Want to buy a flintlock, what am I getting myself in to?

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Iron Sighted

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So after owning centerfire and rimfire firearms for awhile now, and loading for the centerfires for some time as well, I have recently found myself wanting to perhaps get in to some black powder fun. I'm in B.C. so no advantage from a muzzle loading season from a hunting perspective, though I do think it would be fun to try and hunt a big game animal with a flintlock rifle.

I've tried to do a bit of reading online to get at least a bit educated, and from what I've seen a kit is probably the most economical way to get in to a traditional patterned flintlock, however most of the cheaper and more readily available ones don't get the best reviews. I found a few recommendations for the Kibler kits, and after looking at the Woodsrunner I'm kind of leaning in that direction, appears to be the easiest to assemble and finish and gets you pretty decent rifle at a reasonable cost. Am I way off here, would you recommend something like that to someone looking to get started?

It'll probably be a little bit before I throw the money down and dive in to it so I've got lots of time to read up and continue learn ahead of time so I'd be grateful for any resources you all might recommend, or any information you want to share.

Thanks!
 
If you are able to make it south a bit, you might want to consider going to the Heffley Creek rendezvous, a bit north of Kamloops. This year it is running from July 13 to July 21. There will probably be around 200 people there and there are usually two events each day; one from 9:00 am to noon and a second from 1:00 to 4:00 pm. It will allow you to see a variety of different guns and get an idea of what model or style interests you and there may be something that interests you, for sale. The greatest criticism of import guns is they are not a very good replica of original rifles and in the case of flintlocks, the frizzens are case hardened and when that wears through, the frizzen needs to be case hardened again. A soft frizzen does not spark. It is a learning experience but in the long run it becomes addictive

cheers mooncoon
 
mooncoon said:
If you are able to make it south a bit, you might want to consider going to the Heffley Creek rendezvous, a bit north of Kamloops. This year it is running from July 13 to July 21. There will probably be around 200 people there and there are usually two events each day; one from 9:00 am to noon and a second from 1:00 to 4:00 pm. It will allow you to see a variety of different guns and get an idea of what model or style interests you and there may be something that interests you, for sale. The greatest criticism of import guns is they are not a very good replica of original rifles and in the case of flintlocks, the frizzens are case hardened and when that wears through, the frizzen needs to be case hardened again. A soft frizzen does not spark. It is a learning experience but in the long run it becomes addictive

cheers mooncoon
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Never heard of this event. I might have to come check it out, my buddy lives just up the hill at Knoff Lake.
 
For sure check out Heffley Creek, it’s a bucket list gathering for many worshipers of the holy black.

I started into BP with a Thompson Centre Hawkin flintlock rifle, at the time it was considered by many to be the gold standard of what was available to us meer mortals shopping over the counter at local stores… and it has been a very decent rifle now almost 20yrs and counting.

Im out by grande prairie Alberta, we have a limited BP group up here but they are a solid bunch of ornary old codgers and a good time to be around, we have a couple shoots in this area every year thru the Peace River range and the Valleyview range, newcomers are always welcome and a coach and a rifle can be arranged too so folks get some trigger time and a good feel for what they are getting themselves into…

I wouldn’t suggest someone who’s never shot a flinter to dive in with both feet and order up a Kibler for their first gun but hey, I’m sure you wouldn’t be the first and they are probably one of the easiest kits to build… problem being that if you decide it’s not for you it can be rather hard to recoup that money out of it… I’m just over $2250 into my kit and it is still sitting on the shelf in Ohio, duty and taxes are yet to be paid… plus tools… plus finishing supplies…

I own several cap lock rifles and a nice 12ga SxS cap lock now and find myself reaching for them far more than my flinter these days…. Both are fun but you need to be committed to a flinter, learn all about why it didn’t go BOOM when the hammer drops, hoard flints when you find them restocked anywhere in North America, be several pounds of powder ahead incase it’s impossible to find… you can’t burn (or really shouldn’t burn) substitute powders like pyrodex and 777 in them, hang fires really are a thing… cap locks are more forgiving all around… but mastering a flinter will make you an all around better rifleman imho.
 
