Very dissapointed - Bad Brass????

Nosler06

Nosler06

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I have been reloading my own ammo for many years and have never come accross this type of thing ever. I bought 100 rnds of unprimed Winchester 30-06 brass around 15 years ago. I had loaded all of the shells with a load that after test firing did not work in my rifle. I saved 80 rnds that I pulled with a kinetic bullet puller. I fired off all the primers and the ran them through the dies to size and pop the primers out. I inspected all of the cases and found 38 rnds that had various types of splits or cracks on the necks and when I look close at the cases they even look deformed. Did I do something wrong? Did the brass go brittle from sitting? I am stumped because the brass has never been fired other than a primer only. I have other brands of brass that have been reloaded 12 - 15 times.
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Can't speak to what happened there other than to say that I've had many odd ruptures using new Winchester brass. A couple years ago I posted pictures of new .357Mag Winchester brass that had split radially about a centimeter below the mouth after a single firing.

I know they generally enjoy a good reputation, but Winchester's the only brass I've ever had any real, unexplained problems with.
 
I find that peculiar. I've shot brass that was loaded before I was born and reloaded it no problem. All my Winchester stuff new and used has been good. I have no idea why this would happen other than Winchester didnt anneal well when manufacturing that batch?
 
I have seen that on some older ammo stored for long periods of time, like from 1945 to 1999. It was 303 ammo still in the military packaging.

As a side note I just finished tossing a batch of brass, all 1xf 30-06 Winchester brass that I bought new to make into 338-06 brass. I got 1 firing and 39 of 50 pieces have partial case head seperation. Needless to say, I tossed the whole lot. The brass was new 2 months ago and fired once doing barrel brake-in on a new barrel.

Needless to say, I'm kinda off Winchester brass for at least the next little while.......


Back to the original topic.......

I have been told it is a by-product of tight necks (too much neck tension) and brittle brass (not annealed properly or work hardened and not annealed).

That pretty much looks like what I would expect it to if the above circumstances were present.
 
Is it worth trying to anneal what brass I have left of it or am I just wasting time going through that process? I really feel like packaging up the brass and shipping it to Winchester and ask them WTF. I am going to write them a letter and let tham know that I am very dissatisfied and will be replacing with Remington, Nosler or Norma brass in future. I have had great success with Norma brass.
 
Had this happen to once fired 22-250 cases. Fired 50 rounds reloaded them and put them away for the next range session. When time came to go to the range,I had a feeling to give the bullet heads a twist with my fingers. 29 of them spun. The split was from the mouth to the shoulder and yes, winchester cases.
 
I was given 3 boxes of Winchester Silvertips in boxes that dated back some 20 years. They were factory cartridges, and had sat on my buddy's shelf for those years. When I went to use them, I found that about 20% of them had split necks just sitting as loaded ammo. Brass had turned brittle over time. I fired the remainder of those cartridges, and strange as it seems, none of the rest split the necks, even after several reloadings. I still think Winchester brass is as good as NA brass gets, since I hate Federal brass and Remington often has a somewhat lower capacity than does the WW brass. For the best brass, you have to go European, though [Lapua is my favorite] Eagleye.
 
Had a bag of new Win brass 7mm rem mag, about half of them did not fit in the shell holder, tried another shell holder same problem. I exchanged them for a different lot number and had no problem.
I think they have quality control problems
 
I've also had 1x fired WW brass that had split necks. New stuff, too, not old. Never had a problem with RP brass, which I generally much prefer over WW...
 
Nosler06 said:
Is it worth trying to anneal what brass I have left of it or am I just wasting time going through that process? I really feel like packaging up the brass and shipping it to Winchester and ask them WTF. I am going to write them a letter and let tham know that I am very dissatisfied and will be replacing with Remington, Nosler or Norma brass in future. I have had great success with Norma brass.
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I would anneal the remaining brass.
Nothing to lose but a little time.
 
