Well, I wanted a project gun...
- Thread starter ilikeoldguns
- Start date
Funny, I don't 'member this.
This thing looks like it was welded on.
...you bugger up the dovetail if it isn't already.
Firstly, just take things cool. We need far greater detail to maybe judge what you should do, but it appears that fairly serious damage has already been done to the barrel at the area of the rear sight. Originally there was a standard groove cut in the barrel for a standard size sight, of various types.
Looking at the picture, which is not strong in detail, it appears the flip up sight on the rifle may originally been designed to tap into the groove in the barrel.
However, it appears like someone p laced the flip up on top of the barrel and welded the ends of the flip up to the barrel.
You mention a screw, but there will be no screw, or threads for a screw, in this configuration.
If it is welded, you will have to remove the weld, but not with a chisel!
You will have to use either a sharp corner file, or a tiny grinder on a Dremel tool. In either case, it must be a very steady hand that guides the tool, whether file or tiny grinder. Any excess steel removed from the barrel will not be able to be replaced with a type material that can be blued, by regular bluing.
If there are only a couple of short welds, they may be able to be removed and still salvage the original groove in the barrel.
However, with a lack of detailed pictures and skimpy descriptions, we are doing some guessing here.
Your front sight is exactly the same as is on my 1910 model 1894. I am not sure how the main block of the front sight is fastened to the barrel. Mike, are you there?
Looking at the picture, which is not strong in detail, it appears the flip up sight on the rifle may originally been designed to tap into the groove in the barrel.
However, it appears like someone p laced the flip up on top of the barrel and welded the ends of the flip up to the barrel.
You mention a screw, but there will be no screw, or threads for a screw, in this configuration.
If it is welded, you will have to remove the weld, but not with a chisel!
You will have to use either a sharp corner file, or a tiny grinder on a Dremel tool. In either case, it must be a very steady hand that guides the tool, whether file or tiny grinder. Any excess steel removed from the barrel will not be able to be replaced with a type material that can be blued, by regular bluing.
If there are only a couple of short welds, they may be able to be removed and still salvage the original groove in the barrel.
However, with a lack of detailed pictures and skimpy descriptions, we are doing some guessing here.
Your front sight is exactly the same as is on my 1910 model 1894. I am not sure how the main block of the front sight is fastened to the barrel. Mike, are you there?
BigUglyMan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- New Scotland
At least yours came in one piece. I just acquired the Old Man's Post-64 M94 which fell victim to being left in the camper when the fiberglass beast sprung an unfortunate leak. Pops disassembled it (mostly) before a flood in the basement/shop forced everything to be boxed up and moved to higher ground. Now his health precludes much shop time (not to mention the fact that the giant pile of #### that was in the basement is now ruling the roost in the main shop). So I brought it home to put it back to serviceable. Just got to find some time to get started. Hopefully all the parts are there. The evacuation of the basement was somewhat frantic and lacking in organization.
Took a closer look this weekend and where is what it looks like;
The rear-flip up has been driven through the rear dovetail and it appears to have been welded or soldered on either side.
Now is the front sight supposed to be a dovetailed as well? I can find no evidence of that. There is just this solid block with a notch in the middle in which sits that marble front sight blade.
I see from a quick check online that I have several attractive options for new sights, but most seem to come with a front sight that dovetails-in. It would seem logical that if I replace the rear sight I should replace the frontsight also.
As I stated before, the front sight is original for that period of the Model 94. The Marble's insert could be worth some dollars. If the front sight remains too high, do not file, or in any way alter it.
Just pull the pin, remove and preserve the Marble's Insert.
After you have established a rear sight, make an insert for your front sight that is the proper height. You wanted a project gun and this kind of work is ideal for a start in gun work.
You will still have to remove the weld on the rear sight and get it out.
Well in that case better news yet!
I was removing the furniture for a few coats of linseed oil and I happened to push on the rear sight.
What I had taken for soldering was in fact damage to the rear sight from being peened into place; what I had taken for rust on the soldering looks like orange felt fuzz.
I pushed on it and it slid almost all the way out on it's own.
So I should pull the front pin and this old marble front sight I should keep and then just put a new front sight blade in myself? With a more sensible pin? I think this was a copper finishing nail.
I was removing the furniture for a few coats of linseed oil and I happened to push on the rear sight.
What I had taken for soldering was in fact damage to the rear sight from being peened into place; what I had taken for rust on the soldering looks like orange felt fuzz.
I pushed on it and it slid almost all the way out on it's own.
So I should pull the front pin and this old marble front sight I should keep and then just put a new front sight blade in myself? With a more sensible pin? I think this was a copper finishing nail.
Yes, that was a good break.
On the front sight, just cut the old pin to the right length to use with your new insert. Get a rear sight established first, so you will know approximately how high to make the front insert.
I went through exactly the same thing with my old 1910 30-30 that started life from new, as a working ranch rifle and was only retired about 20 to 25 years ago, from the last member of the extended family to use it on the ranch. The original saddle scabbard is also well used, but still in good condition.
