Welder for gas system unitization?
- Thread starter RSK
- Start date
TacticalTeacher
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Georgian Bay, ON
I have not used a local welder (I taught his kids) for many years here in our hometown on Georgian Bay. I've just shimmed OR merely trial fit several gas cylinder locks until we obtained a super tight fit. No welding needed! 
My last gas cylinder I had welded happened to by my favorite job, and that was 45acpking's top welder!
We had that M1A gas cylinder done while at the 2012 Interior BC M14 Clinic!
Cheers,
Barney
My last gas cylinder I had welded happened to by my favorite job, and that was 45acpking's top welder!
We had that M1A gas cylinder done while at the 2012 Interior BC M14 Clinic!
Cheers,
Barney
Shimming and unitizing do 2 different things.
Shimming negates fore and aft shifting of the gas system and is also done to ensure gas port alignment.
Unitizing is done to make the cylinder and band one unit. This stops gas band shifting under recoil, improving barrel hamonics and gives the stock a solid returnable position at the ferrule.
Shimming negates fore and aft shifting of the gas system and is also done to ensure gas port alignment.
Unitizing is done to make the cylinder and band one unit. This stops gas band shifting under recoil, improving barrel hamonics and gives the stock a solid returnable position at the ferrule.
Last edited:
I have not used a local welder (I taught his kids) for many years here in our hometown on Georgian Bay. I've just shimmed OR merely trial fit several gas cylinder locks until we obtained a super tight fit. No welding needed!
My last gas cylinder I had welded happened to by my favorite job, and that was 45acpking's top welder!
We had that M1A gas cylinder done while at the 2012 Interior BC M14 Clinic!
Cheers,
Barney
Ya, that was fun times at the clinic up at my place wasn't it.
As for Tony Tigs and his son Anthony that have done so many CGN'ers gas assemblies ... While I'm sitting here in the office making stainless process piping drawings, they are out TIG welding their asses off hehehe we're building a dairy pasterizing plant. Little trickier than unitizing LOL but they're always willing to help out a fellow M14 nut
- Location
- Northumberland
I am also looking to unitize a gas system, maybe a couple if it does improve cycling and accuracy. I would even try it myself if I could find some tutorials or videos to follow. On that note I would also like to learn to mig and tig stainless and aluminium if anyone had leads on that
- Location
- Northumberland
Last edited:
The 30cal service rifle shop manual by jerry kunhaussen has most of the technical info for unitizing.
As for tips on Tig welding stainless and aluminum.... Welding school and practice.... Lots and lots of practice
I can Tig weld but I've never unitized a gas cylinder, I leave it to the pro's hehehe
Last edited:
TacticalTeacher
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Georgian Bay, ON
I agree, welding school and then go and practice.
That's why I don't do that technical stuff. I have no idea how to get started. And with my luck screwing things up (or having screwed them up already), I might burn a hole in the side of the gas cylinder.
Cheers,
Barney
That's why I don't do that technical stuff. I have no idea how to get started. And with my luck screwing things up (or having screwed them up already), I might burn a hole in the side of the gas cylinder.
Cheers,
Barney
Welding looks easy but it isnt. Especially TIG welding, thats tricky. Even if you are precise you need to know the right temperature for the right material. I personally would only have this job done by a professional.
RAYdiation
Regular
- Location
- Toronto, ON
I have a TIG unit, but have never unitized my M305 yet. I have done steel, stainless and aluminum. But my lack of experience and time are getting in the way.
I would venture a guess that the vast majority of CGN'ers who have had their gas assemblies TIG unitized... Sent them here to BC for the job.
Closing my M14/M1A specialized smithing business kinda put a curb in that.
Maybe try Casey at Tac Ord, they might know someone or have someone in house.
Otherwise, if yer desperate to get it done, there's Tony in BC.(30 years process pipe/stainless TIG experience)
Closing my M14/M1A specialized smithing business kinda put a curb in that.
Maybe try Casey at Tac Ord, they might know someone or have someone in house.