I wonder if brass is manufactured to a lesser cost saving standards to only last for a one time firing.

Maybe the manufacturer doesn't want their factory ammunition to be used for reloading. they rather you buy more factory ammo.

:D It's a conspiracy.
 
I got a bunch of Remington factory ammo from my father-in-law when I bought all his guns. Most of that would have been bought in the late 70's, since that's when he was into that sort of thing.

Anyways, a high percentage of that stash of ammo split necks, and seeing that I didn't bother keeping any of it. There's probably a thread by someone puzzled over his once fired range pickups splitting necks somewhere.:)

Fast forward to a couple years ago. .375 H&H was a little hard to find, and I bought quite a bit of Remington brass in sealed factory bags. About 10% of that had necks with a hidden overlapping fold that couldn't be seen until it was sized. I routinely size new cases before loading, and that's when I caught it. I still has several bags of that brass, and am in the awkward situation of not wanting to use it, not wanting to sell someone else a problem, and not really wanting to throw it away either.

Bad brass happens. Age hardening happens.I wouldn't draw too many conclusions about Winchester brass, based on this experience on 15 year old stuff. I also wouldn't be too interested in useing ancient factory ammo on a hunt that mattered.
 
at the very least, i'd send the pictures you have here and ask wtf?- they might replace it on customer service grounds alone- there may very well have been a "bad batch" or had the necks drawn too thin- i've used thousands of rounds of winchester, both virgin and once fired, and never ran into that on a first fire
 
When there is talk of bad things, it sems that Remington is the most often named brand. Happened to me, too.
Bought a sealed bag of 100 Reminton brass for 45-70. First loading, Marlin lever would not completely close. Found out the primers were not fully seated. Don't bother telling me I should check primer seating as I seat them. I know that, of course, and looked at them after, but considering new brass, more or less assumed they were going fully in, and didn't give them a sure fire test to see if they were fully in. Took some cartridges apart, tried to seat primers deeper, no luck.
Found out the primer pockets not as deep, as are rifle primers. Pistol primers are about .002" less depth than rifle primers, but they would not go deep enough, either. I know, I could deepen the pockets, but it is not worth the hassel.
After a lot of trying to contact the proper Remington people, by both internet and telephone, I have had absolutely no luck. So Remington can stuff it, I will not buy another Remington product.
 
Thanks for all the advise. I have sent an e-mail to Winchester ammunition and told them what has occurred. Not expecting much from a large company, but at least they have my 2 cents and the fact that I will not be buying Winchester brass again. That is a for sure. I sent them the pics as well so they can see what it looks like. I will try to anneal what I have left and see what it looks like after annealing and another resize. If more split then into the scrap bucket to be sold as scrap metal. I'm not about to risk firing them in my rifle to end up with a stuck cause or anything else.
 
You may be surprised what you get out of Winchester.......

Last year I had a few bricks of bad .22 ammo. I wrote to federal and told them that...... "this sucks" and "what do I do with the rest of the case, I won't shoot it".......

The result.

The local Federal Rep contacted me and offered a Cheque in the amount of what the ammo retails for or exchange for a new case from a different lot.

I was surprised to say the least, they gave me credit for the 3 bricks I had shot off and a case of ammo in excange for the 7 bricks I had left.

YMMV but I woudn't give up hope just yet, winnie may just make it up to you.......
 
Never had a problem with splitting necks... odd.

That said, please hit the enter key between your photos so that we don't have to scroll over 5 miles to see all the photos! :)
 
I hate hearing this, just as I'm in the process of cleaning up 1200 pieces of 30.06 brass in the tumbler. Probably half of it is Winchester going back from early 1980s to last year.
 
Do you have a Lee factory crimp die? The crimp marks on your cases look alot like a factory style crimp. I bought a bunch of 223wssm cases four years that had the start of the same cracking, new unfired. I tossed 8-10 cases out of each 50 count bag I bought.
 
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