What glue to use ?

[r.j.medals2]

Hi I have an old shotgun with spiral type cracks in the wrist. There are several and are fairly tight . I usually use a 2 part epoxy on my stock repairs with great success but it has a thick viscosity and would be tough to get into these cracks. Anyone with solid suggestions ? Thank-you

 

[superted]

Try spreading your epoxy glue over the cracks then using a LOW pressure air hose gun, blow the glue into the cracks. The thinner the glue the better the air blown glue will penetrate the cracks.,

 

[Fargone4sure]

The best way is to drill a hole that intersects the crack(s). Make the hole just slightly larger than an appropriate size hardwood dowel. Fill the hole with the 2 part epoxy, and then insert the hardwood dowel, using it like a piston to force the epoxy throughout the whole crack.
But you may well want to consider drilling smaller holes to epoxy in fine thredded rod (10-48), making sure the end of the rod is well below the wood surface, so the opening can be filled with wood filler. Often 2-4 of these rods are needed to stabilize a break properly.
Good luck.

 

[cyclops666]

I'm not a gunsmith and have no idea if this would work but my first thought was to rig up a vacuum sealed type bag around the stock, apply the glue over the cracks then vacuum the air out forcing the glue down into the cracks

 

[guntech]

You can't blow glue into a hole... it just won't go there...

you are better off to flex the cracks and try wiping it in over and over and flex the cracks repeatably... then clamp with tubing.

The old oil that is in the wood will probably be a hindrance.

 

[Donny Fenn1]

In ski repairs we get the epoxy to flow by adding a little heat from a hot air gun, it liquifies the adhesive letting it flow into cracks and delaminated layers...this won't work with quick curing epoxies as the heat sets them up and they cure too fast so use a longer curing in product if you go this route

 

[tiriaq]

If rods or pins are used to reinforce a repair, at least start the holes under tangs, etc., so that they are hidden. Wood filler patches look like crap. It is possible to use wood inlays to cover a pin repair, particularly if the hole is in checkering. A diamond patch is used, checkered and colour matched. But this requires skill.

 

[VictoryXC]

Check out Zap glue. Specifically, ZAP CA (Pink Label) Thin Viscosity.

 

[Travis Bickle]

Make sure to clean the cracks as best you can with acetone after spreading them open.
Try the best you can to get some kid of brush in there with the acetone to wash out at least some of the oil and grease at the surface.
Wood glue or epoxy won't bond well with oil and grease in there.

 

[r.j.medals2]

Thanks for all the info. The cracks are mostly under the locks and tang areas of the wrist, there is not a lot of oil contamination . I have a question regarding the acetone- will it completely evaporate or dissipate when it gets in the cracks ? I will add some pics just now.

 

[sail32]

Have a look at the epoxy's at large marine store, they should have a variety of epoxy's for different uses.

You can thin epoxy with white camping stove gas ( if I remember correctly ),and it is cheaper than epoxy thinner.

 

[r.j.medals2]

AS YOU CAN SEE MOST OF THESE CRACKS ARE RELATIVELY TIGHT

 

[BCRider]

Acetone or brake cleaner will totally evaporate. But it may take a few hours for the deepest of it down in the cracks to fully evaporate. Your nose will know.

I've had great luck with epoxy by applying it to a crack and heating it with a hair dryer on high or a heat gun on low to medium. But for this to work really well you want to warm up the wood first. Get it to where it feels like slightly hot warm water. Apply the glue and hit it with the hot air and between the heat in the wood and the air it'll thin the epoxy to where it's almost like water and it'll flow easily into the cracks on it's own or with a little flexing to "pump" it around.

This actually works so well that depending on the cracks I use masking tape over portions of the crack when I've done such repairs to prevent the epoxy simply running through from where I apply it and out the other side or out through the lower end of the crack.

Because the heat will encourage the epoxy to cure more quickly do NOT use 5 minute epoxy with this trick unless you can get'er done within about 30 seconds. Otherwise you'll find it starting to gel up before you hit one minute from applying the hot air. And really you're better off with using the 2 hour stuff anyway since it tends to be a more resilient glue for the longer term.

Some advise using alcohol to thin the epoxy. And yes, that works. But you only want to use that trick on thin films of the glue applied to a surface or onto relatively thin fiberglass cloth . The alcohol needs to be able to evaporate or it will either prevent the epoxy from curing or at least cause it to be a less than idea cure. But it thins out so much with the heat that there's really no need for using alcohol in the first place.

 

[Travis Bickle]

Thanks for all the info. The cracks are mostly under the locks and tang areas of the wrist, there is not a lot of oil contamination . I have a question regarding the acetone- will it completely evaporate or dissipate when it gets in the cracks ? I will add some pics just now.

