What do I need to start reloading .308 and .223?

CanuckShooter

CanuckShooter

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I have an M-14, and am getting a Savage 10FP in 223 very soon and would like to start reloading. From what I hear unless I have a USGI bolt, the M14 is not worth reloading. So it will mostly be for my Savage in 223Rem.

I would like to use a Lee Classic Cast as it doesn't sound like I can go wrong with it, gets rave reviews just about everywhere on the internet, and Higginson's stocks it for a nice price.

Now.... other than the press I have no idea what would be recommended for a newbie on a budget who just wants a nice simple, but effective setup.

I know that I won't be able to afford a tumbler right now, nor a digital scale, those will have to wait until christmas or some other occasion, and I would prefer to stick with Lee products, unless there is a piece of equipment that blows Lee's out of the water.

So here are my questions if anyone should want to help me jump inot the world of reloading with some good advice.

1. Which Dies? - Lee has so many different sets, the RGB, Pacesetter, Neck sizing, Full Sizing, Deluxe (does both full and neck resizing). Which would be best for the Savage? Do I need to buy a decapping die or is that integrated into these sets?

2. Which powder scale? - Is Lee's safety powder scale alright for starting out? Suggestions?

3. Powder Measure? - I am going to assume those powder scoops are no good? Am I wrong? What about the Lee Prefect Powder Measure? I can deal with not pumping cartridges out at great speed FOR NOW, so time is of no concern....yet...

4. Priming - Do you recommend a Lee Auto Prime hand held unit, or something that attaches right to the press such as the Lee Safety Prime for the classic cast?

5. Case conditioning tools - what do i need here? Can I get by on the manual case trimming tools, or should I go with the kit that you can use with an electric drill?

Am I missing anything? :D :D :D

I know there are a lot of questions here, but I would really appreciate any help that can be tossed my way.

Thanks!!

CS
 
1. If you like Lee, get their die sets. A neck sizer die for the Savage would be a good idea. The sizing dies decap. You can also use a universal decapper. Depends on your routine.
2. & 3. The Lee tools work. So do other brands. You don't need an electronic scale, although some folks like them.
4. I have primed 1 000s of cases with the Lee tool. Don't see a need to use anything else.
5. Trimmers, etc. that are powered are faster. You will need to be able to trim, chamfer, perhaps uniform primer pockets, flash holes.
Get a tumbler. I prefer to clean before sizing. Clean cases handle better, clean case necks (inside) give more uniform bullet pull. Clean, not polished for purely cosmetic purposes.
You are concerned about the cases from your 305 being expanded a bit? They will be fireformed to your rifle. Resize them so that they will chamber freely (this is important), but no more. Don't squash them back until the shell holder touches the die. The cases could get worked too hard, there could be separations. Keep an eye for incipient separations.
 
The Lee Classic Cast is a decent enough single stage press, so you've got that taken care of. LEE dies are okay, but I'd much prefer RCBS or Redding. Better made & they have a life time guarantee. With RCBS, no questions asked!

Check out the EE for dies. .223 is common as dirt, same for the .308 Win. If you want to reload for a semi-auto, you might want to look at buying a set of "small base" reloading dies. It depends on how tight your chamber is.

For case prep tools, just about any of the major manufacturers "hand" tool style tools like the deburring/chamfer tool, neck brush, etc...will work fine. Buy what you like or your budget allows. Again, my choice would be RCBS. You don't need power trimmers or digital scales. Since you say you're looking more toward just the .223, you probably won't be banging off a thousand rounds per visit to the range.

You do need a good powder measure, however, such as the RCBS Uniflow, Redding or Hornady. The LEE measure is crap, pure and simple, same goes for their scales. Get an RCBS 505 used in the EE and you won't need another! Forget using scoops. No way to ensure consistency, etc...