I established the rear sight first, then figured out (guessed) at how high of a front insert to make.
I made a nice post from a piece of brass, but danged if it didn't end up still too low!
So I soldered a piece of #12 copper wire on top. Finally, dead on now.
Here is what it looks like.
On the front sight, just cut the old pin to the right length to use with your new insert. Get a rear sight established first, so you will know approximately how high to make the front insert.
I went through exactly the same thing with my old 1910 30-30 that started life from new, as a working ranch rifle and was only retired about 20 to 25 years ago, from the last member of the extended family to use it on the ranch. The original saddle scabbard is also well used, but still in good condition.
I established the rear sight first, then figured out (guessed) at how high of a front insert to make.
I made a nice post from a piece of brass, but danged if it didn't end up still too low!
So I soldered a piece of #12 copper wire on top. Finally, dead on now.
Here is what it looks like.
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I went with the Bullseye rear sight. Brownells gave me a great deal!
Okay so there it is (I hope!)
Let's talk about the good and bad;
The Good;
I don't think it looks half-bad and dammit! It shoots straight!
The Bad;
I cannot adjust it. The thickness of the barrel seems to be more than the bullseye was meant to work with and so it's fixed where it is; cannot move it.
I also trimmed the retaining pin on the front sight.
I still want to find a front sight hood to protect that marbel from sight blade from getting bent again and keep working on the stock (more linseed oil and a blow-dry treatment on the dents). I might consider getting a side-saddle for the stock with a cheek pad to help me out. Shell-loops on that would be cool, but the cheek-pad is what I need.
I think I like this little old thing enough to keep it; it is very compact and handy, but I think I'll keep an eye open for a longer-barrel model, possibly with a longer stock as well.
Sorry for the thread necro guys, but I thought you might all like to take a look at the current shape of the project.
Okay so there it is (I hope!)
Let's talk about the good and bad;
The Good;
I don't think it looks half-bad and dammit! It shoots straight!
The Bad;
I cannot adjust it. The thickness of the barrel seems to be more than the bullseye was meant to work with and so it's fixed where it is; cannot move it.
I also trimmed the retaining pin on the front sight.
I still want to find a front sight hood to protect that marbel from sight blade from getting bent again and keep working on the stock (more linseed oil and a blow-dry treatment on the dents). I might consider getting a side-saddle for the stock with a cheek pad to help me out. Shell-loops on that would be cool, but the cheek-pad is what I need.
I think I like this little old thing enough to keep it; it is very compact and handy, but I think I'll keep an eye open for a longer-barrel model, possibly with a longer stock as well.
Sorry for the thread necro guys, but I thought you might all like to take a look at the current shape of the project.
Yes. It would have had either a Lyman 66A or a Redfield 70E sight.
A much better option being adjustable for both windage and elevation. Plus the sight radius is much longer which makes for more accurate shooting. Since the old gun is already drilled, no harm, no foul.
BigUglyMan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- New Scotland
I went with the Bullseye rear sight. Brownells gave me a great deal!
You, sir, are fired. That's the most horrendous looking thing that I have ever seen foisted upon a classic rifle.
That sight sir is most definitely NOT an improvement to that fine old rifle..........it is an abomination !!!! I also think you'll find an aperture that far from your eye to be virtually unusable in all but noon day light conditions. As suggested previously you should be looking at a proper aperture sight as made by Williams and Redfield and mounted where the rifle has already been drilled (and ruined) and tapped for it. These set ups are extremely easy to use and will give you the finest accuracy that rifle is capable of without going to glass.
- Location
- Southern Vancouver Island
I agree with the Bullseye sight being too far forward to be very useful. Same goes for the Skinner sights which are even harder to see through when mounted on the barrel. As mentioned by others, the receiver sight is the better option & the older Lyman 66 is the nicest one of the bunch.
my first 1949 94 30-30 was drilled and tapped and had filler screws in the holes. Whether this was done after it left the factory or not, I can't say. My second and currant 1949 94 30-30 is not drilled and tapped. I wish it was, I would put a Williams on it. And my 1957 94 32spl is drilled and tapped with filler screws.
Well fellas; the old POS flip-up sight was there, in the original dovetail, which is right where most sights on lever guns seem to be. can't be all bad.
I'd love to try a Williams, or redfield sight, but can't find one. The Bullseye was cheap, available and works. From not being able to hit a man-sized target at 100 meters to being able to shoot any kind of grouping (6 inch, dark and very, very hurried) is a 100% improvement in my book.
Aesthetics; you may have me there.
I am serious about a front sight hood though; I'd be screwed once again if that marbel blade got bent or broken off again.
I'd love to try a Williams, or redfield sight, but can't find one. The Bullseye was cheap, available and works. From not being able to hit a man-sized target at 100 meters to being able to shoot any kind of grouping (6 inch, dark and very, very hurried) is a 100% improvement in my book.
Aesthetics; you may have me there.
I am serious about a front sight hood though; I'd be screwed once again if that marbel blade got bent or broken off again.
