Runningfool
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- SW Ontario
#2s early season, BBs late season.
Waterfowl hunting with 3 inch shell
- Thread starter Bushbasher
- Start date
#2s early season, BBs late season.
I find it interesting that most comments speak to the length of the shell rather than the the actual specs. Velocity and load weight mean more than hull length fellas. Especially when comparing 2 3/4" and 3". Another thing is to run your rounds over a crono and actually weigh the shot. Especially if you are shooting Winchester. My winchester 3" loads were 100FPS and 1/16oz short of the box specs.
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I agree totally,in fact I cut open a shell from each brand I have bought and was astonished what was in the Winchester. Looked like tailings from the bin none of the shot was symetrical at all and very different sizes.Best I have seen Kent .No promoting here but they were the most consistent.
Redsoilreaper
CGN Regular
I read it a few years ago in their magazine, not on-line. Sorry. I figured they might have articles on their website. I will try and remember who wrote the article ( it was one of their regular writers).
Not everyone would agree with that. Not my words
3 inch vs 3 1/2 inch Shotgun Shell Facts
The 3 ½-inch shotgun shell was designed to pack a large payload of steel shot for added pattern density over 3".
The 12-gauge 3 ½-inch shotgun is the most versatile 12-gauge ever produced.
Prior to the lead ban in the 1980s, the most popular duck and goose loads were high brass 2 ¾-inch and 3-inch lead loads.
3 ½-inch shotgun shells do not travel further than 3-inch shells given the FPS and pellet type are the same.
3-inch shotgun shells lack the pellet density that 3 ½-inch shells can provide due to a smaller hull capacity.
3 ½-inch shotguns tend to be built on heavier and longer frames than 3-inch guns so have less recoil.
With the introduction of non-toxic steel alternatives such as Hevi-shot, Tungsten Super Shot, Bismuth, and Heavyweight, the superior ballistics of the 3 ½-inch shotgun shell has been diminished greatly.
3 1/2-inch shotgun shells are still better than 3-inch shells in delivering large payloads of steel shot at long ranges.
3-inch shotgun shells can be found considerably cheaper than 3 ½-inch.
Want to know how many pellets are in your shotgun loads? Check out our pellet count tables here.
prairie lover
CGN Regular
- Location
- southern MB
Winchester shot i believe is cast hence the ####ty looking shot. I've cut open many over the years and recently seen 1 batch that was actually nice. Every other shell on the market has nice shot far as I'm concerned. The xpert pattern like crap out of some guns and not bad in others. When they pattern well out of a gun they do just fine.
prairie lover
CGN Regular
- Location
- southern MB
Show me some patterns where 3.5 inch shells stand head and shoulder better than a good patterning 3 inch. I've shot 100s of patterns and have yet to see this exceptional patterning 3.5 inch shell. They generally meet there 3 inch cousins patterns in the same line pellet count wise, but often are worse. And always for me there patchy uneven patterns for the most part. Just cause you have more bbs starting out in that direction does not mean more get to where you want them to go.
I've tried a decent variety of aftermarket chokes and have communicated with the choke company's. Some of them will flat out say a 3 inch steel load is about all the 12 ga can pattern well. A long skinny shot charge does not pattern well. Trying to turn a 12 ga into a 10 ga was a flop. The 10 ga shooting the same charge as the 12 ga makes a fool of the 12 on the pattern board.
Years ago I could have shown you many but once I figured out what I needed I only reload those and stopped patterning
I have been reloading steel since a year after it became mandatory 1993?? so early I could not even get components for it in canada and had to have my brother take them up for me
I went through rolls of paper, tons of choke tubes and tons of shells until I got it right. Most that say they shot 100's at paper I say big deal when you reload them you pattern 1000's. A normal day for me was 10 different reloads with 10 of each so 100 each outing. Unless one is rich no one does that with factory
I patterned four browning golds 2 in 10ga and two in 3 1/2 12ga. Four guns I still have
Joke is the guns of the same gauge were identical others than one being camo and one not and they would even pattern slightly different
I have no clue what you can achieve with factory loads since I have NEVER fired them or patterned them but sure know you don't have the ability to cut the wad to tweek the pattern as I do with sam1's or have the quality of steel shot I use
But sure know my 3 1/2 reloads in 12ga will kick the ass of any 3" I have done at 50 plus yards for density
The old 10ga is in a league all of its own and no 3 1/2 12ga is even close and I don't care what barrel design is on the gun
I have steel RSI duplex loads in 10ga that scream and will kill at 75 yards no problem
Please don't bring up choke tubes. I wasted a small fortune on them and didnot try one but almost all out there and in the end the briley diana IM works best in my brownings
Cheers
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Yes the 3-1/2" was designed to hold more shot for more pattern density, but patterning both 3" and 3-1/2", I haven't found the factory 3-1/2" loads to pattern as evenly as the 3" that I have tried. As for the 3-1/2" guns being built on heavier frames and being heavier, and producing less recoil, I have owned the same make and model of multiple shotguns in both 3" and 3-1/2" and that hasn't been the case. The 3-1/2" guns produced significantly more recoil when firing 3-1/2" loads. From what I have experienced in the field, hunting geese, and ducks, the 3-1/2" loads produce more recoil, and cost more to shoot, and bring home the same amount of birds. If anything, the heavier recoil 3-1/2" loads may actually contribute to flinching. Our waterfowl group tried 3-1/2" loads, and we now all shoot 3" loads exclusively. I actually still have some 3-1/2" loads on the shelf. but they just sit there while I use the 3" loads.