Otherwise, if yer desperate to get it done, there's Tony in BC.(30 years process pipe/stainless TIG experience)
I just can't get into the idea of shipping my rifle across the country for 4 tack welds, or a "large double/doubles" worth of work. Are there any other details apart from what's in the sticky? I spoke with a local fab shop that is willing to look at it. How much of the bluing should you remove around the weld area? Any idea of what kind of heat setting approximately on the machine? (I realize it will vary between machines). Is there anything special about preping the band?
I know the sticky says a couple of double doubles for the local welding shop to make those "3" little tack welds.... Sadly I've never met a TIG welder that works that cheap.
Here's what's involved if it is done professionally, not by bubba.
The gas cylinder and band are removed from the rifle (by owner before sending)
-cylinder and band are degreased and weld locations polished to remove finish.
-cleaned again
-band and cylinder mounted to a brass, rotating , 3 position jig shaped like the barrel at gas cylinder location. Brass is used as it is a fantastic heat sink.
- 3 , 3/16 x 1/8 fillet Tig welds are made in position at 9:30 , 2:30 and 6:00 with a rod matching the component steels. (Ie: chromoly vs stainless)
-unit is wrapped in leathers post welding to allow for a slow, even cooling process.
-cleaned, CLP on external surface and she's done.
The going rate was 65.00 return shipping included when I was offering the service. I'll be clear, I am not trying to advertise anything here and don't offer the services anymore.
But I do know an experienced TIG welder LOL
Here's what's involved if it is done professionally, not by bubba.
The gas cylinder and band are removed from the rifle (by owner before sending)
-cylinder and band are degreased and weld locations polished to remove finish.
-cleaned again
-band and cylinder mounted to a brass, rotating , 3 position jig shaped like the barrel at gas cylinder location. Brass is used as it is a fantastic heat sink.
- 3 , 3/16 x 1/8 fillet Tig welds are made in position at 9:30 , 2:30 and 6:00 with a rod matching the component steels. (Ie: chromoly vs stainless)
-unit is wrapped in leathers post welding to allow for a slow, even cooling process.
-cleaned, CLP on external surface and she's done.
The going rate was 65.00 return shipping included when I was offering the service. I'll be clear, I am not trying to advertise anything here and don't offer the services anymore.
But I do know an experienced TIG welder LOL
I don't have pics but one needs a mill and lathe to make one or 5 hehehe
It is essentially a section of the barrel, duplicated in solid brass.
It has a hole in one end to sleeve to a pin and plate that allows it to rotate on the pin. the plate is clamped into a grounded vice at the welders desired position.
The gas system in installed along with the gas lock to tighten the cylinder and band against the jigs shoulder. Just like on a barrel except when I say tight, I mean only tight enough to close any gaps between cylinder and band. Pre made witness marks are made so the two parts are correctly aligned rotaionaLly as well
That pretty much summs it up if you can picture that
I should add: back in 2009 we were using a chunk of a shot out springfield NM barrel as a Jig at clinics and for our own rifles. Along came a fellow CGN'er to my clinic in langley BC that year and he gave me the first Brass and copper heat sink jig. I forget his name but owe him many thanx. That jig was what inspired the shop version.
Pretty simple to get machined, harder to find a good TIG guy
It is essentially a section of the barrel, duplicated in solid brass.
It has a hole in one end to sleeve to a pin and plate that allows it to rotate on the pin. the plate is clamped into a grounded vice at the welders desired position.
The gas system in installed along with the gas lock to tighten the cylinder and band against the jigs shoulder. Just like on a barrel except when I say tight, I mean only tight enough to close any gaps between cylinder and band. Pre made witness marks are made so the two parts are correctly aligned rotaionaLly as well
That pretty much summs it up if you can picture that
I should add: back in 2009 we were using a chunk of a shot out springfield NM barrel as a Jig at clinics and for our own rifles. Along came a fellow CGN'er to my clinic in langley BC that year and he gave me the first Brass and copper heat sink jig. I forget his name but owe him many thanx. That jig was what inspired the shop version.
Pretty simple to get machined, harder to find a good TIG guy
Last edited:
