What is the fascination with smallest caliber?

BIGREDD said:
I don't even know where to start... is a SKILLET HUNTER someone who carries a frying pan when hunting...:confused: :p
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WATCH OUT!! ............. HE'S GOT A PAN!!!

fryingpan.jpg
 
Although I never use or ever want to any centerfire, .22 caliber rifles on big game, I am still facinated or perhaps more dumbfounded over the succesrate of these small, light bullets terminal ballistics on big game, often at very high velocities.

After seeing polar and grizzly bears killed by .22 rimfire rifles, I am even more dumbfounded about the killing power of the .22 rimfire, and thus makes me even more comfortable when carrying larger, center fire rifle while hunting.
 
snowhunter said:
Although I never use or ever want to any centerfire, .22 caliber rifles on big game, I am still facinated or perhaps more dumbfounded over the succesrate of these small, light bullets terminal ballistics on big game, often at very high velocities.

After seeing polar and grizzly bears killed by .22 rimfire rifles, I am even more dumbfounded about the killing power of the .22 rimfire, and thus makes me even more comfortable when carrying larger, center fire rifle while hunting.
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For every story you hear about a one shot miracle kill on a griz or polar bear, I bet I could find 2 or more with worse results. I grew up in the Yukon and will always remember a friend of my dad who hammered a griz, (not a monster either, 6' or so) he had a single shot 30-30 break action shorty backpack rifle and a lever .22 for finishing off small trapped animals. He put every .22 shot he had into the griz from close range and 2 shots from his 30-30 and still had a bear that tore up his lower half pretty good after trying to climb high enough in a tree. I remember the # of .22 shots was above 20 and was always amazed that the bear did not expire.
Also there is a story in a recent thread about a .243 I think it was, that on a quartering away shot - the bullet deflected off the shoulder blade, etc etc, had a happy ending but I bet the deer woulda been anchored with a .270 +
 
IN all why take the chance with underpowered rifles?? Its not fair to the animal and I don't understand the ego of 'I shoot deer(whatever) with a 22rimfire" attitude. Its not ethical as some big game animals fight to give up the ghost with proper placed and proper calibers anyways. Why take the chance? Use enough gun.
 
haggisbasher said:
BR, i think you are being a little hard here,;) after all, a .22 is considerably bigger than a .177 ca.:rolleyes: as someone claimed recently that he new a guy who hunted game with an air rifle:eek:
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Man you just made me spill my beer... :D
 
The hunters who, luckyly, shoot and killed the large bears with a .22 rimfire rifles, was not huntng bears, but much smaller game, when the large bears suddenly got into the picture, and it was a do or die situation for the hunter if they did not defend themself with the .22 rimfire.

I have never meet or know of anyone, specificly hunting bears with a .22 rimfire.
 
The first impression I got when I read the title of this thread was that someone was extremely recoil sensetive.
If being over gunned means it's flinch city and your the mayor it can be just as bad or worse than being under gunned.
In the right hands a .222 can put venison on the table but one must pick his/her shots. Having said that I don't think I would use anything less than a.243 as a deer gun.
 
I have been hunting for twenty years and have never had a chance to use a .243, although my Browning A-Bolt .270 has taken more deer than any other calibre in my safe and it has minimum recoil. As good of a shot as I'd like to think I am, I don't always get to say "one shot, one deer". At least with this calibre, it never takes more than two (assuming the first one hits, of course). I can't imagine using my .22 for medium skinned game such as deer - even a white tail fawn - the risk of only wounding an animal is not worth it. On the other hand, a lot of my pals use a .300 wm or .300 ultra mag as an all round for deer, moose, elk, and I must admit, it does a lot of damage to the meat on a whitetail or small muley but it sure gets the job done fast. I know my .270 will take an elk or moose, but why wouldn't I use the .300wsm in the safe and be sure.
 
My point of vue is that: to each type of game his caliber. I don't beleive in only owning one gun to get the job done. There are many hunters who will only buy the basics eg: a 12ga Rem 870 express and a 30 06 bolt action rifle.
The same thing can be said for others who hunt deer with a 300 and up...it's overkill man and your wasting a bunch of meat. I think that calibers like the 30-30, 260, 7mm08, 308, 270 and 30 06 are way more suited for this type of game. Not only you need to adapte your caliber to the type of game, you also need to choose the type of action (bolt, lever, pump, etc.) and optics accordingly. I will not take the same rifle/caliber depending on type of game and terrain. I know some of you will disagree and like to shoot a buck at close range in heavy cover with a 458 win. and that's fine if it fits your bill.
 
