What kind of accuracy can be expected from BULK ammo?

[VanMan]

Has anyone tried measuring and sorting by rim thickness like in this you tube video? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqM-SHZlZjM
Wondering if it actually works - and if it does, why does the thickness of the rim affect the accuracy so much?

 

[JimV]

OP, I very much doubt that your problem relates to the ammo. Even with cheap bulk ammo almost any half decent .22 should be able to group around 1" @ 50yds. Both of my Savage MKIIs will easily group tighter than that. The advantage of higher quality SV ammo is usually more evident at longer ranges.

It's either you, the optical system or the rifle. I'd suggest analyzing each potential problem separately:

1. Let a friend who is a fairly good shot try the rifle. If he can achieve reasonable groups with the same set-up it's you. In that case, study your technique and practice.
2. Check the scope mountings and the parallax adjustment (if you have one.) If that doesn't help, try another scope. BTW, the Bushnell rimfire scopes are pretty good. There's no reason why you shouldn't be able to shoot accurately @50 yds unless the scope is actually defective. Sometimes it can be hard to detect defective scopes. (I had one once that gave erratic results. One day I turned it on its side in a certain way and the windage turret literally fell out.) But trying a different scope will determine that.
3. If (1) and (2) don't solve the problem it's got to be the rifle. If there's no obvious sign of bullet deformation when you chamber/unchamber a round, and you can see no defects in the crown or rifling it's probably just one of those dud guns that roll off the line infrequently. In that case I would chalk it up to experience, sell it with full disclosure and buy something else.

 

[abms1]

OP, I very much doubt that your problem relates to the ammo. Even with cheap bulk ammo almost any half decent .22 should be able to group around 1" @ 50yds. Both of my Savage MKIIs will easily group tighter than that. The advantage of higher quality SV ammo is usually more evident at longer ranges.

It's either you, the optical system or the rifle. I'd suggest analyzing each potential problem separately:

1. Let a friend who is a fairly good shot try the rifle. If he can achieve reasonable groups with the same set-up it's you. In that case, study your technique and practice.
2. Check the scope mountings and the parallax adjustment (if you have one.) If that doesn't help, try another scope. BTW, the Bushnell rimfire scopes are pretty good. There's no reason why you shouldn't be able to shoot accurately @50 yds unless the scope is actually defective. Sometimes it can be hard to detect defective scopes. (I had one once that gave erratic results. One day I turned it on its side in a certain way and the windage turret literally fell out.) But trying a different scope will determine that.
3. If (1) and (2) don't solve the problem it's got to be the rifle. If there's no obvious sign of bullet deformation when you chamber/unchamber a round, and you can see no defects in the crown or rifling it's probably just one of those dud guns that roll off the line infrequently. In that case I would chalk it up to experience, sell it with full disclosure and buy something else.

So i got it out to the range again today. I haven' t cleaned the gun for the last 500rds or so. Seemed today the rifle was performing slightly better. I was able to shoot some 10 shot 1" groups with the remington Subsonics so maybe the gun is still in its break in period.

I chambered and extracted a bunch of rounds. I noticed that there were slight scratches on the bullet and front end of the case. I wouldn't affect much as some of the imperfections on the rounds from the factory were just as bad. BUT, i noticed that with the reminton ammo it seems as though the cartridge isn't sealing properly in the chamber. Federal and CCI did seal well like the middle case in the picture.

The remington cases...

The crown....

It is very uniform and does not exhibit any properties like this defective crown...

I've taken off the scope and out of the mounts and reassembled everything. It all seems solid. I'll be out saturday again to keep testing the rifle. Hopefully the trend continues and the groups improve with no cleaning.

In regards to the CCI standard velocity where does one acquire this stuff. I'm in fort McMurray so obviously theres nothin here. But even in Edmonton Cabelas, Wholesale Sports, and P&D did not have any CCI SV. Actually none of them had any decent CCI offerings.

So I would assume online retailers are the only option. Wheres the best deal?

>> Where do you guys buy/order the CCI SV rounds in Canada?

 

[abms1]

A few of the better groups today at 55yards with ~10km/h wind... Still ain't that good.

 

[07blackwater]

That blackening is typical for Remington junk.

 

[hoytcanon]

Where do you guys buy/order the CCI SV rounds in Canada?

Shoot me a PM and I'll see if I can get you some SV's.

 

[762shooter]

I have a rim thickness gauge but don't use it routinely. Unless a person is in high level competition it isn't really worth the time.

I recently tested some different brands though and the results were interesting. The CCI Standard Velocity and the SK Standard + were the most consistent with most rims being + or - .001", maybe one or two in a box outside of that range. Surpisingly, CCI blazer was fairly consistent as well. Federal American Eagle gave a spread of about .005" and the worst was Remington Target with a spread of .006" or a bit more.

However, ammunition consistency does vary by lot #. The most useful thing to do with a rim thickness gauge is to use it to check a new batch of ammunition for consistency.

 

[zimbu]

Here's an ammo test I did last year with my old Cooey 60.

http://www.canadiangunnutz.com/foru...-60-100yd-Ammo-Test&highlight=cooey+ammo+test

 

[flyinlead]

After trashing Winchester ammo, I finally tried some in my 10/22 and ate crow. It's cold and messy out, so off the bench indoor at 25 yards I'm getting 1/4" groups between centers with the 333s.

Using Federal 525 at that distance I can get 1/2" groups. Same ammo with open sights(middle aged eyes) using an old Remmy 121 pump I'm getting 3/4" groups. Just the odd flyer. A 40 box of American Eagle did no better out of the pump.

I also like the winchester 333/555 bulk stuff, I was pleasantly suprised to get 1" groups at 50 yards with my 10/22, which is stock except for trigger upgrades.

For the OP, it seems things are getting better for you but something is still not as it should be. Perhaps get some other kinds of ammo, .22s can be picky. And if your scope is parallax set at 100 yards that could be your problem.

 

[mh434]

Here's mine - Savage MkII (tapered barrel), brand new rifle (no break in prior to this shoot), 10 shots @ 50 metres, from a shooting rest, using bulk Winchester DynaPoint. Center-to-center is under 1/2". The same ammo works great in every .22LR I own, which is very convenient.

 

[abms1]

I unfortunately do not have a parallax adjustable scope. I read through the manual, but unfortunately it is a generic one for a bunch of different of different scopes, so it doesn't specify the range for no parallax. I have a strong feeling the scope is set for no parallax at 100yds.

I am going to the range tomorrow and i am going to try some 100yrd shots and see what the results look like. Unfortunately i have not been able to get any other ammunition to try let alone CCI SV. There are winchester dynapoints at walmart and i guess i could try them.

mh434, how old were the dynapoints that you shot out of your mk ii? from what i read online the quality has gone south since winchester changed its manufacturing facility.