What's the word on H&K pistols?

mr00jimbo

mr00jimbo

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I own a Glock and two Sig Sauers, and keep hearing quality "ain't what it used to be" and all that.
But H&K seems to enjoy a stellar reputation for quality across the board and I have yet to hear a difference in quality from US/German production or year of manufacture.
They're damn expensive guns. Are they worth it?

Marlin/Remington/Sig Sauer/Glock/Smith & Wesson/etc. all have rumors of not being made "like they used to", but h&K seems to evade that reputation.

Are they worth their pricetag, especially over a comparable polymer pistol - Glock, M&P, XD, etc.

I think the USP line is handsome firearm, though H&K's alleged discontentment towards civilian gun owners is concerning.
 
I really love my USP9.
I tought of trading it once when I was issued a M&P40 for the single reason of training on my personal time with the same gun I'm issued... changed my mind halfway once I re-handled my HK at home and the rest of the way, no turning back ever again, after the first round off the USP. there is no comparison between the two.
to me the price difference is definitely wort every cent.
 
HK's are reliable and haven't suffered from the quality/reliability issues that Glock and SIG have suffered of late. I think they are fine pistols with idiosyncrasies.

I like my P2000. But the mag release is goofy, the trigger takes some getting used to and the hammer drop button is located in a very odd position.

Give it a Glock trigger, standard mag release and dump the hammer drop button and it would be a world beater. Or just buy a Glock 19 (Gen 3.5 of course).....:D
 
I dig my HK45, although I've only put about 300 rounds through it. I like the paddle mag release as well. I'd agree with the safety/decocker position being awkward though. I can't really put my thumb over it when shooting like a 1911. I had someone tell me I should shoot it like that, but the position of it and my tiny girly hands make it impossible.
 
ColassalEntry said:
Are you guys sure?

the guy at lever arms told me H&K was crap XD (he seriously did tho.)

I love my p2000. lever can suck mah balls.
Click to expand...

I would really struggle with the idea of not murdering anyone who told me something that stupid.

I think Clob nailed it...they're great pistols if you don't mind the HK-specific quirks.

I have never really gotten my head around HK triggers, but there are much better shooters than I am that love them.
 
I had a USP .45 it was quite accurate and well made. I ended up selling it because it was a big gun and didn't fit my hand that well.
 
I must be up to around 7k rounds with my USP, I have yet to see it fail... Or to show any sign of use for that matter.
The main thing people complain about HK (USP anyways) are
A: the mag release - Personally I'd take the HK mag release over anything else, it might not be for everybody but to me it's a better design.
B: the trigger - frankly it never bothered me, simply because it does not seem to affect my accuracy at all, I shoot better than with a Glock or an M&P everytime with my HK.
C: the blocky grip and strong checkering - once again, it works for me. I close my eyes and point, open my eyes and sights are dead on. My hands hurt from the checkering after a long range session but it never slipped from my sweaty hands.
D: the price - well it's like anything else really. I prefer MAC to PC also, same for tobacco, alcohol, cars wtv... The good stuff is more expensive.
E: the lack of parts/service - to this point and I have a feeling for a while still, I've got no use for them, all I ever needed was more mags and more ammo.
 
HK's are always a little 'different' from other manufacturers. Their 3 dot sights are regulated for the bullet to strike right behind the front dot, not top of front sight. The magazine release is kind of different, for me I just use my trigger finger to hit it. Their spare parts tend to be expensive and take a long time to be ordered in. The P2000 and some of the new ones have a self contained recoil spring assembly that apparently requires a special tool to remove the retaining front plate to change spring and buffer. The entire assembly costs around $80 and should be changed out every 25000 rounds or so. Compare this to a Glock where a spring assembly or spring (if you use a metal guide rod) should be changed every 5000 rounds or so but they cost much less.

Despite the quirks I really like the HK's for their reliability and toughness.
 
mr00jimbo said:
...H&K's alleged discontentment towards civilian gun owners is concerning.
Click to expand...

It's a German thing. You should see what German gun owners have to go through just to own a firearm. (Each and every firearm purchase must be justified. An owner might have to sell one before being permitted to buy a replacement. Each and every firearm you own - and have owned - is tracked in a large passport-like document into which the police stamp approvals and cancellations. It really makes Canada look pretty good by comparison.) When your big sales are to governments, civilian sales may be regarded as an annoying hassle (thanks to "gun control", i.e.: red tape restrictions), especially when your customer service department is small.

We can blame the government.
 