Hotwheels81 said:
For sure check out Heffley Creek, it’s a bucket list gathering for many worshipers of the holy black.

I started into BP with a Thompson Centre Hawkin flintlock rifle, at the time it was considered by many to be the gold standard of what was available to us meer mortals shopping over the counter at local stores… and it has been a very decent rifle now almost 20yrs and counting.

Im out by grande prairie Alberta, we have a limited BP group up here but they are a solid bunch of ornary old codgers and a good time to be around, we have a couple shoots in this area every year thru the Peace River range and the Valleyview range, newcomers are always welcome and a coach and a rifle can be arranged too so folks get some trigger time and a good feel for what they are getting themselves into…

I wouldn’t suggest someone who’s never shot a flinter to dive in with both feet and order up a Kibler for their first gun but hey, I’m sure you wouldn’t be the first and they are probably one of the easiest kits to build… problem being that if you decide it’s not for you it can be rather hard to recoup that money out of it… I’m just over $2250 into my kit and it is still sitting on the shelf in Ohio, duty and taxes are yet to be paid… plus tools… plus finishing supplies…

I own several cap lock rifles and a nice 12ga SxS cap lock now and find myself reaching for them far more than my flinter these days…. Both are fun but you need to be committed to a flinter, learn all about why it didn’t go BOOM when the hammer drops, hoard flints when you find them restocked anywhere in North America, be several pounds of powder ahead incase it’s impossible to find… you can’t burn (or really shouldn’t burn) substitute powders like pyrodex and 777 in them, hang fires really are a thing… cap locks are more forgiving all around… but mastering a flinter will make you an all around better rifleman imho.
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Thanks for the info! That's great that you have a Kibler on the way, gives me an idea of what to expect price wise, I'm guessing $2700 or a bit more would be in the ballpark after duty/taxes, tools and finishing materials? Pretty tempted as I think it would be something I'd enjoy and likely would finally get me to invest in some casting equipment as well(plus it would give me some time to accumulate all the items I'd need for shooting B.P. while I tinker away on finishing the rifle).

Make sure you post yours here after you get it and finish building it, I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts on it. Which model did you buy?

Heffley Creek also sounds awesome, may have to take the kids to visit their grandparents in Kelowna around that time so I'd have an excuse to be in the area.
 
Two suggestions.

Go to a decent sized Rendezvous and meet people. Find someone you can shoot with and who can give you advice. There are numerous pitfalls in muzzle loaders that are not obvious for a newbie, one or two of which can be dangerous.

Don't start with a flinter. They are persnickety. Get yourself a moderately priced cap lock and shoot it a bunch before you commit to a flintlock. You need to be reasonably experienced with muzzle loading before moving to a flinter.
 
I Dont Care About You said:
The Hefley Creek Rendezvous has been going for decades.
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The event has been moved to July this year in the hopes of avoiding the fire hazard problems of recent years. The first photo is looking down the valley of the Heffley Creek Gun Club and primitive is in the trees on the right hand side. The scenery has changed quite a bit as the club is changing things around to permit long range shooting.
I am also tempted to echo others who have recommended starting with percussion because there is quite a learning curve switching to muzzle loading and even more so with flintlocks. Depending on the gunshow, a second hand precussion import hawken style rifle can often be found in the $400 range or maybe a bit more. There were two Kiblers at the shoot in 2022, for I think $1800 each.
Another thought also is to start with a 50 cal or maybe a 54. The small calibers are nice to shoot but of limited application and a royal pain to clean, at least for those around 32 to 36 caliber

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I see you are listed as "Peace Country". I am just north of Valleyview (so about 3 hours away if you are in DC) and you are welcome to come out and try out a few flinters if you like before "pulling the trigger" on buying one. I have several and can shoot in the back yard. A quality flintlock is a significant "investment" but they are OH SO MUCH FUN!. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions or want to come out and make some smoke.
 
