VZ58 7.62x39 vs XCR 7.62x39

the_klenzer

the_klenzer

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Hey guys
I'm looking for feedback from people who've owned both a VZ58 as well as a RobArms XCR in 7.62x39. Ive got a couple vz58s, but love the black rifles too (and have some in .223). I just hate buying .223 compared to cheap surplus 7.62 for a range day. :)
Thus the 7.62 XCR seems like the perfect rifle for me.

Wondering if I can get some feedback though before I look at plunking down $1500 more than another VZ58.

1) is there much improvement in accuracy at 200+ yds? I'm not expecting any, but it would be a nice surprise. Most of my shooting is 100-200yds anyway.

2) Cleaning time - Is the XCR any faster/slower to take down/clean than the VZ58? Since it's primarily shooting surplus, even with a chrome lined barrel, I still want to clean it often.

3) Reliability - Yeah, you don't have to look far to find XCR haters... but the VZ58 is bombproof. Is this a case of "haters gonna hate" and the XCR is decent?

4) 10 rd XCR 7.62 pistol mags Does anyone have these? hard to get? Reliable?

Appreciate the feedback!
Thanks!
 
I don't have any experience with a 7.62x39 XCR so I can't answer all your questions but I believe the CZ will prove easier to clean. It field strips in seconds, especially the gas tube.

I do prefer the ergonomics of the XCR but the CZ is quite good... I was surprised how good the butt was when shooting because I did not like it when just handling the rifle...
 
Ok, well I haven't owned an XCR, I have shot a number of them in .223, and I have owned a CZ858, so I'll throw in my $.02.

1. Improvement in accuracy would mainly be from the addition of decent optics. Using surplus, if you were to strap both into a vice, I bet accuracy would be about the same, but you can easily add optics to the XCR, which will give the shooter an edge over the leaf sights on the VZ.

2. Probably about the same, although the VZ is probably one of the easiest short-stroke piston guns to clean... the tear down is just so easy.

3. I'd give this one to the VZ... as you said, bomb proof, but the XCR, at least the newer ones, aren't un-reliable.

4. Check Wolverine for availability. I know they carry them, but am un sure if they have them in stock right now.

5. (I thought I'd add this...) The XCR also has the ability to easily change calibres to .223 and 6.8 SPC. I imagine you'd grab a conversion barrel, right?
 
the_klenzer said:
1) is there much improvement in accuracy at 200+ yds? I'm not expecting any, but it would be a nice surprise. Most of my shooting is 100-200yds anyway.

2) Cleaning time - Is the XCR any faster/slower to take down/clean than the VZ58? Since it's primarily shooting surplus, even with a chrome lined barrel, I still want to clean it often.

3) Reliability - Yeah, you don't have to look far to find XCR haters... but the VZ58 is bombproof. Is this a case of "haters gonna hate" and the XCR is decent?

4) 10 rd XCR 7.62 pistol mags Does anyone have these? hard to get? Reliable?
Click to expand...

I own an XCR and owned a CZ858 and all I can say is that they are two very different rifles. It's somewhat like the AK vs M16 arguments - in the end it's really apples and oranges, different strokes for different folks.

With regards to accuracy, the limitation is really the round. The XCR has superior ergonomics which could mean a more comfortable shooting position which could translate into better range results, but it's really a personal thing. The XCR feels heavier, probably due to the heavy barrel which tends to make it feel somewhat front heavy vs. the 858, which could impact your range results if you were shooting from a standing position, without a proper sling for long periods of time. Personally I find the XCR to be more accurate than my 858 was. I have a hogue rubberized grip on it, magpul AFG and use an adjustable two point sling. It fits me better, and I get better results.

I find the XCR easier to clean. There is a little switch on the back of the upper that disengages a latch that separates the upper and lower, allowing you to swivel the upper and remove the bolt assembly and gas piston. Very quick, very easy. It's actually a beautiful system, one that gets very little discussion here.

Here is a video of the XCR field stripping procedure:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryUMkzkAieI

That's not to say that the VZ58 is difficult to clean. It's just a bit more clumsy compared to the XCR. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qoAL1DNYTQE. Easy, quick, but not nearly as awesome a process.

If you're talking about the VZ58, your reliability is going to be top notch. Keep in mind that the CZ858 (non restricted) has had it's share of problems - the notorious 'gremlin' that although easy to fix, hardly makes the rifle 'bomb proof'. Your mileage may vary with the XCR as well. I've shot a few hundred rounds down range and NEVER had a problem. No loctite, nothing. I think the newer XCR rifles (like mine) are better than the first batch, which is where that reputation comes from. I'd say you're safe with the newer ones, but I'm a sample size of one. If you do end up buying an XCR, buy right from Wolverine Supplies. If you do end up with an issue, they're top notch and will treat you like gold until the issues are resolved.

Wolverine brought in a batch of 10 round mags with the XCR pistols but they aren't available to purchase as individual items yet. They were expecting a shipment last time I asked. Marstar has 30/5 magazines if you're into the look cool factor.

Is the XCR worth the extra money? I think so. I have no regrets. I sold my CZ858 shortly after I bought it.
 
I figure this thread is worthless without pics, so here is the rig

303022_10150823942680150_587250149_21140190_679801561_n.jpg


XCR 7.62x39
Magpul AFG
Houge Pistol Grip
Lucid HD7

The bipod doesn't belong, just used it to get the rifle upright for the picture.
 
I own XCR both in rifle and pistol, also my shooting buddy had a VZ58, so i have use both platforms.