H & k

You bet they are worth it !
I've had a UPS for over 10 years AWESOME
Over 15,000 rds through it and flawless

Decently accurate, it has it's own design and feel which takes getting used to just like a Glock or SIG would ....
It's all about what feel good to you and then practicing with it

If I was to get one now it would be the new P 30 L
Longer barrel, adjustable grips and better mag release

The P2000 is also good I found if you have a smaller hand but a smaller slide and mag release

My 2 cents

Denis
 
I had a USP .45, was a really nice gun. I liked the sights and trigger on my G21sf better, but when loading a full mag with the Glock, the slide was hard to rack due to it being so tight with the fully loaded mag. The USP was like butter, very smooth, was like a G17 when you racked the slide, maybe even smoother.

The glock did get better after the mag springs weakened a little.
 
Some refer to them as "expensive Glock", most likely because they're also polymer. Personally never owned one, have looked pretty hard at them but never bought any (yet). Shot them a few time.

Reliable, expensive parts and mags. Not a big fan of the mag release. Not a big fan of the "behind the slide" decocker on certain version.

The DA/SA trigger is decent (I think SIG has the better DA/SA trigger among all manufacturers), I have yet to try the LEM trigger, have heard a lot of good thing about it.

If I'd be buying one, it would be a P30L or a HK45 in V3 DA/SA or V1 LEM (The variants are confusing ;)).
 
my USP .45 is my favourite handgun and IMHO, the best designed handgun of all time. I don't think any other handgun can come close to it.
 
the HK is:

more reliable,
more accurate than a good M&P although a good M&P is sufficiently accurate for anything I do,
much more accurate than an M&P with issues, as some of them have, although I don't follow the line close enough to know which iterations are more likely to have the early-unlocking issue,
more durable,
better trigger than stock M&P,
harder trigger to modify,
worse (IMO) trigger than Apex trigger in M&P,
more expensive,
more expensive magazines,
parts basically unavailable (that may be true of the M&P as well, I am unfamiliar with parts availability on the M&P)

all else being equal I would take a USP or P30 over an M&P...but this being the real world, all else isn't equal. Money is a factor, parts are a factor, etc, etc, etc.

Personally I prefer SA and striker-fired pistols because DA/SA guns screw with my head. I grew up on 1911s and mainly shoot Glocks now and the transition to SA on a DA/SA gun is a mess for me.

The M&P is a striker gun. HKs are either DA/SA, or their weird-ass LEM trigger, which some love, including a lot of people that could probably kill me twice before I got to my holster. But I have been spoiled by nice short 1911 and Glock triggers and would have to retrain to handle the rolling break of an LEM HK, and I just have never needed to move away from Glocks enough to bother with the whole retraining thing. So I would probably shoot an M&P better off the bat, even though mechanically the HKs are typically more accurate.

For the vast, vast majority of shooters, the hardware is extremely unlikely to be the thing that is slowing them down.
 
HK parts are available. I do some research for parts that need to be replaced...every 25K rounds...and order a bunch from Wolverine. Takes almost a year to get them!!!

LEM isn't too bad, the version in the P2000 that was sold by Wolverine is the V1 LEM with super light take up then a 4.5 - 5 lb break that feels like a single action. I have felt the DA/SA trigger on a friend's tuned USP that was amazing. I wish they could have made a P2000 with a DA/SA cocked and locked like the USP. The DA/SA cocked and locked on a P30S is NOT as short or crisp as the one for the USP. I find the USP too blocky for my small hands.

If Glock had made a pistol with a more ergonomically angled grip...for me anyway...that was adjustable for smaller hands I might have gone for that due to ease of obtaining parts. They don't...yet...so I'll stick with HK.
 
Gundoggy said:
HK parts are available. I do some research for parts that need to be replaced...every 25K rounds...and order a bunch from Wolverine. Takes almost a year to get them!!!

LEM isn't too bad, the version in the P2000 that was sold by Wolverine is the V1 LEM with super light take up then a 4.5 - 5 lb break that feels like a single action. I have felt the DA/SA trigger on a friend's tuned USP that was amazing. I wish they could have made a P2000 with a DA/SA cocked and locked like the USP. The DA/SA cocked and locked on a P30S is NOT as short or crisp as the one for the USP. I find the USP too blocky for my small hands.

If Glock had made a pistol with a more ergonomically angled grip...for me anyway...that was adjustable for smaller hands I might have gone for that due to ease of obtaining parts. They don't...yet...so I'll stick with HK.
Click to expand...

this is exactly what I am talking about
 
I ordered a slide release lever from wolverine. I only have 8 more months to wait!:D

I'm actually going to shave the serrations on the new slide release as I keep activating it with my grip, causing the occasional failure of the slide to lock open on an empty mag.
 
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