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whats the obsession with bow hunting ???? bows have a lot less energy then a .223 or .243 or the 6mm remington......

all still meet the 1000 ft lb's energy needed at 100yds that the guru gun writers say is needed to kill a deer......

if someone wants to be a minimalist and use the least gun possible to make a humane kill then so be it....... there are even people that use a 270 for bear hunting :eek:

frankly what I think is the best all around hunting rifle is the .375 H&H,,.... but thats not going to stop me from getting a lite weight .308 built that will do all the same jobs.
 
If you look at it another way, we obviously aren't allowed to hunt with handguns up here, but there are a lot of energy levels there that are easily matched by light caliber rifles. So it comes down to bullet performance, and where you hit. I'm not personally interested in the small cal approach, but somone using very carefully developed ammo, waiting for their chances, and taking good shots could probably make it work every time.

Bell nailed enough elephants with 303 and smaller caliber weapons. Heck the earliest smokeless faves for all African BIG FIVE game were in the 7mm line since it was all that was available. Some of those guys returned to estates in Scotland, and didn't immediately feel the need to reach for a 338 when the game size was 100 times smaller by weight.
 
I'm not personally interested in the small cal approach, but somone using very carefully developed ammo, waiting for their chances, and taking good shots could probably make it work every time.
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exactly..... there is no such thing as overkill, but there is also no such thing as under kill, dead is dead and an ethical hunter waits for the shot that both suits his skill level and his hunting ability, caliber is way down the list on things needed to cleanly kill an animal.

I believe that to many people have "magnumitis", in this day and age unlike the 19th century people are all amatuers when it comes to killing game, they neither have to rely on the game as "food" and more people hunt for the taste of the game or the sport of the kill, no one here "need's" game meat to survive, nor do they need the hides to clothe themselves.
 
roadwarrior said:
The same thing can be said for others who hunt deer with a 300 and up...it's overkill man and your wasting a bunch of meat.
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I respect your point but disagree with this statement, A shoulder shot is never required and if your aiming at any animals ass, who cares how much meat is lost, it's gonna taste like ####!
 
Westicle said:
exactly..... there is no such thing as overkill, but there is also no such thing as under kill, dead is dead and an ethical hunter waits for the shot that both suits his skill level and his hunting ability, caliber is way down the list on things needed to cleanly kill an animal.

I believe that to many people have "magnumitis", in this day and age unlike the 19th century people are all amatuers when it comes to killing game, they neither have to rely on the game as "food" and more people hunt for the taste of the game or the sport of the kill, no one here "need's" game meat to survive, nor do they need the hides to clothe themselves.
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Hmmmmmm.....So you agree there is no such thing as overkill, yet people suffer from "magnumitis"?

How very "liberal" of you to point out what I do and don't "need".

What hunters "need" is enough gun to ensure a clean kill when the best skill comes up short. Suppose you tell us why we shouldn't (and can't legally)hunt deer with a 22lr when we know that "a properly placed shot by a skilled marksman" can kill a deer with a 22lr?

Sure a 223 can kill a deer. If you go by that silly 1000ft lbs energy rule you limit yourself to 100yrds cuz at 150 you are down to about 900 by then. So that would make your 223 a bush gun? Hope you don't run into many bears in the bush, they may not have read the 1000ft lb rule.:p :D Would I use a 223 on deer? Not a chance.

Hunters that chose a cartridge that suits the conditions they hunt under are not suffering from "Magnumitis" . They have perhaps chosen a single rifle that is suitable for all the game they hunt under all the conditions they hunt in. Maybe some choose a "moose gun" but still have to use it on deer.

Others, seem to be suffering from "Magnaphobia".:p They know damn well for instance, that the 300WM has only a real velocity gain over the 30-06 of about 10%. Yet in their mind, you can eat right up to the hole on a 30-06 dropped deer, but the same shot with a 300WinMag will result in the entire animal being suitable for meatballs. Damn good thing when they were selling the 30-06 to the military a little more than 100yrs ago, they didn't call it the 30-06Tenderizer or the (shudder)30-06Magnum.

It's a word. Don't shoot your game in the parts you want to eat and it don't make any difference what you shoot. Just use enough gun and skill to kill as cleanly as possible.
 
Hmmmmmm.....So you agree there is no such thing as overkill, yet people suffer from "magnumitis"?

How very "liberal" of you to point out what I do and don't "need".
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just as liberal as the people that berate others for not having enough gun.... in my opinion .308 is the minimum caliber I would hunt with.... so shoot me. I have a custom 375 H&H being built as we speak.

who am "I" and who is anybody to tell anyone that they cannot hunt with any centerfire cartridge of thier choosing..... notice I said centerfire, because alot of you knuckleheads keep repeating the "22lr lie". No responsible hunter is ever going to go hunting with a .22lr.

222,223,243,6mm are all equaly capable of killing anything up to and including large deer and make a fine small and medium game gun within thier limits as long as the limits are realized...... same with the 30-30, the .44 mag and other short range calibers.
 
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