What rifle

And they still couldn't shoot straight! LOL

It is Boer folk-lore by now that the tommy's couldn't shoot for ####.
My brother said that he so some tv show that said that when WWI broke out, brittain got some Boer's to come train the brits & canadians here in Canada how to shoot!
 
Agreed.

During the Boer War, Britain refused to re-equip Canada with the Long Lee, which lead to the development of the Ross rifle. Canadian troops in South Africa were given supplied with Long Lees by the British military.
 
There were problems with the initial shipment of Long Lees to South Africa, the front sights were badly centered at the factory causing all accuracy to be lost. This initial lot of rifles had to be sent back and refitted, probably the origin of the bad marksmanship stories. The British had one of the best trained armies in the world and most of the Canadians were either frontiersmen or long time members of the Militia they knew how to shoot!
 
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Only a small number of Lee Metfords were issued in Canada. Long Lee MkI became general issue in 1897.
Second Cdn contigent to SA consisting of 1,2 Batt CMR and C,D and E Batteries RCFA sailed in Jan/Feb 1900.
Small arms issued

Revolvers, Colts 960 (New Service)
Rifles Lee Enfield 722
Bayonets and scabbards LE 722
Snider Sword Bayonet 186
Have list for first contingent somewhere. IIRC they also had LE.
 
There were problems with the initial shipment of Long Lees to South Africa, the front sights were badly centered at the factory causing all accuracy to be lost. This initial lot of rifles had to be sent back and refitted, probably the origin of the bad marksmanship stories.
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Did it take three years, to have them refitted?
The Canadian's may have been good marksmen but their numbers were relatively few, so they might have not been really noticed.
But then again hardly anyone could beat an old Boer and his "mot-mauser"
 
"...might have not been really noticed..." Tell that to the RCD's and the RCR.
Our lads used Lee-Enfield .303 Mk. I's. Not Lee-Metfords. The rifle had been introduced in 1896.
 
Boer seun said:
Did it take three years, to have them refitted?
The Canadian's may have been good marksmen but their numbers were relatively few, so they might have not been really noticed.
But then again hardly anyone could beat an old Boer and his "mot-mauser"
Click to expand...

Pardon my limited knowledge of history of this time, but who won again? :rolleyes:
 
Only because we were outnumbred 7000- 225000.
The death camps the brits send our woman and children too.
And Please do Keep in mind that it was the most costly war brittain fought for a hundred years in Men and material.
And this fighting a peasant army
 
Large quantities, I think about 50,000, MLE's were issued with front sights that were physically centred, but which shot about 18" to one side at 400 yds! The fact that this defect was not caught earlier, I think, must say something about both the testing methods employed (the difference between accuracy and repeatability) and the implication that the value of long range musketry with the emerging smokeless powders had not been fully appreciated by the British army. Their methods and training had not fully adapted from an age where arms were impaired by fouling and you could often not see the enemy from the front lines after the start of the battle.

Not long before the second Boer War the British were still using black powder cartridges. As it had in days of muzzleloaders, black powder made the battlefield visually impenetrable after a few volleys. There was no point in training soldiers to hit targets 1,000 yards off using individual fire when you could rarely see that far. So the tactics of the murkey battlefield still survived to some extent. Men lined up in rows firing volleys in the expected direction of the invisible enemy. Magazine cutoffs were to prevent them getting carried away. Not having fought a European enemy (i.e. technologically competitive culture) for decades, there was no need to do otherwise. It worked.

The tactics and outcomes of early Boer War battles support that. The Boer, living in a rural environment with long range hunting shots common and practical, and armed with smokeless powder Mausers which suited that tactic, could engage the British effectively in the often open terrain long before the british could respond, even if they were ordered to. However, the British adapted to the guerilla style of battle, fixed their rifle problems, and yes, introduced the concept of the concentration camp and came to a short term military victory.

As to who won, I suppose you have to go back to the original goals of the belligerents at the onset of the conflict. The British never got their red route from Cairo to Cape Town, but the Boers did not get their immediate independence guaranteed either. That debate goes on today.

IMHO.
 
Upon demob every soldier was given the opportunity to keep his kit including his rifle ,the state of the art LLE. In addition there appears to have been no discouragement of the returnees from bringing back Boer rifles as souvenirs judging from the number still in circulation.
 
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