I'd also recommend getting a case tumbler. The Hornady M-2 or one of the entry level Lyman tumblers will more than meet your needs right now...you can even hit Toys 'R Us and buy one of their rock polishing kits. The tumbler in that kit will handle small lots of brass easily. For polishing media, go to your local pet store and buy the biggest sack of crushed walnuts they sell as tank bedding for reptiles. Way cheaper than brand name tumbling media and works the same.

Besides the above tools, probably the one tool I use most often is my dial caliper. I would be lost without mine and it really is a "must" have tool for any reloader.

Just add powder, primers and bullets and your good to go! Hope this helps!
 
If you dont mind spending a little time loading do what I did, I bought a Lee aniversary reload kit it had a primer set of shell holders for the Primer, a Lee challenger press, a powder scale, case trimmer, and some other stuff, I love it, and then all you need is dies primers powders, brass and bullets and a manual it works great.
 
I have both ,a M-305 and a Savage 10FP-LE2B in 308 and I use a Lee Collet die for both. They each have their separate cases of course, seeing they are fireformed for each rifle. I tumble my brass everytime I shoot some, the brass is easier to work with when clean, also looks better:cool: I also use a Lee priming tool , I think it's the best .. The M-305 is harder on brass then the Savage ,which is normal, being a semi-auto, so I have a lot of brass for both. About 400 for the Savage ( Norma & Lapua) and about 1200 various brands for the M-305 ( Rem, Win, Fed, IVI, PMC) that way I don't over work the same cases too often. BTW if you want to shoot your M-305 often , I'll have to reload ,it can go thru a lot ammo in an afternoon, I know I do:D
Have fun
Bob
 
Nice thing about the Lee collet dies, no messy lube. I use them for everthing, I buy the deluxe sets so I also have the full length sizer. The Lee perfect powder measure though cheap is very consistent, if mine ever wears out I'd buy another. I like my Lee classic cast press much more than the RCBS junior or whatever that it replaced. I load .223 7RM .303 30-06 .375 HH. I bought an RCBS hand primer over the Lee, I think it's built better and fits my mitt just right. Lee case trimmers work well I don't trim as much as some folks and I think my brass lasts longer. Have fun learning a new game.
 
You will also need a couple reloading manuals and a bullet puller. Digital scales are the cat's ass if you plan to weigh every charge. Any powder measure will do, or even the scoops will work OK, but you must weigh every charge. Unless you plan on spending big bucks on top of the line powder measure, your charges will very day to day, charge to charge.
 
OK, whoa... lol

Information overload... lol

I don't even know what collett dies do... can someone explain? and what about fulllength vs neck sizing?

I am way behind here.... need a bit of info to catch up!
 
what do you need?

CanuckShooter said:
OK, whoa... lol

Information overload... lol

I don't even know what collett dies do... can someone explain? and what about fulllength vs neck sizing?

I am way behind here.... need a bit of info to catch up!
Click to expand...

Lolll, I know what you mean, when I started reloading, there were so many question marks that I didn't know where to start.

If you have nothing bought yet, I would first suggest at least 2 reloading manuals, and a LEE aniversary kit ( almost all you need included), and on top of that you will need a set of die. I know that neck sizing save your brass life but when I started, it seemed too complicated so I went for the full sizing die. LEE products are good and popular. For sure, there are other more quality products but unless you do competition shooting, it won't matter.

I started with an old press from a neighbour, a powder scale, die set + shell holder, primer hole cleaner and chamfering tool, trimming tool for the case lenght, some case lube (needed for resizing your case unless you go with carbide dies), a caliper (very very usefull if not necessary), a case tumbler (I know you stated you are not ready but it save you lots of time), a set of cleaning brushes for inside your case neck and lots of patience :) .

Never used a hand priming tool (it probably save you lots of time also) I use my main press to install the primers, I just bought a LEE perfect powder mesure from e-bay (didn't use it yet), no neeed and $$$ for a digital scale.

I was lucky enough to have a fellow CGN member show me how to use all these new toys and explain me the basics of reloading, for which I returned the favor to another CGN member.