Less recoil when firing 3" out of both apples to apples not 3" vs 3 1/2" something that matters to old guys like me with bad shoulders
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Less recoil when firing 3" out of both apples to apples not 3" vs 3 1/2" something that matters to old guys like me with bad shoulders
I have shot the SX-3, and the Maxus in both chamher lengths, they weigh within an ounce or two, and recoil is about the same, regardless of length.
There is one exception to what was stated . I am a 10 gauge nut the triple BB is my go to but the overbore Mossberg 935 comes very close pattern wise with steel triple BB My Win and Rem 3 1/2 not even close and as stated a waste of time in my books also.
In the end what ever works for an individual.
I still have my sx3 and maxus in 3 1/2. Most if not all of my 3" 12ga semi's except 1100's are gone
Much easier to sell a 3 1/2 and get more bucks for one which was a big part of my decision what to sell and what to keep . Must to some benefit if not why do people still buy them
take care
The key to selling a product is marketing, if you convince people that they need something, they will buy it. This has been even more successful with rifle cartridges, but it also applies to shotguns. We have had several people come out with us for a goose shoot, and some are surprised that we are all using the lower priced 3" loads, rather than the high dollar 3-1/2" loads. But once they see us limit out on geese , they realize that the 3" work well, if the shooters know what they are doing.
But this has been going on for so long one would assume it would have been figured out by now by the shooting community if they were not worth it
I preordered a mossy 835 in 1988 when the first word of a 3 1/2 was released many years ago
Hardest kicking mule I have ever owned and would turn my shoulder purple should have turned me against the 3 1/2 but a new browning gold changed my mind in the early 90's ??
Take care
the spank
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Planet Earth Wearing My Tinfoil Hat
Patterns on paper can be very misleading to what is actually occurring in real time effects downrange. I personally never waste my time patterning much any more beyond ensuring my poi is where I want it in relation to my poa. I haven't patterned a trap load aside from checking poi in 35 years and I can't say I've ever patterned a skeet load...not much point when you're shooting a game that is max distance of 21 yards when shot as it should be. As for hunting I check out a new gun with a few rounds and do my testing in the field on ducks and geese! I shot a Browning Gold 10 for a decade before I learned HOW TO HUNT...aka learned to call, hide, flag etc and now I shoot whatever I can buy cheapest usually in a 20ga...last year that was Herter's Brand 3" 7/8oz #2's and #4's ($169/flat) through an IC choke. I never change chokes. If birds aren't where I want them over the decoys I pass on them and try to work them back again. I like shooting them at 15-30 yards....though we often shoot much closer than that and occasionally a bit further. Spring snows I have no problem dumping birds 40-45 yards overhead with my 20 running 7/8oz #2 steel. You can have all the payload currently available but if you can't put the pattern centre on the bird you're not going to send it tumbling earthward , period.....
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I have a buddy that consistently couldnt hit broadside of a barn. Any shotgun, any load.
Finally on one hunt I filmed him with super slow motion standing right behind him.
You can see his barrel, him pull the trigger and the wad and shot leave the barrel. (Goose is on the ground and he is walking towards it to get it up flying)
He missed the bird first 2 shots and winged it the 3rd shot. Could tell from the video he was way behind the bird with every shot, Just got lucky and nicked the wing on last shot.
After he seen that he was way better, he would swing on them but not follow threw while pulling the trigger. He always had an excuse it was the gun/load/shot
Hes way more confident now with his shooting, Sometimes it just takes a little tweak in your shooting to make all the difference
Finally on one hunt I filmed him with super slow motion standing right behind him.
You can see his barrel, him pull the trigger and the wad and shot leave the barrel. (Goose is on the ground and he is walking towards it to get it up flying)
He missed the bird first 2 shots and winged it the 3rd shot. Could tell from the video he was way behind the bird with every shot, Just got lucky and nicked the wing on last shot.
After he seen that he was way better, he would swing on them but not follow threw while pulling the trigger. He always had an excuse it was the gun/load/shot
Hes way more confident now with his shooting, Sometimes it just takes a little tweak in your shooting to make all the difference