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There are lots of accurate barrels out there and that seems to be what most newbies to BP seem to focus on but you should concentrate your search for a rifle with a high quality flint lock. A cheapie will consume your expensive and hard to find flints and become unreliable for ignition to the point of discouraging you from a truly addictive pastime. For consistent ignition you must use real BP with a flinter. Finally, the Heffley Creek Rendezvous is the mecca for BP afficionados in Canada.... a real blast! You will learn more in a week there than years of reading about BP shooting...been there, done that.
As for kit rifles, Track of the Wolf has several and would be a good source of info for a quality build. I have never had any issues with bringing in kit muzzle loaders or parts from the USA over the past decade.
Good luck.
 
Iron Sighted said:
So after owning centerfire and rimfire firearms for awhile now, and loading for the centerfires for some time as well, I have recently found myself wanting to perhaps get in to some black powder fun. I'm in B.C. so no advantage from a muzzle loading season from a hunting perspective, though I do think it would be fun to try and hunt a big game animal with a flintlock rifle.

I've tried to do a bit of reading online to get at least a bit educated, and from what I've seen a kit is probably the most economical way to get in to a traditional patterned flintlock, however most of the cheaper and more readily available ones don't get the best reviews. I found a few recommendations for the Kibler kits, and after looking at the Woodsrunner I'm kind of leaning in that direction, appears to be the easiest to assemble and finish and gets you pretty decent rifle at a reasonable cost. Am I way off here, would you recommend something like that to someone looking to get started?

It'll probably be a little bit before I throw the money down and dive in to it so I've got lots of time to read up and continue learn ahead of time so I'd be grateful for any resources you all might recommend, or any information you want to share.

Thanks!
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If I do the math on a Woodsrunner, extra fancy maple, CNC carving plus the lock, after exchange and shipping I come up with $2,808.70 plus duty.... That puts you at the low end of someone building you a custom gun from parts. The market here (Canada) for muzzle loaders is small... very small. Meaning resale is about half but also meaning you should be able to pick up something really nice sub $2000 the problem being finding one.

I have seen a couple Kibler kits come through the EE, give that a try (plus other forums)

Definitely take Licensed to Kill up on his offer.

If you do find a cheap used Pedersoli, TC, - I forget the other ... drop in (quality) replacement locks can be bought.

There is a video series on building the woodsrunner so you know what to expect: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLAS2xA3BU0Bn_ANsQXNB4f1yoY8FJngem

Finishing isn't going to cost an arm or a leg, tools will be pretty minimal, if you are at least moderately handy, you should have some of them.

My only real advise, if you went the Kibler route, would be to go with .54 - You can still buy commercial round balls for it, much lighter and better for your big game ;)
 
Iron Sighted said:
Thanks for the info! That's great that you have a Kibler on the way, gives me an idea of what to expect price wise, I'm guessing $2700 or a bit more would be in the ballpark after duty/taxes, tools and finishing materials? Pretty tempted as I think it would be something I'd enjoy and likely would finally get me to invest in some casting equipment as well(plus it would give me some time to accumulate all the items I'd need for shooting B.P. while I tinker away on finishing the rifle).

Make sure you post yours here after you get it and finish building it, I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts on it. Which model did you buy?