Don't hesitate if you have more questions and concerns, I am sure you will have good advice from many CGN reloaders as I had.

Good luck
 
CanuckShooter said:
OK, whoa... lol

Information overload... lol

I don't even know what collett dies do... can someone explain? and what about fulllength vs neck sizing?

I am way behind here.... need a bit of info to catch up!
Click to expand...
For a clear write-up on the Lee Collet dies check out dubs.jamescalhoon.com , look under informative articles. Jim builds guns and bullets for the varminter crowd and a more knowledgeable gunner I have yet to meet.
 
What about the Lee Classic Turret Press? Forgot to ask about that one.... it's one of their newer loaders and has gotten decent reviews on midwayusa so far...

Any experiences?
 
I'd add a trickler in to your list of have-to-have stuff, if you want accurate powder weights. Cheap item to buy, btw.
 
For the 10FP you dont need to full length size. Size the neck only. If you want to load for the M-14 you are going to need to full length size.

I use the Lee Collet Dies like many others have mentioned. They squeeze the case neck against a mandrel to size the neck. They are inexpensive, faster (no lubing), easier on brass life and give better neck consitency than most dies. They were far better than the basic redding neck sizer that I have. Just make sure you follow the instructions when you set them up.
 
Ok, 3 more questions.... do I need to get a depriming die that does only that if i want to tumble the brass first? or is it just as good to use the resizing die, to resize AND decap, then tuble the brass to clean it?

second question.... I am kind of stuck now between the Lee auto prime II, which is a primer tray unit that attaches to the press (is apparently all steel construction), or the lee hand primer which some say feels light duty, or a bit on the flimsy side.

Third question... to clarify... the savage would only need the neck sizing collett doe set right not the deluxe full length sizing collet set? and for the M14 I WOULD need the full length collet sizing die set right? or am i way off? lol

Thanks
 
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Get a die that will re-size and decap. No need to add extra steps to reloading.
Neck sizing for the bolt gun is OK, but after 4-5 loadings you may need to full length re-size just to bump the shoulder back. Of course if you are using new brass or range pick up brass, you will need to full lenghth re-size before you start.
For your auto loader a small base die thay sizes the full length will stop a lot of headaches for feeding.
 
I use the Lee hand primer tool because you can get a feel on the seating of the primer but of course that always a personal choice. Concerning resizing brass for the M-305 (M-14) you should probably better to get a full lenght sizer because you will be able to pickup some once fired brass cheap. Myself I neck sizing only for my M-305) but I have a lot of brass that was shot in my rifle ( 1200 +) and I keep track of my cases. Neck sizing is easier your brass ,it doesn't overwork it as much but again that's a personal choice:D
Bob
 
So if I shot the brass through my M14 only, then it should be safe to neck size only?

Can the port 308 brass be used for reloading?
 
Get the Lee hand priming tool. Way more convenient than priming on the press.

While some will say you can neck size only for the M-14 and clones, most experts recommend that you full length resize ANY reloads for it. A standard full length die may suffice, or you may need to purchase a small base size die/set (as I mentioned earlier) to ensure reliable feeding in semi-auto actions. As a result of the constant "working" of the .308 brass, don't expect more than 2-4 reloads out of your brass before you start running into problems. It is better to err on the side of caution, rather than try to save $0.10, especially since you will be new to the hobby.

Neck size away for your .223 Savage. Just make sure you don't mix your once fired brass from it with range pick-up, etc...Any brass not fire formed to your rifle's chamber should be full length resized to begin, thereafter you can neck size.

Don't forget the calipers. After resizing the pick-up brass, you might want to measure its overall length and possibly trim any excessively long brass. Good accuracy comes from being consistent.

BTW: I saw a nice used RCBS Rock Chucker single stage press in the exchange forum yesterday. Don't know if it is still there, but it is the press I'd buy if my wallet allowed.
 
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