Walking rear sight block

neilselden

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If I had known the sight blocks would evolve and start walking, I would have taken care of this earlier.

On my two .22 rifles (Marlin 795 and Marlin 989 M2) I have Tech Sights. Unfortunately, on both, the damn rear sight block does not stay in place. I cranked down the attaching screws as tight as can be, and even used loctite on one rail to see if that helps. While the loctite did help, even then, 100 rounds or so made the sight move slightly backwards. And I don't like the idea of using an adhesive to make sure my sights stay in place.

I've done some looking around, and this seems to be an issue with Tech Sights on Marlin semi-auto rimfires in general. The consensus is that the dovetails are not manufactured to tight enough tolerances. So the dovetail may have ever so slight dimension variations, that make it hard to really lock the sight down to it.
People mounting scopes often recommend using a one piece scope mount with rings that covers most or all of the dovetail. Folks using that setup report that the one piece mount does not walk back because it attaches so securely to the dovetail with three screws.

Oddly though, POI is not changing for me as the rear sight walks backwards.

So I figured I'd better get professional help. The rifles are at Gunco right now, to have a set screw installed which will lock the sight block to the rail. The gunsmith came up with a clever idea so that the work will not be visible. I'm looking forward to it being done and getting onto the range to see how well it works. I'm expecting the damn thing to stay put, no matter how many rounds I put through the rifle.

By the way, I don't think this has anything to do with the Tech Sights per se. The problem seems to be with the rifles' dovetail rails. It's almost enough to make me cry ;) as I have some weird attachment to Marlin .22 semi-autos. Yeah, I know, they're inexpensive mass market rifles... so you can't expect very high quality on every aspect. That said, both Marlins shoot very well and I'd buy another 989 M2 in a heartbeat. I like the 795 a lot, but I absolutely love the 989, even though the bolt does not lock back after your last round.

Cheers,
Neil
 
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What size dovetail are the Tech Sights meant for? If its 3/8", that could be part of the problem. Newer Marlins (2005 onward) have an 11mm dovetail, or close to it. I would think the 989 would be the older style, but I don't know when it was made.

Remington hasn't done the brand any favours, either.

Having said that, the newer Marlin 60 I had didn't have any problems with Warne rings set up for an 11mm dovetail. They've never moved.
 
I am not familiar with those rifles or that product, but do know that sights and scopes want to move FORWARD, not rearward, on a rifle due to recoil. Examine a Weaver T0-1 base for the Lee Enfields, and notice the ring stop is at the front of the rail, not the rear. The SAKO tapers are wider to the front, to resist the assembly moving forward under recoil. The sight/scope has inertia to stay still - the recoiling rifle moves rearward, so the effect is for the sight/scope wants to move forward in it's mount. When mounting a scope ring into a slotted base, the ring should always be pushed forward at installation, to get a good bearing of the ring's cross bar onto the base's cross slot - at the front edge. If your sight / scope is moving rearward, there is some other force at work?
 
What size dovetail are the Tech Sights meant for? If its 3/8", that could be part of the problem. Newer Marlins (2005 onward) have an 11mm dovetail, or close to it. I would think the 989 would be the older style, but I don't know when it was made.

Remington hasn't done the brand any favours, either.

Having said that, the newer Marlin 60 I had didn't have any problems with Warne rings set up for an 11mm dovetail. They've never moved.

That's a good question - I'll have to ask Erik at Tech Sights. I didn't even know the rail dimensions changed at some point - thanks for that info. I'm glad yoru scope rings are secure - you got a rifle with an in-spec rail, I guess. :)

However, I don't think a width difference is at play here, only because the sight block walks on both rifles. And after doing some looking around, a good number of people report the same issue.

Cheers,
Neil
 
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I am not familiar with those rifles or that product, but do know that sights and scopes want to move FORWARD, not rearward, on a rifle due to recoil. Examine a Weaver T0-1 base for the Lee Enfields, and notice the ring stop is at the front of the rail, not the rear. The SAKO tapers are wider to the front, to resist the assembly moving forward under recoil. The sight/scope has inertia to stay still - the recoiling rifle moves rearward, so the effect is for the sight/scope wants to move forward in it's mount. When mounting a scope ring into a slotted base, the ring should always be pushed forward at installation, to get a good bearing of the ring's cross bar onto the base's cross slot - at the front edge. If your sight / scope is moving rearward, there is some other force at work?

Jason, the gunsmith said something very similar. He thought the sights would walk forward under recoil. After a little bit of thought, he's supposing that the force of the bolt slamming backwards may be the cause.

I sent Tech Sights a note about it, and Erik responded that:
1) Marlin rails are known to be inconsistent. Based on the number of reports I've read, this is true.
2) Sometimes, you need to wear away the paint that is on the rail, for the sight to seat properly.
3) Seating and re-seating the sights will also help to keep it in place.

Based #2 and #3, it sounds to me like you may need to wear a slight groove into the rail so the sights "catch" in place.

As far as I can see, this is not a sight issue, but a rifle issue. No big deal in the end, as it's getting fixed with a set screw.

Cheers,
Neil
 
My 795 had the scope rings walk whenever I used mini mags. I got so frustrated with it I said was going to tighten it real good, and if I stripped the threads, oh well. It never walked again after that.
 
My 795 had the scope rings walk whenever I used mini mags. I got so frustrated with it I said was going to tighten it real good, and if I stripped the threads, oh well. It never walked again after that.

I didn't have the guts to crank it down to 100% of my strength.

I got the rifles back this morning (I love Gunco - no BS, good prices, good work). The smith drilled and tapped for a small set screw - the screw fits right into a recess on the base of the rear sight block, so that sucker ain't going anywhere.

I was wondering if HV ammo generated enough force to move the sight back, but I will be definitely be shooting a good deal of it so switching to SV exclusively wasn't an option.

Cheers,
Neil
 
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