Wet tumbling with 1mm ceramic media (now with 223 results)

kombayotch

kombayotch

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308 cases after 4-5 hours with water to the top of the media and a bit of Dawn:
-Clean inside and out (and shiny)
-No dust
-No scrubbing of necks or primer pockets anymore
-Works in both my vibrating and rotary tumblers

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Process described here:
http://www.bpcr.net/site_docs-results_schedules/documents/Ceramic_Bead_Vibratory_Cleaning_of_Brass_Cartridges.htm

Bought the media here:
http://www.kingsleynorth.com/
You'll need 10 lbs.

Bought the Thumler's tumbler here:
http://www.buffaloarms.com (get the high speed model)
Can do 200-300 308 cases in a load.

Many people use Dillon tumblers or the Thumler's Ultra-Vibe 18. Places that sell automotive stuff (Princess Auto maybe?) usually have cheap Chinese wet/dry tumblers. Dish soap works better than anything else I've tried, including the lapidary stuff that's supposed to be meant for this.

Haven't had any issues with the brass corroding after weeks of storage after it dries. Just let it air dry after patting it off with a towel. There are a few tricks to working with the stuff though. When wet, it sticks. Pouring water makes moving it around easy. When dry, it just falls out like walnut or corncob.

When the amount of water is right (just to the top of the media), it doesn't roll the case mouths much. Comes out looking like the mouths on new brass. Too much water and it doesn't clean the inside of the necks or primer pockets and the mouths roll over a lot.

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This is someone else's from before we got the process perfected (he also did it after chamfering, which makes the roll over much, much worse)
 
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Can you use your normal tumbler in this process? Or will it not have enough juice to vibrate what I assume will be a heavy load. I always wanted to try the ceramic media but wasn't sure how to go about it.
 
You can as long as you don't overload it. Some guys do 50 rds. at a time in the small Frankfort Arsenal or Lyman tumblers. Make sure to plug into a GFI sockets like an outlet in the bathroom.
 
3mm media was the common stuff. But it gets stuck in .223 cases and in primer pockets. Sometimes this stuff does in the primer pocket, but it comes out really easy, just by tapping the base of the case on the table even.

Me and a few of the guys on the Hide have been experimenting with the 1mm stuff for a while now. I think we've perfected the technique. Its a bit different to work with than the 3mm stuff. Because its so small, water tension causes it to stick. One guy is experimenting with some kind of fish tank product that may solve that.
 
kombayotch said:
Because its so small, water tension causes it to stick. One guy is experimenting with some kind of fish tank product that may solve that.
Click to expand...

To get rid of "water tension" use a surfactant. Soap does this but so do things like Jet-Dri that is used in dishwashers.

There are also commercial products available for crop spraying.

I am definitely going to follow this thread as we have a Thumbler Industrial 18 that would be ideal.
 
John Y Cannuck said:
Fairly expensive stuff, looks like it does an excellent job, how long does it last, given reasonably clean cases?
Click to expand...

The media itself will outlast you... However, like walnut and corncob, you always lose a bit here and there, so you'll probably end up losing it before it ever wears out. If you buy it for the first time, get the 15 lbs. deal. That should be enough for a decade of regular use.
 
I had been meaning to ask, you had been using the 3mm beads, then tried the 1mm beads. Do the smaller ones do just as good a job as the larger ones? I am asking because I noted that you said the larger ones get hung up in the .223, which is what I want it for.
 
No, I started off inquiring about the 3mm beads and learned that they didn't do a good job on bottle necked cases. That they were ok in 308, but would jam up 223 pretty bad. Plus, there apparently don't do a good job on the primer pockets and sometimes got stuck in those very badly. 2mm balls were too close to the flash hole and I was concerned they would get stuck.

No one has come back with 223 results yet, but I don't believe the 1mm balls would get stuck since they are less than half the inner diameter of the case neck. Think about what is needed to trap a sphere and how that can be accomplished inside a bottle neck case. Draw it out if you want, you'll see why that relationship is important. Basically, as long you have that relationship, one sphere is always free to roll to start the chain reaction (with a small tap or vibration). That's the theory anyway... won't know for sure until someone tries it.
 
I haven't fire enough rounds for anything statistically valid, but if its anything like ultra sonic, it should lower SD and keep velocity more consistent from load-to-load.

And no, it isn't more work, its less if you look at the bigger picture. You're talking about 5 more minutes to rinse stuff off. I don't count things like letting it dry because I don't have to be there for that. And I always toweled off brass that came out of walnut to get the dust off anyway, so that's a wash (pardon the pun). You can load this thing with 300 cases (308 Win). Thats 300 cases that I don't have to pick up individually and clean the primer pocket, brush the necks and swab the junk out of. That is tedious crap... and I really hate doing that kind of stuff. Further, I don't get dust all over my hands or in my dies. The brass is nice and clean to work with from the beginning.

It fits my overall loading system nicely; I just tumble the brass, let it dry, run it through two Dillon tool heads and I have hunfreds of loaded rounds in a very short time. For me it saves me time and doing stuff I don't like doing, plus I get better results (cleaner cases) from it. If nothing else, I'm certainly not losing anything from the process, my test groups are working out well:

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I shoot a round and put it back in my plastic box. At loading time I neck size, then prime and load.

No cleaning of any kind. Ammo looks grungy, but so far as I can tell, shoots well. I am wondering if it would shoot better if cleaned in some way.

I have tumbled in media, but did not see any improvemnt in groups. Have you?
 
In theory, a dirty case, has slightly less case volume than a clean one, and depending on how dirty, the case volume could vary.
I suppose you could argue case pressure, pressure wave harmonics and all sorts of other stuff too.
I just wonder if the manufacturing tolerances of the cases themselves are close enough for any of it to be valid.
 
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