Waterfowl Shotshells - Math Edition

dubious

dubious

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So long story short decided to give my shoulder a break and move from 3.5" to 3" shells, thought BBB would be best, bigger is better right? Then I say a choke "Ted Talk" by the Muller guy and he mentioned BBs and BBBs dno't have tight enough patterns and you just cripple birds. I'm not gonna lie half our Canada geese are cripples :cry:. This brought me down this rabbit hole of figuring out the best shells based on math and theory.

Of course nothing beats patterning your shotgun, but some interesting numbers. In short, I think he's right. #1 is probably the best shotshell for my scenario, although BB looks good as well... BTW these tables are completely dynamic, I can change load size, speed, pattern numbers, or even add a custom choke with real world pattern numbers for better accuracy of your setup.

Red cells are under 600 fps or less than 30 pellets in a 30" circle (ethical baseline)

Table.jpg


If I can figure out how to lock and share the Google Sheet I will share it so you can run your own numbers.

The Ballistic Calculator on this site is also very useful https://www.kentwildfowlers.co.uk/homeframeintro.html?https://www.kentwildfowlers.co.uk/chokes.htm
 
Babbling and regurgitating someone else’s take on things will never replace the actual doing of things.

I know numerous waterfowl fanatics bagging their limits on Canada's with 1-1/8 oz of 3’s and 2’s(1550 fps)

I’ve yet to ever take a single goose with BBB’s, the largest shot I’ve ever used is BB’s and those are from 3-1/2” shells, which I only shoot maybe 4-6 in a whole limited out shoot(last round hail Mary’s).

The thing is some loads of BB’s I’ve patterned wouldn’t give full choke patterns unless I ran a Light Modified or Improved Cylinder choke, while those tubes gave deplorably lose patterns with my preferred 2’s…….

So I’m stuck on a specific 3-1/2” load of BB’s because they pattern good in the same choke that gives good patterns with my 3”, 2’s….

This takes a bunch of testing and patterning to figure out, and that’s the key, put the time in finding out what works in your shotgun and with your chokes, not what some gun scribe is touting.

Go figure it out in your own!
 
Again the point of my post is just to discuss the base numbers, and the math behind patterning and energy. AND 100% nothing beats actual patterning.

Also these numbers are based on the longest range, but shooting over decoys, never taking a shot past 40yards then you can do better with a load that has more coverage, say #3 load with a cylinder choke. Much better coverage at those shorter distances and still have almost 600 fps at 40 yards and keep a pattern past 45 yards... In Theory...

There's a balance between load size, shot size, choke and energy. And some loads just don't make any sense. I can't think of any situation where you would want to shoot a 2-3/4" BBB shell for example

Similar to the balance of light in photography with Aperture, ISO, and shot time.
 
A guy from the old neighbourhood used to shoot Homkers with 6 lead back in the day.
His theory was the smaller pellets did not gather feathers and down , but rather passed through them into the flesh of the big birds.
Lead shot no.6 full choke Wingmaster with a 30inch barrel.
All day every day he went after Honkers.
He then went with No.2's and 3's in steel after than.
RIP Randy, ALS is a pharking biotch.
Rob
 
Patterning definitely helps ,have done 4 of the top steel BB shells through my gun and my partners. Marked pattern discrepancies really striking .I have now switched to 3" BB mainly as the difference I have found in using the 3.5" are not justified over decoys. However still use my Cynergy in 3.5"on the odd time we set up for salt water pass shooting, more for increased pellets than anything else.
 
Interesting. What immediately caught my eye was the fps of those pellets at 20m.

I would never have guessed that the velocity drops from 1450fps at the muzzle to between 816 and 1004 fps at 20m, depending on pellet size.

In my personal experience, when they mandated non-toxic shot for water fowling, I went with larger shot sizes like BB or even BBB in my 3" chambered shotgun... It didn't take long to realize that it wasn't just about the size of the pellet, it was about pattern density. So, I started using #4 for ducks & #2 for geese...

And then the 3.5" chamber came along... It was at this point that I started using 1&3/8's oz of #2 in a 3.5" shell doing 1550fps for ducks & geese.

I think the next evolution for me will be going back to a 3" shell, probably 1&1/4oz of #2's doing 1550fps to give my shoulder a break AND save $$$...

Cheers
Jay
 
I use 3" number 2 steel, with a Patternmaster Code Black Goose choke, and kill Canada geese from 10 yards over decoys, to 50 yards, when they don't finish. You can look at all of the charts that you like, but the number one factor is not your equipment, it's your shooting. If half of your geese are cripples, then either your shooting skills are lacking, or you are choosing to take shots, that you shouldn't take. I hunted in a group where we would pick up five empty hulls per dead bird, and with my current group, that number is less than two. The difference is not equipment, it's taking higher percentage shots, and placing the pattern better. I find that most people shooting 3.5' loads, are trying to compensate for lesser shooting skills, and are taking shots that they shouldn't take.
 
struff55 said:
1 1/8 oz bismuth hand load 1200fps no 2 or 4 i kill big canadas out to 60 yds with no trouble
pattern density and pellet energy kill birds something stell shot has non of
Click to expand...

I bought a box of Heavy-Bismuth 2-3/4 #1 1-1/4 Oz and for what ever reason they patterned TERRIBLE. In fact I might even contact them to question the results. One shot had some sort of failure and the pellets hit the board at 50 yards in mostly one "ball" made a one inch whole in the plywood. Like they got stuck in the wad or stuck together.

With Bismuth you can go down a shot size, so #2 has the same energy, and more at distance than #1 steel, and you get more pellets, so better pattern. In theory, cause it didn't work for me lol

BUT at $4 dollars a shells it's pricey
 
Jay said:
Interesting. What immediately caught my eye was the fps of those pellets at 20m.

I would never have guessed that the velocity drops from 1450fps at the muzzle to between 816 and 1004 fps at 20m, depending on pellet size.

In my personal experience, when they mandated non-toxic shot for water fowling, I went with larger shot sizes like BB or even BBB in my 3" chambered shotgun... It didn't take long to realize that it wasn't just about the size of the pellet, it was about pattern density. So, I started using #4 for ducks & #2 for geese...

And then the 3.5" chamber came along... It was at this point that I started using 1&3/8's oz of #2 in a 3.5" shell doing 1550fps for ducks & geese.

I think the next evolution for me will be going back to a 3" shell, probably 1&1/4oz of #2's doing 1550fps to give my shoulder a break AND save $$$...

Cheers
Jay
Click to expand...

100%. That's what I also discovered in this deep dive. I'm telling my hunting buddies no BBB and T is not the solution to our missed shots, it's the opposite. But they don't want to hear it. Well fine, sold them my 3.5" BB shells and bought 3" #1s lol

The Federal are patterning well but next year when I have more time I want to try more brands and get the best pattern and shell options. I also want to buy the kickoff for my A391. AND also practice more shooting, shotshell doesn't matter if the pellets aren't in the right place...

The things we do for our hobbies :cool:
 
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