Vetterli Video

Great video, thanks for sharing.

Beautifull guns,
beautifully engineered, beautifully machined, beautifull stocks, beautifull furniture, beautifully balanced, beautifull before their time.
I have, among others, one with the original loading gate and one with set triggers.
Beautifull!
 
I shot my M69/71 Swiss Vetterli in yesterday's EOSC Milshoot and was did better than middle of the pack.

Centrefire conversion, 348 Win brass, 310 gr cast bullets at about 1600 fps.

I have observed that the M69/71 is much more common in Canada than later versions, while in the US, it's the other way around.
 
Another great video from the boys! Here in UK they are VERY uncommon as shooters, due to the reticence about making ammunition to suit. Although they are available 'off-ticket' like any other obsolete calibre here in UK, if you want to shoot it you have to have it licensed, just like any other firearm. Our local gun store has a couple in stock as wall-hangers - a great pity as they can be made to shoot really well, as the video and the previous poster have shown us.

tac
 
tacfoley said:
Another great video from the boys! Here in UK they are VERY uncommon as shooters, due to the reticence about making ammunition to suit.
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are you allowed to make up reloadable shells using 22 blanks or Hilti shells for primers? Also as a better alternative, are you allowed to convert them to centerfire and form cases and reload same? I have one that when I get a round two it, I want to convert to centerfire. I did fire a shot from a friends Vetterli using original rimfire ammo; accurate with relatively little noise and no recoil. In the video, there are quite a few shots where I can see gas escaping from the breach area. I have to wonder if the pressure is too low for brass cases to seal the bore. I also assume he must have converted his Vetterli to centerfire because the cases are brass while original shells are copper or at least copper coloured. I doubt that a person could get all of the shells lined up to fire as a repeater, if the shooter was using blanks for primers.

cheers mooncoon
 
mooncoon said:
are you allowed to make up reloadable shells using 22 blanks or Hilti shells for primers? Also as a better alternative, are you allowed to convert them to centerfire and form cases and reload same? I have one that when I get a round two it, I want to convert to centerfire. I did fire a shot from a friends Vetterli using original rimfire ammo; accurate with relatively little noise and no recoil. In the video, there are quite a few shots where I can see gas escaping from the breach area. I have to wonder if the pressure is too low for brass cases to seal the bore. I also assume he must have converted his Vetterli to centerfire because the cases are brass while original shells are copper or at least copper coloured. I doubt that a person could get all of the shells lined up to fire as a repeater, if the shooter was using blanks for primers.
cheers mooncoon
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Sir - .22 blanks are licensed items here - not generally available. Hilti gun shells are also licensed. IF I wanted to shoot one of these rifles, I'd make the cases as noted in the post #7 above, and on swissrifles.com under Vetterli where Carlos and I are members. I, too, noted the wisps of gas, and tend to agree with you about the low charge. He noted that he was using loading data based on .44Mag lead bullet loads - fine, maybe in a 6" - 14" barrel, but woefully low for the thirty-three inch barrel of the Vetterli. He would have gotten a better result by using a load intended for a long-barrelled lever-action, but that's just my opinion.

He also noted in his commentary that he had converted it to centre fire, and that it was easy to restore it to its former configuration if required.

I'd be very interested to know the precise load that Andy was using in HIS Vetterli, if he can detail it for us. I'd bet my next month pension that it was more than the squeakpip load we saw in the video.

Best

tac
 
tacfoley said:
Sir - .22 blanks are licensed items here - not generally available. Hilti gun shells are also licensed. IF I wanted to shoot one of these rifles, I'd make the cases as noted in the post #7 above, and on swissrifles.com under Vetterli where Carlos and I are members. I, too, noted the wisps of gas, and tend to agree with you about the low charge. He noted that he was using loading data based on .44Mag lead bullet loads - fine, maybe in a 6" - 14" barrel, but woefully low for the thirty-three inch barrel of the Vetterli. He would have gotten a better result by using a load intended for a long-barrelled lever-action, but that's just my opinion.