Heffley Creek also sounds awesome, may have to take the kids to visit their grandparents in Kelowna around that time so I'd have an excuse to be in the area.
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I bought a .54cal rifled Colonial with a range rod and a few other accessories, it was one of the immediately available kits…

I was going to get a .45cal southern mountain rifle for my missus because she wants to come to a few of the shoots this year but after some thought I decided a cap lock would be a better choice for her… the woods runner was also considered but I figured the colonial was just more the style I was looking for…. And with its overall length I’m closer to the targets than most other shooters and when you shoot as bad as I do you take any advantage you can get!!
 
sean69 said:
If I do the math on a Woodsrunner, extra fancy maple, CNC carving plus the lock, after exchange and shipping I come up with $2,808.70 plus duty.... That puts you at the low end of someone building you a custom gun from parts. The market here (Canada) for muzzle loaders is small... very small. Meaning resale is about half but also meaning you should be able to pick up something really nice sub $2000 the problem being finding one.

I have seen a couple Kibler kits come through the EE, give that a try (plus other forums)

Definitely take Licensed to Kill up on his offer.

If you do find a cheap used Pedersoli, TC, - I forget the other ... drop in (quality) replacement locks can be bought.

There is a video series on building the woodsrunner so you know what to expect: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLAS2xA3BU0Bn_ANsQXNB4f1yoY8FJngem

Finishing isn't going to cost an arm or a leg, tools will be pretty minimal, if you are at least moderately handy, you should have some of them.

My only real advise, if you went the Kibler route, would be to go with .54 - You can still buy commercial round balls for it, much lighter and better for your big game ;)
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I was thinking just the fancy maple in the kit and no carving to save a few dollars. Was already thinking 54 caliber as well so good to know I'm on the right track there, also already considering getting set up to cast so a round ball mold would be towards the top of the list there. I did start watching through the Woodsrunner videos that Jim Kibler has posted, I'll get through them all eventually, nice that he has made those for those of us that have never assembled and finished a kit rifle before. I'll keep an eye on the EE here in case anything enticing should pop up but I also kind of figured it would be neat to have a gun that I put together and finished myself. Not sure how these kits stack up vs. the lower end customs that are getting in to the same ballpark from a price perspective however.

I will definitely try to take License to Kill up on his generous offer as he isn't all that far from me and that would be a great opportunity for me.
 
Last year I was anxious to get into black powder after shooting modern rifle and pistol for years. Bought a nice rifled 1803 flintlock, powder balls and measures.

Fired it a couple of times and realized how slow the shooting was. Got rid of the stuff as soon as I could.

Lesson: it can be interesting but shooting BP isn't for everyone.
 
Loyer said:
Last year I was anxious to get into black powder after shooting modern rifle and pistol for years. Bought a nice rifled 1803 flintlock, powder balls and measures.

Fired it a couple of times and realized how slow the shooting was. Got rid of the stuff as soon as I could.

Lesson: it can be interesting but shooting BP isn't for everyone.
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You really need to go to a Rendezvous for BP to make a lot of sense. Shooting BP at a range would be awfully dull.
 
Loyer said:
Last year I was anxious to get into black powder after shooting modern rifle and pistol for years. Bought a nice rifled 1803 flintlock, powder balls and measures.

Fired it a couple of times and realized how slow the shooting was. Got rid of the stuff as soon as I could.

Lesson: it can be interesting but shooting BP isn't for everyone.
Click to expand...

Appreciate that input as well, though I think I'll enjoy B.P. shooting, if anything I find myself firing my semi-auto rifles the least of all, and as far as center fire firearms go, I'm looking at buying another Ruger No.1 before anything else. I won't know till I try as I've only ever shot a front stuffer once, well over a decade ago, but I recall it being pretty fun.
 
Loyer said:
Fired it a couple of times and realized how slow the shooting was. Got rid of the stuff as soon as I could.
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Iron Sighted said:
Appreciate that input as well, though I think I'll enjoy B.P. shooting, if anything I find myself firing my semi-auto rifles the least of all, and as far as center fire firearms go, I'm looking at buying another Ruger No.1 before anything else. I won't know till I try as I've only ever shot a front stuffer once, well over a decade ago, but I recall it being pretty fun.
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He's not kidding - you might get 30-40 shots off in a day....

On the flip side your ammo cost goes from like $300/day down to like $30 :)
 
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