcohol. Artillery powder, flares, ammo, first aid kits, gas masks, basically small things they could get away with stealing. I can only imagine what higher ranks had to offer.
While everyone was waiting for importers to buy now expensive Ukrainian guns this time help came from Belorus' (thanks to a person who PMed me). Enjoy your new old MNs and please post pictures, it would be nice to make sure there are no modern markings and rifles are as nice as from the old imports from Belarus years ago.
New reality is $369 + tax retail price. And no matter what we think about this price, in 5 years new collectors will probably be envying this number in a same manner today's collector envy $149 price tag for MNs. Let's see how it plays out.
P.S. hint for buyers - this batch is not very big, won't last long.
New reality is $369 + tax retail price. And no matter what we think about this price, in 5 years new collectors will probably be envying this number in a same manner today's collector envy $149 price tag for MNs. Let's see how it plays out.
P.S. hint for buyers - this batch is not very big, won't last long.
It's funny but Mosin and SKS cost more in Ukrainian stores than they cost here. Last time I was in Kiev, regular Mosin rifles were about 500 CAD in store and and I saw Russian SKS go anywhere between 450 and 800. Ones for around 450-500 looked like a bus ran over it. So yea guys, enjoy while you can.
sestroretsk
Member
- Location
- Nova Scotia
FYI - I got to see a crate from this recent shipment, and it appears as though they came from/through Czechia - there is a list of rifles in the crate labelled 'Bedna' stapled to the crates. The Cyrillic prefixes are listed on those lists.
There are BY markings stencilled on the crates, but they were also on crates that were around 5 or so years ago that came with Russian language paperwork inside.
Milanczar
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Ugh......please don't use or start using that word. That was a very bad 'Euro' idea.
People there call it the Czech Republic..
Nobody who lives there calls it that unless they want to seem strange or want to hear a negative response.
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