He also noted in his commentary that he had converted it to centre fire, and that it was easy to restore it to its former configuration if required.

I'd be very interested to know the precise load that Andy was using in HIS Vetterli, if he can detail it for us. I'd bet my next month pension that it was more than the squeakpip load we saw in the video.

Best

tac
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I have no problem sharing it.

It was 47.0 grs (a full case) of a flake powder pulled from surplus Swedish 8X63 rounds, producing about 1600 fps. Now you'll never find that load published! Its burn rate is in the range of Varget and by chance it is about perfect for this rifle - a bit of unburnt powder, but nice and consistent and it maximized the MV. Another popular load I've used is 20.0 grs of SR4759 which produces about 1375 fps in my and most other Vetterlis. Also proven and safe.

The notion of using 44 Mag loads is actually a fair rule of thumb for faster powders (H4227 and faster) - conservative in fact as has been suggsted. The case capacity of a 44 Mag cartridge of about 40.0 grs compared to about 65.0 grs for the 41 Swiss. On the other hand, the max pressure of the 44 Mag is 38K psi and of the 41 Swiss about 20K psi, since the bores are the same size, the greater cartridge capacity nicely lowers pressure to suit the 41 Swiss.
 
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I'm much obliged to you, Sir, for that most interesting information. With details of the bullet that you are shooting, I can go looking for an affordable and shootable Vetterli.

Sadly, something else has to go, but at least I can buy the gun with the future intention of shooting it, and get round to that if and when the time comes that I can bear to part with something I already have.

tac
 
tacfoley said:
I'm much obliged to you, Sir, for that most interesting information. With details of the bullet that you are shooting, I can go looking for an affordable and shootable Vetterli.

Sadly, something else has to go, but at least I can buy the gun with the future intention of shooting it, and get round to that if and when the time comes that I can bear to part with something I already have.

tac
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I have tried a number of bullets, but the simple and inexpensive Lee 310 gr GC made for the 44 Mag, sized to suit, crimped in a cartridge made from 348 Win brass with a length of 1.635" has been the ticket for me.
 
Thank you indeed for that. I've now got the itch, to go with my 1914 K11 and 1954 K31. The other K31 is an action only with a Schultz and Larsen barrel and fancy 300m sights, so it doesn't count. I'd be very grateful if you could PM me with the reloading process and details of the conversion to centrefire. I have been a reloader since 1969, but never converted one calibre cases to another with quite such a drastic difference!

Anyhow, I'm sure that although most of you who are interested in Swiss schtuff have seen this - http://www.swissrifles.com/vetterli/article - it won't hurt to remind you about it.

Best from yUK.

tac

PS - mooncoon, please read your PM.
 
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Oh good Gawd, I hope Janice doesn't see this thread!

She has already discovered my Bubba Special Vetterlis (one is an original CARBINE)..... and she darned well KNOWS that I have Lebel brass!

DIOPTER is a good Friend..... but he is creating a Monster now!

(Oh, no! I can hear the lathe starting up! Next it's gonna be, "Smellie, where did you hide that .50-cal box of Vetterli parts?")
 
A friend of mine many years ago gave me a Vetterli that was missing quite a few parts.
Loading gate, carrier and feed mechanism, various barrel bands, cleaning rod, rear sight etc.

Recently a Swiss friend had a 1873 Winchester from his girlfriends family to sell which had a loading problem.
Some worn parts would not let the carrier go up enough to load easily.

Makes me wonder how many Vetterlis were sacrificed for 1866 & 1873 lever gun parts.
Interesting to think all those cowboy rifles out there possibly with Swiss made parts.
Anyone feel a yodel coming on?
Was Slim Whitman's real name Hans Wittmann? :)


smellie
Sorry. You know what kind of a fertilzers disturber I can be, so here is some more fuel.
http://www.gundigest.com/gun-collecting-firearm-collecting/gun-collecting-swiss-vetterli-rifles
 
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Swiss products sent me a few of their Vetterli Centerfire firing pin conversion holders.
Now I need to find the RCBS No5 decapping pins for the firing pins.
 
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