When it comes to accuracy I find the heavier XCR absorb the recoil much better than the VZ, which translate to better groupings.
Field stripping is a cinch with XCR press a lever the whole bolt and piston assembly slides right out, next loosen the barrel nut and slid the barrel and gas tube right out, instead flushing with boiling water, I just run hot water trough the barrel and the gas tube straight from the faucet until the metal becomes too hot to handle, than I towel it dry, clean and lube with Ed's Red.
Reliability wise I haven't notice any clear advantage between one from the other, However I do find that the VZ needs a lot of lube, my buddy doesn't keep his rifle as wet with lube as I would have, so he had fair bit of trouble with jams, but once he learned to keep it wet with lube it was much better.

Ergonomically the difference is night and day, XCR wins it by a mile, if you buy your XCR straight from Wolverine you can order additional pistol and the new 30 pinned to 5 mags.
 
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1. You may like the trigger on a XCR a little more then the CZ/VZ rifles... The first time I shot mine it took me by surprise litteraly... The 858's I have used were a tad heavy.
The irons on both rifles do there job as well as can be expected but I like the ability to just toss a scope on the XCR rail on a whim... Today it's a x10 target scope, tommorow it's my red dot and there's plenty of room back and forth for proper eye relief of the scope as opposed to a typical 858 scout mount.
All the above effect accuracy but if it's mean raw apples to apples clamp em down and let em buck, shooting at little black dots till they start to smoke... The heavy barrel on the XCR will probably have the edge, hand loads and a good optic I know the XCR can hold under 2" at 200M... Well under 2" infact.

2. Cleaning.... Both are simple to clean but the XCR needs a Allen key.

3. Haven't had any issues with either rifle myself, after the break in on the XCR it runs well.

4. Wolverine has em... Same with 5/30... Only reliability issue I know of is trouble feeding when you stuff all 30 in the bigger mags but that won't be a problem in the great white north now will it?

My only regret with the XCR is not getting the pistol version in 7.62x39 and holding out for a XCR-M in .308 for a hunting rifle.
 
the_klenzer said:
Hey guys
I'm looking for feedback from people who've owned both a VZ58 as well as a RobArms XCR in 7.62x39. Ive got a couple vz58s, but love the black rifles too (and have some in .223). I just hate buying .223 compared to cheap surplus 7.62 for a range day. :)
Thus the 7.62 XCR seems like the perfect rifle for me.

Wondering if I can get some feedback though before I look at plunking down $1500 more than another VZ58.

1) is there much improvement in accuracy at 200+ yds? I'm not expecting any, but it would be a nice surprise. Most of my shooting is 100-200yds anyway.

2) Cleaning time - Is the XCR any faster/slower to take down/clean than the VZ58? Since it's primarily shooting surplus, even with a chrome lined barrel, I still want to clean it often.

3) Reliability - Yeah, you don't have to look far to find XCR haters... but the VZ58 is bombproof. Is this a case of "haters gonna hate" and the XCR is decent?

4) 10 rd XCR 7.62 pistol mags Does anyone have these? hard to get? Reliable?

Appreciate the feedback!
Thanks!
Click to expand...


I recently got a few of the 10rd 7.62 mags. I have not had time to put very many rounds through them but did do one function test by loading them up and shooting them off as fast as possible. They worked fine.
 
Awesome feedback guys, thanks!!

One of my VZs is stock + fab furniture, the other is all NEA with the AR stock/cantilever scope mount configuration, so it carries optics well (with a PEPR mount to move them forward), so there probably isn't going to be too much difference in optics.

Good to know cleaning is about the same and accuracy will be able the same.

The 10rd mags may be the swing vote, when they become more available. I'll probably hold off on the XCR until I can get a bunch at the same time, or maybe one will come up on the EE for a smokin deal.

Thanks again!
 
I have both but to me they are completely different rifles.

CZ -cheaper by a fair amount of money but completely functional and the workmanship is of high quality.
-almost as accurate as the XCR but I also never set it up with optics other then a red dot.
-just as reliable as the XCR.
-field stripping isn't as easy as the XCR but close.
-people seem to like the rugged eastern bloc look of a CZ.
-sometimes simplicity in a firearm adds a certain level of fun factor.

XCR -caliber change is nice.
-trigger is sweet.
-ergonomics is better but I paid for that in the price of the firearm.
-accurate and functions great with fully resized reloads.
-10 round pistol mags is a great perk.
-has a similar look to an AR.
-lots of rail for accessories and optic options.
 
My CZ858 in 7.62x39 is all decked out with all the aftermarket bells and whistles that I wanted and I am still not into it for a lot of money. A bare XCR costs a small fortune. I love the CZ for how it breaks down for cleaning too. It can be done in seconds. I could buy two CZ's totally decked out for less than an XCR. Choice is easy for me.
 
I haven't run an XCR, but I can say, even with all the aftermarket parts I get, I can completely strip my VZ in 15 seconds or less (yes I timed it, lol). Its an extremely simple rifle to operate, clean and handle. The XCR is a newer platform by about 5 decades so the ergonomics out of the box are better, that said, on a VZ for pretty cheap, you can have a bolt release, ambi safety, ambi mag release etc and your ergonomics are pretty nice. The VZ has a stipper guide, but the xcr im sure can use a maglula or whatever they are called.

It comes down to buy in cost, looks etc. The XCR gets the 10 rd mag atm, but Im hoping CSA's new adapter will allow VZs to use them as well.

My money obviously went to the VZ but I would still love to get an XCR-M one day. Guns are like women, each beautiful in its own way and eventually all should be locked up in my basement...
 
Same magwell on the XCR - 7.62x39 XCR mags are the same size as AR mags, therefore the adapter should work both ways, allowing the 10 round XCR pistol mag to work in the Vz. No one has tried it yet though.
 
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