Spread the cracks as best you can.
Then use the acetone and a brush ot force the stuff into the cracks with the bristles and pull/push out any grime you can.
Leave the cracks spread open and the acetone will evaporate, just give it an hour or so.

 

[Bigbubba]

I would carefully spread the cracks apart with a thin prybar / knife / flat screwdriver and get a syringe with Titebond III water proof wood glue and use the syringe to get the glue well into the cracks then remove the prybars and clamp the section overnight and then do another crack the next day.

 

[Ol' Flinter]

Heating the wood thoroughly before applying the epoxy will cause the epoxy to become less viscous and encourage it to migrate into the cracks much as solder runs toward the heat source. For my $$$ Accraglas is the absolute best for wood repairs and it can be tinted to make it virtually disappear. I recently repaired a Browning X bolt 300 WSM that was completely snapped through the wrist and the repair is virtually invisible unless you know where to look. You may have to spread the cracks and glue them one or two at a time for a thorough job.

 

[Ruger Bob]

Use a vacuum to suck the glue into the cracks

 

[AP]

some stock duplicators claim to work to pretty close tolerances ... I wonder if it wouldn't be a good idea to have the stock copied before you get too much acraglass in the inletting and changing the finer details of the inletting?? IDK - not an expert in this sort of stuff ...but I would think if the objective of using acetone is to get the oil out of the stock ... "flushing" the oily areas (holding them down as you rinse with acetone) would seem to be a better way of doing this than brushing it on and letting the acetone dry in place,,.. maybe lots of better ways to get rid of the oil too eg heat and ground "kitty litter" to absorb the oil brought out by the heat.

Also one way to get adhesives/bedding etc into cracks is to "vibrate" it into the spaces. The same way cement workers vibrate concrete into forms and avoid voids around rebar ... any small vibrating mass will work (confidentially - I use an old Wahl hair clipper and hold the fast vibrating head against the stock when installing steel pillars - works extremely well too, causing the thick Acraglass gel to run into the space around - and in - the grooves of the pillars and the stock!!)


... incidentally Larry Potterfield of Midway has a youtube showing how he uses acetone to remove oil from stocks .. seems to work ok...

 

[BCRider]

The issue of closing the cracks vs leaving them open will depend in a large amount on how the wood fits the metal parts. If the cracks appeared due to shrinking of the wood and the metal holding it apart so that the wood HAD to crack and open up to fit around the wood then it would be best to fill the cracks without pulling them together other than with some minimal force. Similarly if the wood cracked due to wildly variable shrinkage found in some really tight wood grain figuring then often it's best to use only lighter clamping force and let the cracks remain slightly open.

But if the cracks can be easily forced closed and the action parts still fit when they are pulled closed then that's the way the repairs should be done.

I like that idea of Accraglass and tinting it. With most of the cracks being internal colour tinting the glue might seem to be added effort at no real gain. But it depends on how detailed you wish to be. Epoxy can also be tinted using gel coat coloring tints available from the big resin outlets. Just don't use very much though. As the old saying goes "a lil' dab'le do ya".

For damming off the lower portion of the cracks for filling with Accraglas or heat thinned epoxy if you're working into a nasty opening or over a shape that is impossible to tape you could look at using modeling clay (Plasticene) as your dam material instead of tape. Wad it over the crack and use some tape or a tensor bandage over the lumps of clay to hold them in place. Don't go nutz though. You don't want to push the clay into the crack. Just cover it with a very slight inward bulge at most.

For the most part that is general. Looking at your specific pictures it seems like the wood on that stock is simply splitting from the recoil energy. It may not have been the best possible piece of wood in the first place given that it seems to be brittle and crack prone as well as you appear to be missing a few bits of the wood. So more'n likely the cracks will all want to be pulled together fairly tightly after you glue them.

And since you'll be pulling the cracks together I would suggest that you can easily use any good carpenter's/cabinet maker's glue such as Titebond. They work just great when the joints are able to be closed tightly. Do one or two at a time and wrap or otherwise clamp the cracks shut. A bicycle inner tube sliced lengthwise into a long 1/2" wide ribbon works like a treat for clamping something like this. If you wrap it with overlapping winds just keep in mind you don't need to stretch it right out. The winds add pressure with every turn and every overlap. And it all adds up pretty quickly.. So a couple of pounds of stretch on the strip while winding it on adds up to lots of pounds of clamping pressure.

 

[r.j.medals2]

Check out Zap glue. Specifically, ZAP CA (Pink Label) Thin Viscosity.
Posted by VictoryXC

I have tried the ZAP CA equivalent which was available locally on another stock and the results are excellent. Solid , tight and looks great . Thanks for the heads up.